Amp for monitors

[fleabag]

Not in a hurry, as we're still in rehearsals, but in our trio, we have one 400 watt powered wedge monitor ( mine ) and the other 2 guys have nothing.

 

The mixer is passive  ( no one will be buying a powered mixer ) so at some point we'll need to be able to run 2 extra passive monitors.  Can anyone suggest what type/sort of amp we'll need ?

 

It's for on stage monitoring, so presumably, it doesnt need to be a beast.  I assume that we need a dual channel at least ?

 

I suspect suggestions of IEM's , but i'm only looking for answers to the above 

 

 

 

[Woodinblack]

So what does the actual PA run?

When I joined my current band we had two passive PA speakers and 2 passive monitors, and a 100w active wedge monitor, all powered by 4 channel PA from thomman. Now we have an active PA, so no passive monitors and the wedge blew up ages ago. Me and the drummer use IEMs, the singer seems perfectly happy as he is out the front, the guitarist complains but doesn't seem to do anything about it, so we seem pretty sorted.

 

If your PA is active, wouldn't it just make sense to get 2 active monitors, and if your PA is passive speakers, can't you just have a 4 channel amp instead and run some passive monitors? I am not sure I see why you would pick passive monitors and buy an amp rather than active ones unless you already had passive PA speakers

 

[lemmywinks]

If you're prepared to lug some weight about then you can pick up old power amps for next to nothing, anything should be fine though.

 

Realistically you're best just picking up some powered speakers, the Alto stuff is more than usable and costs very little. If you don't need a lot of volume then you can go even cheaper - I sold a Mackie powered wedge for £40 recently and it took months to shift. Buyers' market at the moment so might as well make the most of it.

[fleabag]

2 hours ago, Woodinblack said:

So what does the actual PA run?

When I joined my current band we had two passive PA speakers and 2 passive monitors, and a 100w active wedge monitor, all powered by 4 channel PA from thomman. Now we have an active PA, so no passive monitors and the wedge blew up ages ago. Me and the drummer use IEMs, the singer seems perfectly happy as he is out the front, the guitarist complains but doesn't seem to do anything about it, so we seem pretty sorted.

 

If your PA is active, wouldn't it just make sense to get 2 active monitors, and if your PA is passive speakers, can't you just have a 4 channel amp instead and run some passive monitors? I am not sure I see why you would pick passive monitors and buy an amp rather than active ones unless you already had passive PA speakers

 

 

The PA is an active Yamaha Stagepas 1000 but we have 2 of 'em.  Each stack can run 1 powered monitor , but the only control over them is a volume control on the stack

 

Yes Woody, one of the guys has a couple of passive monitors, so we dont need to buy more, but just wondering how to power them.

[fleabag]

1 hour ago, lemmywinks said:

If you're prepared to lug some weight about then you can pick up old power amps for next to nothing, anything should be fine though.

 

Realistically you're best just picking up some powered speakers, the Alto stuff is more than usable and costs very little. If you don't need a lot of volume then you can go even cheaper - I sold a Mackie powered wedge for £40 recently and it took months to shift. Buyers' market at the moment so might as well make the most of it.

 

My powered wedge is an Alto, funnily enough.  My guys will not buy powered monitors, because we have passives available.

 

So its just about which would be a good power amp, and how many channels would we need.

 

 

[Ed_S]

I can recommend Crown XLS power amps - light, loud, not overly expensive, don't need a doctorate to operate, and never caused me any problems. I like them for powering monitors because they have built in adjustable HPF/LPF per channel, so you can keep unhelpful frequencies off the stage, and you can also Y-split one input to both channels if you just want to use the same monitor mix for both wedges. The older (silver) 1500 or the newer (black) 1502 in particular I reckon are a great balance between size, weight and power. Like everything these days they seem to be in short supply, but if you can find one then I doubt you'd be disappointed with it for that application.

[Woodinblack]

In that case I would just get a two channel the box amp from Thomman. Well, I wouldn't, I would still get active monitors because it is another thing to carry around, but if they are fixed on passive monitors, that is what I would do!

[tauzero]

Would this be any help? 

 

[skidder652003]

https://www.pmtonline.co.uk/b-stock-albion-abh800pa-800w-power-amp

 

does 2 x 8ohm cabs, any good?

 

ooof just seen delivery costs!

Edited July 10, 2022 by skidder652003

[fleabag]

Yep, i saw  that delivery - 65 squid for an 83 squid B Stock amp.  In small letters, it also says " buy new for 92 "

 

Bit odd - only 9 quiddies more for a new one ??

[fleabag]

Gets stranger - if you click on the tiny  " buy new for £92 " - it takes you to another  Albion for £74  

 

[BassBunny]

2 hours ago, skidder652003 said:

ooof just seen delivery costs!

Because it weighs 35Kg.

Way, scuse my pun, over the top to drive a couple of monitors.

Which Alto do you have?

[fleabag]

Oh boy - i didnt check the weight. Yep that bad boy is a no no.

