Anyone have arthritis?

[NasalFloss]

Hi all,

 

I was recently diagnosed with osteoarthrosis in the ball joint of my thumb in both hands after an x-ray.  I figured for years that I had just strained them because I'm double jointed in all my fingers (generally bendy all over too) and that I just wasn't giving it time to heal with one thing and another.  I would go for stretches with no problems and out of nowhere I would pick something up the wrong way and get a bolt of pain.  I'm not even talking about anything heavy; it's happened with bowls, mugs, controllers etc.

 

Recently this seems to have crept into the index, middle and ring finger of my right hand in the middle joint of all the same fingers and leaves my hand in a slightly 'scooped' position when it's totally relaxed and I have to put a tiny bit of effort to keep them straight.  I'm only 38 and have been experiencing thumb pain since about 30.

 

I guess my questions are, how old were you when you were diagnosed, did it affect your playing, did you have to modify your technique and how did it affect your life in general?

 

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't frightened about it getting to the point where I can't play any more.  My doctor is useless as well - he's told me to take ibuprofen and that there's nothing he can prescribe me that will do a better job!  I'm not GP but there's more effective pain relief than ibuprofen!  I'm actually considering moving practices as I feel that I've been fobbed off and they just don't care.

 

Anyway, enough of my moaning.  I just wanted to get it off my chest mainly, but any advice or experiences you guys have had would help.  After all, you probably wouldn't be on the forum if you ddin't play any more, although even I've been known to be wrong occasionally 😄 

 

Chris

[Staggering on]

Re ibuprofen:

A doctor who checked me over when I had some nasty arthritis pain in my arms and hands from several things including working as a farrier for 27 years and playing double bass suggested that I should take ibuprofen. I was surprised when she said to take 4  500 mg tablets a day and said I thought that was a lot but she told me that some people take more than that daily for arthritis. I tried it for several months and was amazed at how much it helped, I don't know exactly what it did but the pain has pretty much disappeared and I stopped taking them. Now if I am a bit sore I take a couple a day for a week or so and it clears things up.

I realize that ibuprofen is for pain and not a medication that cures things but it seems to have worked very well for me. I wonder what dosage your doctor suggested, I know 3000mg a day is used by some arthritis sufferers so maybe you should try 1000 or 2000mg per day, ask your doctor if that's OK.

Please note that I am not trying to be a doctor here, just describing what worked for me.

Good luck! 

 

Edited May 21, 2022 by Staggering on

[Munurmunuh]

7 hours ago, NasalFloss said:

take ibuprofen

 

Given the long term effects of ibuprofen usage, this is dubious advice.

[zbd1960]

I think I'd be looking for a second opinion from another GP that's more sympathetic.

[FinnDave]

I was under the impression that Ibuprofen was more for reducing swelling than pain relief, but I think it was a doctor in Finland who told me that, so I could well have misunderstood.. 

One of my bands has a singer who is a GP, I'll ask her when I next see her (this weekend is the other band).

[Mister RLP]

Thankfully not in hands yet but I have really bad arthritis in one of my big toes. I have had this for about three years or so. (I was sent for a X-ray for this and on my hands which are showing the beginnings of osteoarthritis.) It makes walking painful in normal shoes so I now wear walking shoes to work. I can’t run/jog anymore at all. And can still go for a walk but will really hurt after a while. Several different doctors have suggested the ibuprofen route and said that if I was a professional footballer then I would get treatment but I am not. However I am on medication that is stronger than ibuprofen for these dreadful headaches I get and it is noticeable when I come off it the arthritis gets

much worse.

[Dov65]

That's where I've got arthritis in the thumb base, after an xray an appointment with an Orthopaedic surgeon then a hand clinic I ended up with splints and cocodamol painkillers...that was 2 years ago. May this year 1 cortisone injection into both thumbs eased the right thumb but not the left one a blether with the Orthopaedic surgeon again didn't recommend surgery as not 100% guarantee to have full dexterity so back to splints again. As for playing I thought a Jazz type neck would be ideal but I struggled with it so out of the blue I tried a Vintera Precission bigger nut width & easier,  I guess the thumb isn't curled as such on the back of the neck so happy days. Wish you well bud.

[Merton]

I’ve recently been told (albeit by the singer in one of my bands, who has been a nurse for 30+ years) that my knee pain and discomfort is osteoarthritis. She said to try ibuprofen but then said a better bet (for reasons already alluded to above) was MSM, which you can get from Holland and Barrett. I’ll be honest, a week and a bit on from starting to use MSM it’s not really done anything for me yet but I’m wondering if it may just take a bit longer to kick in. We’ll see - I’ll report back in another week

 

PS - I’m 41 so not too dissimilar an age from you @NasalFloss 

Edited May 21, 2022 by Merton

[Mister RLP]

I’ve tried high dose turmeric curcumin for a couple of months. Didn’t do a great deal for me. 

