Class D - diabolical

[Lowend soldier]

2 minutes ago, Rich said:

Hah I don't have the greatest or least achey back in the world and lightweight kit has been a revelation for me - my days of 100lb cabs and 60lb amps are gone for good - but if you're happy with the casual sexism of calling me a "girl" you carry on. 

If you was humping at the time and birth of these, then you,ll understand my banter sir.

This is "rock n roll" is it not or did I take a wrong turn 😉🤣

[alexa3020]

I know this thread is about class d vs a/b, but does lightweight (neo) cab vs heavy cab play a part in this as well. I think it’s less of a factor personally, but interested to get everyone’s take - particularly as I’m still lugging heavier cabs around

[Sparky Mark]

5 minutes ago, alexa3020 said:

I know this thread is about class d vs a/b, but does lightweight (neo) cab vs heavy cab play a part in this as well. I think it’s less of a factor personally, but interested to get everyone’s take - particularly as I’m still lugging heavier cabs around

[andy67]

10 minutes ago, alexa3020 said:

I know this thread is about class d vs a/b, but does lightweight (neo) cab vs heavy cab play a part in this as well. I think it’s less of a factor personally, but interested to get everyone’s take - particularly as I’m still lugging heavier cabs around

 

Nothing will ever beat my former Ampeg CL and 8x10e cab! The thunder was instant and awesome however, all good things come to an end. The weight and size factor was problematic on a few fronts for me. No permanent practice room nor storage capability because I live in a flat, and living in a flat comes with its own problems re noise. So had to move it on unfortunately. I do have a 3pro and PF50T of which are both great but I took a chance on the Bugera and haven't looked back since. I have a Hartke AK410 & HX112 that are great and are not too bad for lugging around if I need to. Quite happy with the light weight gear I have as is easy to move, store and transport. I love the tone and power of the Bugera and it performs well with all the cabs I have and others I've plugged it into.

Edited July 2, 2022 by andy67

[Lowend soldier]

6 minutes ago, alexa3020 said:

I know this thread is about class d vs a/b, but does lightweight (neo) cab vs heavy cab play a part in this as well. I think it’s less of a factor personally, but interested to get everyone’s take - particularly as I’m still lugging heavier cabs around

Folded horns all the way 🤣

[Rich]

42 minutes ago, Lowend soldier said:

If you was humping at the time and birth of these, then you,ll understand my banter sir.

This is "rock n roll" is it not or did I take a wrong turn 😉🤣

 

Oh I see, "banter". Well that makes it perfectly ok then. 🙄🙄🙄

 

Yes I was 'humping' at the birth of these, I've been doing this nonsense since the early 80s. I don't recall anyone being "girls" about shifting their gear, although many was the late night load-out that I wished my 4x10s didn't weigh as much as a car.

[Lowend soldier]

Tbf sir, too some of us, the mere mention of lighter gear sets off some of our,  big girls blouse meters 😉🤣

On a serious note of course age and health and convenience are a big factor. The later is subjective too the individual. Weve all certainly been bogged down by the constant 2/3am unloads. I hear that. 

[Ed_S]

57 minutes ago, Lowend soldier said:

Thank you for your ver valid opinion. My needs are not important to you as you say. And I cant question your preference or reasoning in using your set up. Its 100% correct and personal too you. 

Again I'm not claiming anything other than at home when I push the volume on my class d heads. Personally,I feel I lose shape in a way my other heads dont. Fox said it better above. It's a feeling/vibrational thing. Others obviously get that aswell. 

Its certainly not a full on attack of anyone employing a class d head on the battlefield as it's been perceived by many tbf.

 

Nah, I get that totally and I don't feel in any way attacked for my choices - nor should you! If the kit you use allows you to feel good, so your recording / rehearsal / gig connects and comes across with some bounce in it, then that's all that matters regardless of which personal criteria got satisfied to let you feel that way.

[agedhorse]

6 hours ago, alexa3020 said:

I know this thread is about class d vs a/b, but does lightweight (neo) cab vs heavy cab play a part in this as well. I think it’s less of a factor personally, but interested to get everyone’s take - particularly as I’m still lugging heavier cabs around

Tastes in speakers and speaker voicing certainly have changed. What we) as designers) can do with Neo drivers is something we had been wishing for decades ago. This is a better example of player’s constantly asking for something that designers were unable to deliver until the new technology came about.

[andy67]

1 hour ago, agedhorse said:

Tastes in speakers and speaker voicing certainly have changed. What we) as designers) can do with Neo drivers is something we had been wishing for decades ago. This is a better example of player’s constantly asking for something that designers were unable to deliver until the new technology came about.

I like Eminence and Celestian speakers but I really like the HD speakers Hartke put in their cabs, the paper and aluminium neodymiums. They have lots of presence and punch just as I like it. AH please don't burst my bubble by saying they are Chinese pap lol 😮  

[FinnDave]

9 hours ago, Lowend soldier said:

Your comment got me thinking of my times sat out front in the crowd and I,m off too start the new BC debate/free for all on how much better a backline of folded horn cabs are better than going through a pa 🤔😉😂😂😂  Hows the classic going sir....

The Classic is going just fine - set of Rotosound flats and it sounds gorgeous. Played a US Standard P today (GHS flats) and that was just right for the Grateful Dead set we played at a Deadhead festival in the Cotswolds. 

Used my ABM 500/2x10 combo - sounded wonderful on stage, was DI'd and mic'd through the PA.

