Cabs with most 'punch'

[Basszilla]

Sealed cab with multiple 10" drivers ideally 6+

Edited February 15, 2022 by Basszilla

[Dan Dare]

2 hours ago, 40hz said:

It's the M-Pulse 600. It sounds absolutely huge and the semi parametric EQ it has, is incredibly useful. I'm a big fan of them. The TC isn't far behind (the BH550 series doesn't have the same goosed ratings the RH series has due to the compression, it's a true 550w).

 

I'm currently running an Epifani UL210, which is wonderfully warm, with a clear midrange (it displays this on both bass heads), so I really dig that tonality a lot, unfortunately getting anything Epifani in the UK is impossible now (aside from 2nd hand obviously).

 

Band wise, it's soul-pop, funk for the covers and Talking Heads-esque indie for my originals.

 

I am very happy with my sound in general and don't want for 'loudness', and I'm sure the punch I get, is respectable to most. I just wondered if there was anything beyond it, as it's my most desired tonal goal I suppose. Sounds like more speakers is the way forward.

 

I've always been interested in the PJB stuff, the C8 looks great. I live 20 mins from Bass Direct, I guess I should just go and demo a load of stuff soon! Just looking for opinions and experiences people have had with cabs and brands, beforehand.

 

A trip to Bass Direct sounds like an excellent, if potentially expensive plan. Have fun.

[Downunderwonder]

11 hours ago, 40hz said:

Compression-wise, I use a Seymour Duncan Studio Bass. I don't crank it in normal playing - usually around 50% as a subtle addition. This is one thing that seems to add some 'thump

You have some strange definition of thump.

[Downunderwonder]

7 hours ago, 40hz said:

Unlike other words used to describe tonal aspects, I actually think punch is a fairly easy one to identify, myself. 🤷‍♂️

 

It's the actual 'thump' and strong sensation of air/volume moved with each note. A noticeable attack to each plucked (or slapped) note. That hit in the back you get, standing in front of a cab.

This is not reconcilable with your other claim of adding thump with use of a compressor.

[Downunderwonder]

Ya can't be calling it thump AND punch either.

[40hz]

4 minutes ago, Downunderwonder said:

Ya can't be calling it thump AND punch either.

Well, I have. Sorry it doesn't reconcile with your version of it.

[Downunderwonder]

The chest cavity getting a tactile push is centered at 80hz. Is that what you are after?

[Marty Forrer]

The punchiest sound I've ever heard was from Aguilar 12s. However, I personally don't like too much punch in my tone. 

[la bam]

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Edited February 16, 2022 by la bam

[la bam]

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Edited February 16, 2022 by la bam

[la bam]

The punchiest (in my definition) cabs I've ever used were markbass traveller 102 cabs (running x2 together vertically). Pretty much the only cab ive had that you could really feel punching you / pushing air.

Edited February 16, 2022 by la bam

[la bam]

This may sound daft or obvious too, but ... the fact the cabs were vertical really made a difference, and I could feel the punch in my chest and back depending on which way i was facing. Thinking about it though, that's because they were at chest level. Theres no point expecting a punch in the chest, when the cabs are at calf level. You'll get a punch in the calf then...

Edited February 16, 2022 by la bam

[40hz]

7 minutes ago, la bam said:

This may sound daft or obvious too, but ... the fact the cabs were vertical really made a difference, and I could feel the punch in my chest and back depending on which way i was facing. Thinking about it though, that's because they were at chest level. Theres no point expecting a punch in the chest, when the cabs are at calf level. You'll get a punch in the calf then...

Haha! I always have my cabs on a stand! 

[Greg Edwards69]

20 hours ago, Happy Jack said:

I used a Dymo labeller to re-title the controls on my amp to be 

 

PUNCH

HEFT

ZING

Sweepable FZZZZT

 

I had a Warwick combo a number of years ago. The low mid and high mid controls were labelled "punch" and "attack"

 

A couple of bass players friends and I once joked about building a fake rack unit with lights, knobs and buttons marked with labels such as ""nice", "oooh", "more" and "that sound"

[Greg Edwards69]

19 hours ago, 40hz said:

Unlike other words used to describe tonal aspects, I actually think punch is a fairly easy one to identify, myself. 🤷‍♂️

 

It's the actual 'thump' and strong sensation of air/volume moved with each note. A noticeable attack to each plucked (or slapped) note. That hit in the back you get, standing in front of a cab.

I'm not sure it is that easy to identify, myself.  The "thump" you mention and noticeable "attack" potentially occupy different parts of the frequency spectrum, and different parts of the note envelope. It could also be a psycho-acoustic phenomenon.

Your studio bass compressor has an attack control, it would be worth experimenting with that to dial in where the initial bite of the note is before the compressor clamps down on it. Although I understand it has a limited range of control. It might be worth considering a different type of compressor.

http://www.ovnilab.com/articles/punchy.shtml

http://www.ovnilab.com/reviews/vicegrip.shtml

 

EQ wise, I think an hpf would be really beneficial. It will allow you to juice up the lows and low mid without getting woolly, mushy and muddy, and tighten everything up. It might also allow you push the cab a bit harder without getting flabby.