[thebrig]

I have arthritis in both thumbs and had a Trapeziectomy operation on my left thumb where they removed the small piece of bone that sits between the base of the thumb and the wrist, they put an artificial piece in there  but it was so painful afterwards that they took it out six months later, and instead used a piece of my tendon rolled up to act as a buffer in the joint.

 

I decided not to have the operation on my right thumb because it didn't seem to have been a success, and it took a number of years for the pain to subside, but now it is less painful and more flexible than my right thumb, so maybe I should have gone ahead with the op on my right thumb.

 

I also have arthritis in my fingers but I find it helps to keep playing as much as possible because the movement involved playing bass or guitar is great exercise for the fingers, and I find that when I don't play for a few days, the pain gets worse.

 

If you can, try to stay positive, because I am now seventy and I am still playing, albeit, with some discomfort and some restrictive movement.

 

Good luck.

[Mister RLP]

Oh yeah. I was told by the doctor I was getting old. 

[mikeycrikey]

I was told ibuprofen for inflammation and paracetamol for pain.

If the inflammation is causing the pain the ibuprofen may be of help. When I had a bad back the doctor told me not to let the pain spike and then ty and control it it with pain relief.

He recommended 2 paracetamol then two hours latter  2 ibuprofen and repeat this throught the day. This stopped the pain building up and allowed to move around normally.

Alternatively he said I could take 2 paracetamol and 2 ibuprofen together every 4 hours.

Hope this of some help. I have zero medical training.

[NasalFloss]

1 hour ago, FinnDave said:

I was under the impression that Ibuprofen was more for reducing swelling than pain relief, but I think it was a doctor in Finland who told me that, so I could well have misunderstood.. 

One of my bands has a singer who is a GP, I'll ask her when I next see her (this weekend is the other band).

Thanks Dave, I’d really appreciate that

[NasalFloss]

1 hour ago, Dov65 said:

That's where I've got arthritis in the thumb base, after an xray an appointment with an Orthopaedic surgeon then a hand clinic I ended up with splints and cocodamol painkillers...that was 2 years ago. May this year 1 cortisone injection into both thumbs eased the right thumb but not the left one a blether with the Orthopaedic surgeon again didn't recommend surgery as not 100% guarantee to have full dexterity so back to splints again. As for playing I thought a Jazz type neck would be ideal but I struggled with it so out of the blue I tried a Vintera Precission bigger nut width & easier,  I guess the thumb isn't curled as such on the back of the neck so happy days. Wish you well bud.

I’m the same I thought a jazz neck would work better for me. I’d completely written off chunkier necks before I’d tried any! Unfortunately I haven’t the money between paying for engagement rings right now 🤣

 

My Player P isn’t that bad to play to be honest. Thanks for getting me gassing for the green Vintera btw 🙄😂

[NasalFloss]

8 hours ago, Staggering on said:

Re ibuprofen:

A doctor who checked me over when I had some nasty arthritis pain in my arms and hands from several things including working as a farrier for 27 years and playing double bass suggested that I should take ibuprofen. I was surprised when she said to take 4  500 mg tablets a day and said I thought that was a lot but she told me that some people take more than that daily for arthritis. I tried it for several months and was amazed at how much it helped, I don't know exactly what it did but the pain has pretty much disappeared and I stopped taking them. Now if I am a bit sore I take a couple a day for a week or so and it clears things up.

I realize that ibuprofen is for pain and not a medication that cures things but it seems to have worked very well for me. I wonder what dosage your doctor suggested, I know 3000mg a day is used by some arthritis sufferers so maybe you should try 1000 or 2000mg per day, ask your doctor if that's OK.

Please note that I am not trying to be a doctor here, just describing what worked for me.

Good luck! 

 

The doctor didn’t even suggest a dosage or prescribe anything. He expected me to buy it over the counter and follow the dosage of the packaging I guess?!

[Rich]

My fingers are gradually succumbing, one by one. My left pinky is useless, any movement in it is painful; right pinky is going the same way; end knuckles in my left index and middle fingers are becoming misshapen, index especially, and quite painful (see pic); same fingers on right hand also heading the same way. I've probably got 10 years playing left if I'm lucky.