[tauzero]

12 hours ago, Lowend soldier said:

Tbf sir, too some of us, the mere mention of lighter gear sets off some of our,  big girls blouse meters 😉🤣

On a serious note of course age and health and convenience are a big factor. The later is subjective too the individual. Weve all certainly been bogged down by the constant 2/3am unloads. I hear that. 

 

Coming on for twenty years ago, I had a Trace Elliot 4x10 combo. It was, er, very heavy, so heavy that I think one of the girls I know (she was a 2m ex-blacksmith before the operation) would have had problems with it. I later finished up with a Tecamp Puma 900 and Barefaced BB2, which had the advantages not only of being lighter than the Trace but sounding better too. I've only played one gig with the current combo, a GR Bass carbon fibre combo at 9.5kg for 500W, so I have yet to confirm that the sound is as good but it was promising.

[FinnDave]

My ABM combos are supposed to weigh about 35-40 kg but I reckon they're snacking between gigs as I am sure they're putting weight on!

[alexa3020]

There’s a trace Elliot ah1200  at my practice room. That thing has it’s own gravitational pull. I’d hate to drag that to any gig!

Most A/B heads are fairly light though - an Abm 600 is around 12kg, handbox r400 is even lighter I think and as much power as anyone would need. If you’re driving to a gig, I don’t see it as too much of a hardship to use a class a/b head if that’s what you prefer.

 

 

 

[silverfoxnik]

1 hour ago, alexa3020 said:

There’s a trace Elliot ah1200  at my practice room. That thing has it’s own gravitational pull. I’d hate to drag that to any gig!

Most A/B heads are fairly light though - an Abm 600 is around 12kg, handbox r400 is even lighter I think and as much power as anyone would need. If you’re driving to a gig, I don’t see it as too much of a hardship to use a class a/b head if that’s what you prefer.

 

 

 

Yep - the Handbox R400 is a dream.. 

[LennyP]

To begin, I will say that I've been gigging with Markbass for a good few years now and have been very happy with both the LMII in combo and head format. 

Recently though, I picked up a Fender Pro 800 as an addition. This thing is insane! The volume and thump is way more than I ever remember with my heavy old iron amps! At 61 years old now, lightweight is the order of the day  but that Fender will definitely make it to the odd gig! 

Couldn't resist opening it up. It weighs a metric tonne. 😁

[Marty Forrer]

There's one of those for sale here at the moment. I'd look at it, but the seller won't ship it. Plus I need another amp like a hole in the head.

[Sparky Mark]

2 hours ago, LennyP said:

To begin, I will say that I've been gigging with Markbass for a good few years now and have been very happy with both the LMII in combo and head format. 

Recently though, I picked up a Fender Pro 800 as an addition. This thing is insane! The volume and thump is way more than I ever remember with my heavy old iron amps! At 61 years old now, lightweight is the order of the day  but that Fender will definitely make it to the odd gig! 

Couldn't resist opening it up. It weighs a metric tonne. 😁

The LMII is also class AB, not class D 

[msb]

I’m fine with lightweight cabs and Class D heads. And I’ve had them repaired and serviced. I have a GenzBenz Streamliner so when I realized agedhorse was still servicing them it was a no brainer. Off it went to California. It’s now like a brand new amp . My main practice amp is a tiny GK MB200 , and it sees heavy use daily. It developed the famous “ pink ring of doom” and was seen by a qualified technician. The fan had stopped working and the ICE power module had to be replaced , it was fixed , and is back to rigorous use. Class D heads can be serviced. My main gig amp is a Bergantino , I’ve yet to find any issues or problems. However should anything happen I’d call Bergantino , their customer support is legend. The Berg and Liner are completely different amps. The Liner has a three tube pre and can do that warm tube thing , the Forte is a stripped down clean transparent slam. I enjoy the differences. I like them both.

I recently picked up an SWR Headlite for a song on the local kijiji buy & sell. The amp is clean , everything works just as it should , and I’m aware some parts are no longer available , so when it eventually goes it might be gone. I was quite aware of that when I bought it. For the time being it fires up and sounds just as it should. I expect years of future use.
I gig every weekend , and use Bergantino HDN cabs. Never had a better stage sound , I smile every time I lift one. 
I’m fine with D heads and lightweight cabs. But I have friends that run multiple tube heads and big rigs and swear by them. To each their own. I’m fine with that too , but I’m thankful to be using smaller and lighter gear. I think my back is too.

[LennyP]

2 hours ago, Sparky Mark said:

The LMII is also class AB, not class D 

I knew that and was careful not to call it Class D. My comparison is Lightweight (SMPS) v Old School transformer heavy. I use the Markbass F1 head also which I believe is Class D? I could be wrong. I had used many older heavy transformer heads over the years but the sheer power of the Fender is incredible. 

[Sparky Mark]

14 hours ago, LennyP said:

I knew that and was careful not to call it Class D. My comparison is Lightweight (SMPS) v Old School transformer heavy. I use the Markbass F1 head also which I believe is Class D? I could be wrong. I had used many older heavy transformer heads over the years but the sheer power of the Fender is incredible. 

Ah, I see. I was thrown by you referencing a class AB Markbass head alongside the Fender sled when this thread is more about class D comparisons. I willl say that I prefer my lightweight class AB amps to the class D that I've owned (Markbass F500 being one of them). The F1 is indeed class D.

Edited September 1, 2022 by Sparky Mark