 

Lemmywinks has an Alto as well, so do you mean him or me ?   Mine's the Alto  Tourmax SXM 112A  400 watt

 

Here's a link, and ignore the 800 watt. That's Beau Locks. 

 

12” coax woofer, 1” neodymium driver  -    Continuous - 400 W ( 335 W LF + 65 W HF )

 

11 Kg

 

https://www.simplysoundandlighting.co.uk/alto-tourmax-sxm112a-12-800w-active-wedge-monitor

[BassmanPaul]

Sad to say that I have a four channel 300W per sitting in my garage. If you were nearer I would have given it to you.

 

[fleabag]

How far are ya ?

 

Only kidding

[pete.young]

20 hours ago, fleabag said:

 

My powered wedge is an Alto, funnily enough.  My guys will not buy powered monitors, because we have passives available.

 

So its just about which would be a good power amp, and how many channels would we need.

 

 

 

You might only need one channel, if you can daisy-chain the 2 passive monitors.

[fleabag]

Good point, but you can just see the scenario coming up where one of the guys says ' mine's too loud '     

 

[Phil Starr]

First of all the usual, if that's where you want to be why start from there? You could waste a lot of time and money bodging things to get a couple of clapped out old monitors working on stage only to eventually find out that active monitors or in-ears would have been the solution all along

 

You've made it clear that this is not the advice you want.

 

First of all you say Trio, who plays what, and what do they want to hear that they can't hear with the current set up? Your Stagepas system doesn't seem to have an Aux bus so you can't all have different mixes so I assume you either want to hear the front of house mix or vocals only? Is your Alto not loud enough for you all to hear it?

 

If all you want is a bit more volume and you insist on using the monitors you have then all you need is a stereo PA amp. I've never had problems from a Behringer amp and recently sold a 20 year old EP2400 for £100, I bought an iNuke for a similar price so maybe start looking for something similar. Thomann's own brand amp looks a good shout too https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_tamp_e800.htm

[fleabag]

I'm not wasting my time, as you call it , because it's not my issue. I'm just posting on behalf of what the others want. I dont care how they sort it. I'm just asking questions

 

I have my monitor and that'll do me.

 

Yup, the Stagepas ( each stack ) just has a jack monitor out with just a volume control.  But we have a  passive mixer so this has  aux busses, so we wont be using the Stagepas for monitors.  I can pass on recoms.  for amps etc.

 

They want to hear FOH. All instruments go through PA.  2 guitars / 1 bass /  3 mics / backing track

 

That Thomann looks like a bargain , as long as it doesnt produce sparks 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 11, 2022 by fleabag

[Phil Starr]

6 hours ago, fleabag said:

I'm not wasting my time, as you call it , because it's not my issue. I'm just posting on behalf of what the others want.

 

That sounds frustrating

 

OK you are running the Stagepas off a mixer which is good.

I'm assuming they want to go down this route because they don't want to spend too much. Is that right?

 

So the suggestion I'd personally make and keeping it simple is between two of these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/234255493119 or a PA amp of roughly 300W/channel.

 

The link is for some Laney 15" PA speakers who are selling off old stock through eBay. @Chienmortbbhas one he is evaluating so you could ask him, I've used one at rehearsal and it was good. Laney have a long history so are pretty much to be trusted.

Not everything that comes out of China goes pop, it is the wild west though, ironically with few government controls and you have no idea who you are trading with when you go direct. I've had no problems with Behringer PA amps and I'd even  happily buy a used one. Thomann give a 3 year guarantee on the T-amp. 

 

I'd stress the simplicity of going the active route in set up, they might even be able to offload the monitors and get something back to pay for the replacements. 

 

Good luck with your band members, it'd be much simpler if they took your advice and went for the Alto's and you'd look more professional with a line of matching monitors. 

 

[fleabag]

That Ebay active Laney looks pretty damn good. If we hadnt any monitors at all, 3 of those would have been ideal.

 

The  T.amp is probably the answer for the other 2 guys though.

[Waddycall]

Apologies if this breaks the rules - I have a QSC RMX850a for sale if that’s of interest. I paid just over £150 for it.

[Phil Starr]

1 hour ago, Waddycall said:

Apologies if this breaks the rules - I have a QSC RMX850a for sale if that’s of interest. I paid just over £150 for it.

That's a good bit of kit.

 

[Chienmortbb]

11 hours ago, Phil Starr said:

The link is for some Laney 15" PA speakers who are selling off old stock through eBay. @Chienmortbbhas one he is evaluating so you could ask him, I've used one at rehearsal and it was good. Laney have a long history so are pretty much to be trusted.

The Laney's seem pretty good for the money. They are a bit old school, class A/B amp with a transformer power supply but still under 17Kg. The handles are excellent, with the top handle for carrying in and the side handle for lifting onto a pole. Despite being a weedy 70year old I can lift them with ease. The angles are good for floor monitors too. No DSP so what you put in is what comes out. I have yet to put them to use in the band situation. Hoping to do that on Friday.

[fleabag]

They'd be perfect for my 2 luddite friends.