Edited May 21, 2022 by Rich

[Chienmortbb]

1 hour ago, Mister RLP said:

Thankfully not in hands yet but I have really bad arthritis in one of my big toes. I have had this for about three years or so. (I was sent for a X-ray for this and on my hands which are showing the beginnings of osteoarthritis.) It makes walking painful in normal shoes so I now wear walking shoes to work. I can’t run/jog anymore at all. And can still go for a walk but will really hurt after a while. Several differegont doctors have suggested the ibuprofen route and said that if I was a professional footballer then I would get treatment but I am not. However I am on medication that is stronger than ibuprofen for these dreadful headaches I get and it is noticeable when I come off it the arthritis gets

much worse.

I had that and had it operated on about 8 years ago. It takes a while to heal but I have hardly had any pain since, despite the surgeon saying he was operating for mobility not pain

[Jonesy]

2 hours ago, FinnDave said:

I was under the impression that Ibuprofen was more for reducing swelling than pain relief, but I think it was a doctor in Finland who told me that, so I could well have misunderstood.. 

One of my bands has a singer who is a GP, I'll ask her when I next see her (this weekend is the other band).

 

Ibuprofen is a non steroidal anti inflammatory drug, so is good for reducing swelling and pain relief. At least that's my understanding.

 

I'm not a doctor, but have been using it to help with gout for nearly 20 years (along with a few other meds). Gout is a different type of arthritis, so I'm not sure how sage this advice is, but......diclofenac is the most effective nsaid for me and I find soluble pain killer like solpadeine is good for pain relief when it's bad. The boots own version is good too, essentially anything with codeine in it is what I look for.

 

I've tried a few natural remedies like turmeric and cherry and they don't work for me, but I do know people who swear by them, so they could be worth a go for you.

 

When I have a flare up I generally try to rest, elevate and ice the joint as much as possible.

[Chienmortbb]

1 minute ago, Rich said:

My fingers are gradually succumbing, one by one. My left pinky is useless, any movement in it is painful; right pinky is going the same way; end knuckles in my left index and middle fingers are becoming misshapen, index especially, and quite painful (see pic); same fingers on right hand also heading the same way. I've probably got 10 years playing left if I'm lucky.

That looks like Rheumatoid Arthritis, Osteoarthritis does not cause the joints to swell like that normally.

[Chienmortbb]

1 minute ago, Jonesy said:

 

Ibuprofen is a non steroidal anti inflammatory drug, so is good for reducing swelling and pain relief. At least that's my understanding.

 

I'm not a doctor, but have been using it to help with gout for nearly 20 years (along with a few other meds). Gout is a different type of arthritis, so I'm not sure how sage this advice is, but......diclofenac is the most effective nsaid for me and I find soluble pain killer like solpadeine is good for pain relief when it's bad. The boots own version is good too, essentially anything with codeine in it is what I look for.

 

I've tried a few natural remedies like turmeric and cherry and they don't work for me, but I do know people who swear by them, so they could be worth a go for you.

 

When I have a flare up I generally try to rest, elevate and ice the joint as much as possible.

Again I am not a Dr but in my experience Diclafenac is better that Ibuprofen but has that same issues. It is also an NSAD (as is asprin) and all have the side effect that if used unwisely to cause stomach bleeds and aggravate ulcers. You should take after meals on a full stomach to stop the tablet lying on the stomach wall.

 

As for dosage. my daughter is a Nurse Practitioner. She tells me that the normal Ibuprufen tablets are 200mg  and a normal dose is 400mg. However this is an average for adults and if you are on the larger side, you may need to got to 600mg. I have not heard of anyone taking more than that but I am not a Dr.  A

[Jonesy]

7 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

Again I am not a Dr but in my experience Diclafenac is better that Ibuprofen but has that same issues. It is also an NSAD (as is asprin) and all have the side effect that if used unwisely to cause stomach bleeds and aggravate ulcers. You should take after meals on a full stomach to stop the tablet lying on the stomach wall.

 

 

100%, it comes with its own health warnings but, if you follow your doctor's advice when taking it then you should be fine

[Staggering on]

Major error in my earlier post, it was late at night over here.🙄

I jumped on the OP's quote re ibuprofen and I was wrong about the medication my doctor suggested, it was Tylenol or acetaminophen NOT ibuprofen. The dosages were correct (4x500mg) but the product was wrong in my post, it must have been the wine and the time.

Sorry about that but it seems to have got a discussion going and I agree with the post re side effects of ibuprofen. I still take Tylenol when I start to have a flare up as I have had the last few days due to too much biking and boat polishing and the fact that I'm 76. 

