A Fretless That 'Digs'.....

[UamVar]

Hello All

 

I wonder if I could seek some advice.  I am a beginner player, and have been playing a fretted bass on and off for a while, but for some reason I never really keep up the practice.  I could be wrong, but I feel I may 'connect' more with the instrument if it was fretless and as a result possibly want to play it more - I feel a bit of a disconnect pressing metal strings on metal frets for some reason.  Anyway, it's my 50th birthday coming up, and I have decided to buy a 4 string fretless.  The thing is, I am not looking for that nice soft 'mwaah' sound that people always seem to talk about whenever fretless is mentioned.  Ideally I would like something that produces a 'strong' clean sound in the lower register - which to me is something like the neck pickup on a Fender Jazz (fretted version).  

 

My apologies if any of the statements/ queries above sound ignorant - I am a knowledgless learner!  I am mainly interested in playing rock/ metal, budget is upto around £1K, I'd like a passive setting but this is not a deal breaker.  Lined or unlined fretboard considered, I can easily add guides if necessary.

 

Can anyone suggest something suitable?  New or second hand I don't mind.  Thank you.

[mep]

My Aria Pro 2 fretless sounds like it fits your bill. Worth looking out for one?

[Bunion]

Not sure if that 1k + your bass to PX but for what you want I’d say save a little more and try and find a Second hand Tony Franklin signature Bass those things are beasts and play phenomenal. 

 

Edited April 15, 2022 by Bunion

[ezbass]

A higher action limits the amount of mwah, as does a technique that avoids too many slides and vibrato.

[Misdee]

Why not try a fretless Jazz Bass of some description?

[40hz]

Get a fretless neck made by Status (if your existing bass is a J/P or Musicman).

 

I can vouch for them. The fretless Status neck I have for my USA SUB is *phenomenal*. Graphite necks 'mwah' harder than anything.

Edited April 16, 2022 by 40hz

[ezbass]

Why not try something affordable to see if it’s a viable prospect? I’ve had my eye on this, but I really don’t ‘need’ it.

https://www.guitarguitar.co.uk/product/px220205380992006--squier-2014-fretless-vintage-modified-precision-bass-3-colour

[Bassassin]

17 hours ago, Misdee said:

Why not try a fretless Jazz Bass of some description?

There's a lot of love for Sire MM V7s around these parts:

https://www.thomann.de/gb/marcus_miller_v7_alder_4_fl_bmr_2nd_gen.htm

 

I do like mine to mwaah (for me, that's sort of the point!) but the active EQ (switchable) means it's capable of more aggressive tones & would probably do what you want. Mine's a 1st gen and the current ones are apparently even better.

 

 

Also just remembered, there's a 1980 Ibanez RS940 Roadster fretless in the Basses For Sale section - I have the fretted version of the same bass (RS924) and these can be very aggressive sounding, thanks to a very hot J pickup, mine reads about 12.5k. Also feature a switchable active EQ. Could be worth a look.

 

 

[Paolo85]

I am not an expert so others will give you better advice. But I have a cort B4fl and while it does not sound like a jazz I have a feeling it may be a step in the right direction

https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/BRS6C

 

Here is a clip of the neck pickup, not from me but from a guy that was complaining that it does not mwah in another forum. He is trying to mwah, but as you can hear, if you do not slide the sound is fairly "normal" and full. 

(Edit: note that in the clup the guy progressively moves his right hand from the neck to the bridge, so you progressively hear a less full, more honky sound)

 

Here is same bass, same pickup, but in active mode (I believe without touching the EQ)
https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/ppKQq

 

I believe for your budget you can do better (the Cort B4 sounds a bit "dead in active mode and in passive you do not have a tone control). But it has two things that you may want to explore for a "strong clean sound in the lower register": an uncoated fretboard, which I believe reduces the mwah, and a humbucker pickup at the neck

 

 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Paolo85

[Burns-bass]

I’d recommend a £200 Squier VM Jazz fretless or a Sire fretless.

 

You can play it and enjoy learning safe in the knowledge that if it doesn’t work out you’d get every penny of your money back.

 

[velvetkevorkian]

Is "mwah" not mostly a technique thing? Certain instruments may be more conducive to it but if you play with less vibrato you should be able to dial it back on any fretless 🤷‍♀️

[Dad3353]

Our Youngest wanted to play bass, but insisted on wanting a 5-string (so my Hofners were not suitable...). OK, we got him the least-expensive Cort, on which he started to learn, from videos and books. Meanwhile, Our Eldest wanted to surprise me for a birthday, and imported a 6-string fretless, knowing I had always wanted to try that style. Out of luck, though, as Our Youngest picked it up, and has not released it yet (this was several years ago now...). As luck would have it, I'm the drummer in our band, so it was les of a loss (I do get to play it on rare occasions...).
The point of all this..? To hear our band, no-one would know that it's a 6-string fretless. It plays (under Our Youngest's fingers...) exactly like any other bass, for a wide repertoire of modern pop-rock songs, from Pink Floyd, Rage Against The machine, R.E.M., Radiohead, Noir Désir, Alain Bashung, DeUS, System Of A Down and much more. 

