The compact mixing desk thread

[Woodinblack]

No reason at all - I have run a sub off an aux because I wanted to ensure it was just used by the drums anyway

[JPJ]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

Gents, maybe a bit of a noob question but picking up on @EBS_freak's point about aux feeds for subs...any reason we can't use apply hpf/lpf on the desk to route sub 120Hz output to the subs and supra 120 Hz to the tops?

 

In which case the Alto TS 12 would be back in the game 😄

 

No reason at all other than it uses up one of your aux outs. Did this for years before I got the DriveRack and it works great, and depending on how you set your sends (pre/post fader) can give you full independent control of the low end volume

[Al Krow]

5 minutes ago, JPJ said:

No reason at all other than it uses up one of your aux outs. Did this for years before I got the DriveRack and it works great, and depending on how you set your sends (pre/post fader) can give you full independent control of the low end volume

 

Great, well we have two spare aux outs on the new desk and likely to only have one sub, so this could be a neat solution!

[Chienmortbb]

The question of Aux fed subs is almost as toxic as the Tonewood wars of old. They work for some people they do not for others. So let’s stoke the fires,   Look at it sensibly. 
 

1. As I see it, and I am not a professional, placing the crossover after the main output of the mixer is the ideal. You would have had hours prior to the start of the show to balance the subs and the tops, using Driverack or other Speaker Management Processor (fancy digital crossover). You have positioned your fleet of measurement mics throughout the venue and use software to have an acceptable balance everywhere.

 

2. You get to the Dog and Duck an hour before the star, fighting you way through punters finishing what is described as  Hunter’s Chicken. Try to avoid slipping on a child’s partially digested chip portion laid carefully, like a minefield, to maim the weekend warrior. Do you go back to unload the plethora of outboard processing loads “just in case” it was needed? Or use the DSP in your mixer to tailor the outputs to your tops and subs? 
 

The truth is I have heard from countless Sound Techs that produce great sound using  both ways and reality often tells you what you can and cannot do.

[JPJ]

10 hours ago, Al Krow said:

 

Great, well we have two spare aux outs on the new desk and likely to only have one sub, so this could be a neat solution!

Remember that you can run more than one sub from the same aux out as its not necessary to have your subs ‘in stereo’ as bass frequencies are omni-directional 

[Jack]

12 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Gents, maybe a bit of a noob question but picking up on @EBS_freak's point about aux feeds for subs...any reason we can't apply hpf/lpf on the desk to route a sub 120Hz aux output to the Sub(s) and supra 120 Hz (via the main outs) to the Tops?

 

In which case the Alto TS 12 would be back in the game 😄

 

 

Depends how steep the slopes on the desk are, but it could work just fine. Like others here I wouldn't normally bother, but if you don't have a crossover anywhere else then it seems like a good option for you. 

[51m0n]

On 27/12/2024 at 22:04, Al Krow said:

Gents, maybe a bit of a noob question but picking up on @EBS_freak's point about aux feeds for subs...any reason we can't apply hpf/lpf on the desk to route a sub 120Hz aux output to the Sub(s) and supra 120 Hz (via the main outs) to the Tops?

 

In which case the Alto TS 12 would be back in the game 😄

 

 

Nope, assuming your desk supports that

 

It's more faff, you need to watch the Q on both filters, gentler slope and the same crossover point is probably your best starting point. Oh and unlike IEMs/monitors you want a Post fader send usually 

 

You are sacrificing an aux out/matrix or however you end up implementing it, but you also get the advantage of choosing what to bother to send to that channel - which can mean not having to worry so much about high passing lots of channels

 

 

[SimonK]

A bit late to this thread, but it just so happens I was rooting around behind my rack this week and discovered a sub out on the back of the excellent (and cheap) Behringer FBQ1502 graphic equaliser - might be the simplest way to get a sub mix without wasting an aux channel:

 

[Chienmortbb]

On 27/12/2024 at 22:57, Woodinblack said:

No reason at all - I have run a sub off an aux because I wanted to ensure it was just used by the drums anyway

I think this is the real reason to use Aux fed subs. You can choose what gets to the subs and EQ/Filters are never ideal.