[Dankology]

If you have osteoarthritis in your joints this is due to wear and tear on the articular surfaces - ie the lovely smooth padding is wearing away. There is very little you can do about this - what's worn is worn, what's gone is gone. 

 

The pain of arthritis is made worse by the inflammation that results from it and the odd patterns of use in the affected joints and nearby joints that the pain causes.

 

The key to reducing or slowing progression is controlling the pain so that you can continue using the joints as normally as possible. There will be times when you need to up the dose when things flare - possibly for a few weeks at a time. Ibuprofen is a good starting point here (but no more than the absolute maximum of 600mg three times per day!) but it is not ideal for long term use for a number of reasons. You could try some Codeine (available over the counter as a weak does of 8mg in combination with Paracetamol) but it isn't amazing for this sort of pain, causes most people constipation and the body also soon builds a tolerance to its pain relieving powers.

 

Without wanting to second guess a fellow GP's thinking process, I think I'd want to be sure this was actually osteoarthritis: you are young for this and I am always slightly suspicious of small joints being the first issue (rather than hips and knees, say). A couple of simple blood tests will give the pointer here - if there are signs of inflammatory disease you will do well to seek the opinion of a rheumatologist; if the bloods are essentially normal, I would want you seen at a musculoskeletal service so that the physios can pin down the affected joints and contributing factors and start you on some physical therapy to reduce progression and maintain function.

 

[The photo posted above is very much in keeping with osteoarthritis btw: the swellings at the knuckles look to be Heberden's nodes which are a classic feature of wear and tear arthritis. Keith Richards has had some phenomenal ones for at least a couple of decades - doesn't seem to stop him...]

 

Hope that helps a little. As a 43 year old with a strong family history of OA and the increasing rumblings of it myself, I'm fairly certain my musical endeavors are helping keep it at bay.

Edited May 21, 2022 by Dankology

[Chienmortbb]

1 hour ago, Dankology said:

If you have osteoarthritis in your joints this is due to wear and tear on the articular surfaces - ie the lovely smooth padding is wearing away. There is very little you can do about this - what's worn is worn, what's gone is gone. 

 

The pain of arthritis is made worse by the inflammation that results from it and the odd patterns of use in the affected joints and nearby joints that the pain causes.

 

The key to reducing or slowing progression is controlling the pain so that you can continue using the joints as normally as possible. There will be times when you need to up the dose when things flare - possibly for a few weeks at a time. Ibuprofen is a good starting point here (but no more than the absolute maximum of 600mg three times per day!) but it is not ideal for long term use for a number of reasons. You could try some Codeine (available over the counter as a weak does of 8mg in combination with Paracetamol) but it isn't amazing for this sort of pain, causes most people constipation and the body also soon builds a tolerance to its pain relieving powers.

 

Without wanting to second guess a fellow GP's thinking process, I think I'd want to be sure this was actually osteoarthritis: you are young for this and I am always slightly suspicious of small joints being the first issue (rather than hips and knees, say). A couple of simple blood tests will give the pointer here - if there are signs of inflammatory disease you will do well to seek the opinion of a rheumatologist; if the bloods are essentially normal, I would want you seen at a musculoskeletal service so that the physios can pin down the affected joints and contributing factors and start you on some physical therapy to reduce progression and maintain function.

 

[The photo posted above is very much in keeping with osteoarthritis btw: the swellings at the knuckles look to be Heberden's nodes which are a classic feature of wear and tear arthritis. Keith Richards has had some phenomenal ones for at least a couple of decades - doesn't seem to stop him...]

 

Hope that helps a little. As a 43 year old with a strong family history of OA and the increasing rumblings of it myself, I'm fairly certain my musical endeavors are helping keep it at bay.

Thanks for correcting me, I was a bit right. Incidentally it is common knowledge the Keith Richards has self medicated for several decades. 
 

I would repeat my warning about NSADs as my mum over-used Asprin and lost half her stomach in an emergency operation because of it. 
 

I use Pyroxicam on my fingers sometimes before I play and Voltarol ( Diclofenac ) gel if it’s really bad. However I don’t really suffer that badly and would agree that playing helps. If it starts early enough before a gig I just take Ibruprofen. I should stress though that although the episodes are becoming closer together, it is more than manageable for me. 
I had the op on my  big toe about 10 years ago and I could barely walk before so I do know what chronic pain is. 

[NasalFloss]

2 hours ago, Staggering on said:

The dosages were correct (4x500mg) but the product was wrong in my post, it must have been the wine and the time.

Was it wine o’clock there? Sorry, I couldn’t help myself.