Here's a clip from a concert a few years ago now (2013, Already..? Wow..!). A fretless bass can be played as any other bass, if you want to...

 

 

Edited April 17, 2022 by Dad3353

[fleabag]

On 17/04/2022 at 11:55, velvetkevorkian said:

Is "mwah" not mostly a technique thing? Certain instruments may be more conducive to it but if you play with less vibrato you should be able to dial it back on any fretless 🤷‍♀️

 

It starts with the string " touching " the fretboard. Not enough to choke the string though, and then players fingers do the rest, so it's really a combination.  So yes, i'd agree with you in the most part that a player can dial it back.  Actually, some fretlesses dont sound like a fretless and some do. 

 

If the player doesnt " force " the mwah with technique with such fretlesses, then one wouldn't know it was a fretless. Some  you can tell its a fretless just plucking open strings.

[martthebass]

Like above, it's a technique thing.  If you don't want the mwaaaah then raise the action a touch and play it like a normal fretted and you'll be there.  I had a fretless Stingray set up this way and in the mix it sounded little different to a fretted bass, just a bit less zing and attack.

[ezbass]

A great example of a fretless player who you’d be hard put to notice that a fretless is being used (yes you can tell on certain songs, but that’s by design) is Boz Burrell, especially on the first Bad Co album. 

[spyder]

Me playing a 6 string fretless P bass made by Shuker.

Played just like a fretted bass if the action was above 2mm.

 

[lownote]

Fretless is not hard to learn.  Even unlined, which I prefer.  Just approach it without thinking you should be scared and you'll be fine in just a few days.  Try and buy one with simple side dots on the G, A, B etc, notes; lined fretless with conventional fretted markings off the note positions witll confuse you. I would strongly recommend the Revelation unlined P bass, available from Bass Gallery in London.  £199 new, so you can see if you like fretless very cheaply.  I wouldn't be too fussed about the mwah sound.  It becomes irrtating very quickly.   It can be removed by raising the relief and action slightly, after which the bass plays just a normal bass.

 

Further up your budget you could look at the Ibanez Portamento (4 or 5 string), with unlined but with stub sidelines around £800, or lined there's loads of choce £350-750 in the Sire range 

Edited April 19, 2022 by lownote

[dclaassen]

Agree with all of the above, except I would certainly get a lined fretless as a starter. You can experiment with pressure and attack/release to get the sound you want. You can also play with the strength and position of your plucking hand to get more or less attack. I would certainly go with an active bass. I use my passive fretless exclusively to sound like a fretless, or even to mimic as much as possible an upright bass. 

Edited April 19, 2022 by dclaassen

[Greg Edwards69]

IME the biggest technique factor in bringing out the mwah, (or restricting it in this case) is how you press the strings down on the finger board. Using the pad of the fingers brings out the mwah more than finger tips. 

[fleabag]

Good point. Also playing nearer the bridge reduces the effect a bit

[UamVar]

Well everybody, thank you for all the helpful replies, I consider myself better educated now!

 

And a special thank you to Bassassin - would you believe I have just purchased the Ibanez Roadster you kindly sent the link for!  

 

I am going to get it fixed up a bit and probably strip the body - will post a pic when done.

 

Mep - Yes I looked at an Aria Pro as well, it was way more expensive, but sounded great, from what I could gather through YouTube anyway.

[Paolo85]

20 minutes ago, UamVar said:

 

And a special thank you to Bassassin - would you believe I have just purchased the Ibanez Roadster you kindly sent the link for!  

 

 

Great choice! I was very very close to making an offer a while ago. I really need a 5-string more that a 4 string but for what I have heard of the sound of these Roadster, they are magnific

[Bassassin]

15 hours ago, UamVar said:

And a special thank you to Bassassin - would you believe I have just purchased the Ibanez Roadster you kindly sent the link for!  

 

I am going to get it fixed up a bit and probably strip the body - will post a pic when done.

 

Happy to help! These are popular basses around these parts (which is why I was surprised it hung around as long as it did), if you do a search there are a few different threads about them. Up to you if you strip it, but these are pretty rare vintage basses these days, and that would affect resale value in the future.

 

I would definitely do something with the fingerboard though, maybe take it back to the wood & epoxy it. With the sound you're looking for, a finish that would handle roundwounds without too much damage would be worth thinking about.

Edited April 21, 2022 by Bassassin

[JPJ]

From my experience on this, there are a lot of factors to get growl and or mwah. I currently have two fretless basses and they are both very different beasts. My old faithful Ibanez Roadstar from the early '80s has an unlined maple board and my newer early 00's Overwater has an ebony board. Both basses are active (two band on the Ibanez, 3 band on the Overwater) and are strung with flat wound strings. 

Both basses exhibit mwah, although the Overwater is certainly darker and softer sounding. That said, a nice bump up in the mids and she growls like a tiger. The Ibanez mwah is much more 'in your face' and can actually become over powering and you do not need much vibrato to make it sound very chorus like but its harder to make her growl, you have to really dig in and it becomes tiring after even a short while. 

So I guess my conclusion is its horses for courses and you need to try both fingerboard materials to decide which one suits your style of playing.