[dave_bass5]

50 minutes ago, SimonK said:

A bit late to this thread, but it just so happens I was rooting around behind my rack this week and discovered a sub out on the back of the excellent (and cheap) Behringer FBQ1502 graphic equaliser - might be the simplest way to get a sub mix without wasting an aux channel:

 

Wow, this has just reminded me I have one I those. I think ive only used it once and put it away. Got it just after lockdown but after the first gig with it i couldn't  be bothered using it anymore lol. 

[Al Krow]

On 21/11/2024 at 19:20, Al Krow said:

 

Yeah - that's a fair point Dave. The CQ12T and 18T are standalone desks effectively featuring a "built in tablet".

 

I guess the lack of wifi on the 12T is a product differentiation point - the 18T is £175 more and for that you get: 6 extra inputs, wifi, an extra 2 FX and 3 additional control dials. Worth the extra (particularly if you get lucky as I managed, and pick up a B stock 18T for only £40 extra!). If everything was available on the 12T other than the extra inputs, there would maybe be a lot fewer takers for the 18T or the 12T would need to come in at a price point much closer to the 18T?

 

Fyi - in terms of the additional FX on the CQ18T, the 4 categories on offer:

1. "easy verb" - 3 vocals, string slap, percussion, drum room, string, brass, woodwind & piano

2. "echo verb" - with different flavours and delay times

3. fully fledged chorus

4. double tracker

 

I'll probably stick to easy verb for the vocals, otherwise there's definitely risk of option paralysis: the desk is actually doubling up as a multi-channel multifx!

 

 

For completeness, I think I've spotted one additional feature in the CQ18T vs CQ12T over and above the couple I listed above - the 18T has two independent headphone outs vs one on the 12T. Not sure that's going to particularly benefit me, but may be of importance to some eg when using the desk as an audio interface for multi track recording?

[Woodinblack]

20 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

 

For completeness, I think I've spotted one additional feature in the CQ18T vs CQ12T over and above the couple I listed above - the 18T has two independent headphone outs vs one on the 12T. Not sure that's going to particularly benefit me, but may be of importance to some eg when using the desk as an audio interface for multi track recording?

 

I have had my X18 mixer since 2017, and before that I had an XR16 for most of a year, and i have not once used the headphone output!

As you say, maybe there is some use for it, I never found it.

 

[dave_bass5]

1 minute ago, Woodinblack said:

 

I have had my X18 mixer since 2017, and before that I had an XR16 for most of a year, and i have not once used the headphone output!

As you say, maybe there is some use for it, I never found it.

 

I started to use the headphone out for my IEM’s (stereo) when i got my XR18, as it was an easy option. Just a lightweight stereo cable from the XR18 to my P2. No adapters or a pair of cables like i do now using the XLR. It was more convenient, plus i coudl if needed use that output for other things. It also gave me easier access to adjusting the output level by having the knob. 

[jimmyb625]

This has just been announced and looks pretty interesting:

 

https://www.allen-heath.com/hardware/sq/sq-rack/

 

I'm guessing it'll be priced above the Behringer wing rack, but it looks like a good step-up from the QU-SB.

[warwickhunt]

4 minutes ago, jimmyb625 said:

This has just been announced and looks pretty interesting:

 

https://www.allen-heath.com/hardware/sq/sq-rack/

 

I'm guessing it'll be priced above the Behringer wing rack, but it looks like a good step-up from the QU-SB.

 

No 'combi' inputs?  

 

[Al Krow]

On 09/01/2025 at 18:21, Woodinblack said:

 

I have had my X18 mixer since 2017, and before that I had an XR16 for most of a year, and i have not once used the headphone output!

As you say, maybe there is some use for it, I never found it.

 

@AllYourBassAreBelongToUs spotted a second use for twin headphone outs which is to provide a second FoH option for venues where the main XLR are going to the house PA but you still want to make use of your own PA at the gig. I can think of a couple of venues where that might come in handy!

[Chienmortbb]

37 minutes ago, warwickhunt said:

 

No 'combi' inputs?  

 

I think the SQ range are a step up from the CQ. As a pro mixer, it would expect all inputs to be balanced on XLRs. If you need a jack input, you need to input jacks then it would be DI'd.

[warwickhunt]

1 hour ago, Chienmortbb said:

I think the SQ range are a step up from the CQ. As a pro mixer, it would expect all inputs to be balanced on XLRs. If you need a jack input, you need to input jacks then it would be DI'd.

 

Fair comment.