Toxic Masculinity

[Boodang]

So, we have a swear filter on BC, should we have a 'misogyny' filter as well?

 

Now, just taking this as an example, not to pick on anyone but just because it's a recently posted example (not by me!), a joke about carrying a dustpan and brush to gigs in case your female band members, due to their inherent bad driving abilities I'm assuming, need to sweep up debris from accidents they've had in the car park. 

Is there a place for this on BC, or is this just 'banter' (groan!), or am I being too sensitive. Do you find this joke funny or is this a stereotyping sexist trope that should have died out with Bernard Manning, or are you not that offended? 

Not wanting to have a go at anyone in particular but just genuinely interested to see how people feel about this.

[wateroftyne]

Just now, Boodang said:

So, we have a swear filter on BC, should we have a 'misogyny' filter as well?

 

Now, just taking this as an example, not to pick on anyone but just because it's a recently posted example (not by me!), a joke about carrying a dustpan and brush to gigs in case your female band members, due to their inherent bad driving abilities I'm assuming, need to sweep up debris from accidents they've had in the car park. 

Is there a place for this on BC, or is this just 'banter' (groan!), or am I being too sensitive. Do you find this joke funny or is this a stereotyping sexist trope that should have died out with Bernard Manning, or are you not that offended? 

Not wanting to have a go at anyone in particular but just genuinely interested to see how people feel about this.

 

If you're offended, hit the report button.

Edited March 10, 2022 by wateroftyne

[peteb]

 

The thing is that this was a slightly clumsy joke about a real life incident that had become a running joke between the guy who posted it and a girl who is a member of the band he plays in. 

 

She doesn't seem to have been offended by it, so we just have somebody (presumably a bloke) getting offended on her behalf. There are more important things to worry about these days. 

 

[Newfoundfreedom]

[Silvia Bluejay]

I tend to find most of such banter extremely tedious, because I'm old and I was alive and in my teens in the 1970s, so nothing much offends me any more. This kind of stuff does occasionally still p!ss me off, however.

I've said this before - try imagining a similar situation to that described by the 'joke' or 'banter', and replace the female with a black person or a gay person, and see if telling or laughing at such 'joke' still sounds acceptable to your ears. Most of the times it won't.

[Bolo]

15 minutes ago, Newfoundfreedom said:

No. Just behave. 

[Lozz196]

It doesn’t offend me, and it wouldn’t bother me if it were the other way round, but then I’ve not had years of people taking the pee out of me because of my gender. Maybe if I had it would be different.

[Geek99]

I think it’s a bit 1972…and as the father of two daughters, more than a bit unnecessary; I did think we’d moved on from this kind of comment 

[spencer.b]

29 minutes ago, Newfoundfreedom said:

But you're seemingly offended by someone being offended by a misogynistic comment?

[Saul Panzer]

Not offended by that kind of humour or any other, if I find something funny I treat myself to a laugh and move on with my day, if I don't find it funny I skip the laugh and still move on with my day.
I'm not so tender that I feel the need to care about the ism's on the internet.

[Boodang]

59 minutes ago, peteb said:

 

The thing is that this was a slightly clumsy joke about a real life incident that had become a running joke between the guy who posted it and a girl who is a member of the band he plays in. 

 

She doesn't seem to have been offended by it, so we just have somebody (presumably a bloke) getting offended on her behalf. There are more important things to worry about these days. 

 

I think the key phrase is clumsy... you knew the background, we didn't. I used it as an example, sorry for that, but every now and then very 20th century attitudes get posted up as if it's 'rock 'n roll' so therefore acceptable today. Yes, there's plenty of things to worry about, some would argue more so, but you don't just worry about the worst thing in the world and not about anything else.

[Boodang]

1 hour ago, peteb said:

 

The thing is that this was a slightly clumsy joke about a real life incident that had become a running joke between the guy who posted it and a girl who is a member of the band he plays in. 

 

She doesn't seem to have been offended by it, so we just have somebody (presumably a bloke) getting offended on her behalf. There are more important things to worry about these days. 

 

PS meant to say, reading the background real life story to the, clumsy, joke makes a lot more sense and puts a completely different spin on it, so again, apologies for using it as an example but without any context the original comment could only be taken one way. 

But my reasons for starting the thread still stand and mostly it's not be being offended on someone else's behalf so much as offended by certain attitudes which if they become all pervasive are toxic.

Interestingly, last year found myself working in an environment where we all lived and worked in a closed compound for extensive periods. There were 2 main factions, the older drinking crowd with very old fashioned attitudes and language, and the younger crowd which still liked a drink but who's attitudes were very modern and refreshing. I'm young at heart but not in body, but I have to say that the older crowd were just tedious and the 'I'm too old to change my ways' attitude very frustrating. 