 

Also, have you considered a device lie the BackBeat to simulate the feeling of moving air to get that hit in the back you desire?  This could be the psycho-acoustic trick needed to fill out the feeling of punch you may feel is missing from your cabs. 

 

FWIW I always think of Duff's tone on Appetite for Destruction as a great example of punchy bass.  Low end wallop and cutting top end bite and glassy sizzle. Maybe try an hpf to tighten up your low end and get it punchier combined with a low mid boost, slight and narrow mid cut and high mid and treble boost to bring out the attack even more.

Edited February 16, 2022 by Greg Edwards69

[Lozz196]

Yep seems to me that bass amplification in general now has lows so low that they seem to bypass that punch in the chest feeling. Duffs sound is a great example, it doesn’t sound really bassy but I bet it packs a wallop up close.

[la bam]

1 minute ago, Lozz196 said:

Yep seems to me that bass amplification in general now has lows so low that they seem to bypass that punch in the chest feeling. Duffs sound is a great example, it doesn’t sound really bassy but I bet it packs a wallop up close.

 

Agreed. I've definitely gone more punchy and got a more powerful bass sound now I've started to cut the real low end.

[Greg Edwards69]

On 16/02/2022 at 12:15, Lozz196 said:

Yep seems to me that bass amplification in general now has lows so low that they seem to bypass that punch in the chest feeling. Duffs sound is a great example, it doesn’t sound really bassy but I bet it packs a wallop up close.

Yep. Discovering hpfs and first, second, third etc order harmonics was the lightbulb moment for me.  I had really struggled with amp eq in the past, and odd frequency choices (I really couldn't get on with my old markbass' 40hz bass and 360hz low mid).

 

Realising that I didn't need to reproduce the lowest note fundamentals and that removing the lowest frequencies could improve my overall tone was game changing. I've been known to push it up as far as 80-90hz in some rooms without losing the low end "punch" to cut through the mix.  It certainly makes for a nicer sounding room too!

 

IMO, hpf should come as standard on every bass amp head.

Edited February 28, 2022 by Greg Edwards69

[40hz]

12 minutes ago, Greg Edwards69 said:

I'm not sure it is that easy to identify, myself.  The "thump" you mention and noticeable "attack" potentially occupy different parts of the frequency spectrum, and different parts of the note envelope. It could also be a psycho-acoustic phenomenon.

Your studio bass compressor has an attack control, it would be worth experimenting with that to dial in where the initial bite of the note is before the compressor clamps down on it. Although I understand it has a limited range of control. It might be worth considering a different type of compressor.

http://www.ovnilab.com/articles/punchy.shtml

http://www.ovnilab.com/reviews/vicegrip.shtml

 

EQ wise, I think an hpf would be really beneficial. It will allow you to juice up the lows and low mid without getting woolly, mushy and muddy, and tighten everything up. It might also allow you push the cab a bit harder without getting flabby.

 

Also, have you considered a device lie the BackBeat to simulate the feeling of moving air to get that hit in the back you desire?  This could be the psycho-acoustic trick needed to fill out the feeling of punch you may feel is missing from your cabs. 

 

FWIW I always think of Duff's tone on Appetite for Destruction as a great example of punchy bass.  Low end wallop and cutting top end bite and glassy sizzle. Maybe try an hpf to tighten up your low end and get it punchier combined with a low mid boost, slight and narrow mid cut and high mid and treble boost to bring out the attack even more.

HPF is a seriously good shout. Thanks for the advice!

[Dan Dare]

4 hours ago, la bam said:

The punchiest (in my definition) cabs I've ever used were markbass traveller 102 cabs (running x2 together vertically). Pretty much the only cab ive had that you could really feel punching you / pushing air.

 

I second that. I saw a band playing in a local pub. The bassist had the MB 2x10 combo. The guitar players were using Boogies, so were not exactly quiet. You could feel the bass in your chest and he wasn't going through the PA. I was impressed.

[NAS Bass]

My Berg NV215 can really rattle my sternum. There can be a lot of thud when its hit hard. 

[grenadillabama]

On 15/02/2022 at 06:57, casapete said:

Think you’re on the right track with the idea of six or eight tens. Barefaced and Markbass do some which aren’t crazy weight wise amongst others. My old SVT 810 rig was the punchiest rig I’ve ever used, been chasing that sound with smaller stuff for years but to no avail. 😕

I have had a few SVT cabinets and I know what you mean . My Ashdown ABM 610 seems to get that punch. Maybe an Ashdown Rootmaster 610 would be good- if you can move it.

[bigjimmyc]

If I recall, the manufacturer which promoted their "punch" most was Hartke. Not everyone's cup of tea, but may be the sound you're looking for.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

On 15/02/2022 at 19:13, Downunderwonder said:

The chest cavity getting a tactile push is centered at 80hz. Is that what you are after?

Maybe. The problem when you use non-specific subjective terms is that there's no real definition, and therefore no agreement, on what it means. That greatly increases the difficulty of realizing whatever it is that you're trying to get.