[fleabag]

3 hours ago, Saul Panzer said:

Not offended by that kind of humour or any other, if I find something funny I treat myself to a laugh and move on with my day, if I don't find it funny I skip the laugh and still move on with my day.
I'm not so tender that I feel the need to care about the ism's on the internet.

 

Ditto.

[jimmyb625]

I'm not really offended by jokes such as that, I just think they're a bit rubbish and "easy". 

 

[Burns-bass]

6 hours ago, Geek99 said:

I think it’s a bit 1972…and as the father of two daughters, more than a bit unnecessary; I did think we’d moved on from this kind of comment 

You don’t need to be the father of daughters to understand misogyny or the husband of a refugee to recognise prejudice (but it helps)

[Doctor J]

It was more of an outdated and cringeworthy comment than anything else, I thought, even when the context was provided later, but there's definitely still an undercurrent of that attitude haunting the place, at times. It's seldom a thread about a female bassist escapes without some comments on their appearance, for example. Yeah, just a bit 70's.

[Burns-bass]

6 hours ago, Saul Panzer said:

Not offended by that kind of humour or any other, if I find something funny I treat myself to a laugh and move on with my day, if I don't find it funny I skip the laugh and still move on with my day.
I'm not so tender that I feel the need to care about the ism's on the internet.

The problem is that you’re unlikely to be a marginalised group the target of humour. If someone came on here and the butt of every joke was a balding, post-50 year old man who is slightly overweight and buys loads of gear they can’t play very well then you may feel different. 
 

(I’m making a crass generalisation because that’s how this works…)
 

Call it empathy, emotional intelligence or simply not being a Richard and you’ll be fine. 

Edited March 11, 2022 by Burns-bass

[Munurmunuh]

I wish bald men would stop thinking they're in a position to laugh at anything about anyone, nature has literally put a sign on the top of them reading this one's done. 

[Tokalo]

1 hour ago, Burns-bass said:

a balding, post-50 year old man who is slightly overweight and buys loads of gear they can’t play very well

That’s me!

I’ve found throughout this forum that members who fit this archetype are always ready to laugh at themselves.
 

Some of those things I can’t change about myself, but for what I can (overspending and playing bass) I find the underlying criticism implied within the humour to be a great motivator.

[Newfoundfreedom]

8 hours ago, spencer.b said:

But you're seemingly offended by someone being offended by a misogynistic comment?

 

I'm not in the least bit offended. Just extremely bored with people who seemingly spend their entire lives looking around for something to be offended by, so they can whine about it on the internet. 

 

If you want to be offended, put down your phone, turn off your computer, and look out of the window. 

 

Seriously! There's far more important things happening in the world. 

[Silvia Bluejay]

11 minutes ago, Newfoundfreedom said:

 

Seriously! There's far more important things happening in the world. 

Does the war in Ukraine imply we should forget about, say, violence in the street or the climate emergency? Or anything else that we find intolerable and worth fighting against? Do we only have space in our brain for being appalled at a limited number of unsettling, unfair or downright horrible happenings? If that's the case, could we please have a list of currently acceptable topics to be appalled by?

Edited March 11, 2022 by Silvia Bluejay

[Barking Spiders]

I'm of Italian and Austrian parentage and raised in Liverpool. Over my 52 years I've had people sieg heil me, call me a Nazi (I have a German surname), been called a spic/wop/kraut/nazi etc and heard every scouser joke under the sun. Am I bovvered though? Haven't been for many decades. While sexist banter/jokes are not particularly funny in themselves, I'd say to anyone to just let it wash over.

[Dood]

On a related note, I wonder, in an anonymous poll, how many female members have experienced sexist content on this forum including that dressed up as "banter". I guess we won't know as they've probably just left. 

[Welshbassist]

Personally I tend to avoid jokes based on stereotypes. They have a tendency to be interpreted in quite wildly different ways, and can often be quite a lazy and unfunny form of humour in my view anyway.

 

It can be difficult to read the intentions of the author - from a gentle friendly ribbing to using humour some using to cover genuine prejudice. I appreciate most of us are sound on here but the very nature of online forums make mean many assume the worse so they are more trouble than they are worth in my view.

 

On a side note, the matter at hand doesn't seem to have much to do with the concept of toxic masculinity.

[cetera]

I always find it best to understand 'context' and the relationship of 'those concerned' before heading off into rant territory and being offended on one of their behalfs....