SteveXFR Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 4 hours ago, Chienmortbb said: When I auditioned for my current band, I walked in with my Class D Head and Basschat 112 speaker. "You will need more than that for a gig". Needd less to say that all the previous bassists had head height stacks, Anyway I got the job and have never had a complaint that I was too quiet. I currently have my Orange Terror 500w with a 4x10 cab and I've never turned the volume past 30% volume. I used to have a Trace Elliot GP12SMX head with a 4x10 and 1x15 cab and needed to run that at 90% on the master volume with a band that wasn't as loud as this one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjones Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 (edited) 7 hours ago, Rich said: Just shows what a mic luddite I am... I'd always thought it was 'stand behind an SM58 and away you go' it's obviously a much deeper science than I ever gave it credit for. Although I suppose it's no different to playing a P instead of a J, for example. I play in a newly formed band. The singer is good but not experienced in singing live. She used her own SM58 at our first gig and the sound engineer struggled to get a decent volume from the monitor due to feedback. For the second set he swapped the mic to one of the house mics and it reduced the feedback and allowed him to get her monitor louder. She instantly bought the same model of mic. I know nothing about mics but I do know that some are better for live work than others. Edited October 3, 2022 by gjones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 8 minutes ago, gjones said: I play in a newly formed band. The singer is good but not experienced in singing live. She used her own SM58 at our first gig and the sound engineer struggled to get a decent volume from the monitor due to feedback. For the second set he swapped the mic to one of the house mics and it reduced the feedback and allowed him to get her monitor louder. She instantly bought the same model of mic. I know nothing about mics but I do know that some are better for live work than others. I used to use an AKG D5, when I was doing backing vocals. When I joined a band where I was singing lead, the FOH guy (who I know and respect) told me that my mic was doing me no favours. My immediate thought was SM58, however, following a bit of research, it seemed that a straight ahead SM58 wasn’t the way forward, but an SM58 beta was. Bought one and I’ve never looked back. The right mic for you can make a big difference, not only to you vocals but also to your confidence, which inevitably improves your vocals further. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 37 minutes ago, ezbass said: SM58 beta Is louder but also is a supercardoid, which means its more directional so you'll get less feedback. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunderwonder Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 8 hours ago, Dan Dare said: operator Which operator? The ones on the stage can make any unholy racket they like and everyone will blame the guy at the desk when all but the vocals are cut from the FOH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 1 hour ago, TimR said: Is louder but also is a supercardoid, which means its more directional so you'll get less feedback. I find it has a slightly different voice (pun unintended) too. But, you’re right, it is a supercardoid design, just like the standard 58, the SM57 and my old D5 (and many others of course). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 3 minutes ago, ezbass said: I find it has a slightly different voice (pun unintended) too. But, you’re right, it is a supercardoid design, just like the standard 58, the SM57 and my old D5 (and many others of course). SM58 and SM57 are regular cardoid, Beta 57A/58A are supercardoid, unless I'm reading the Shure website incorrectly? https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/sm57 https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/sm58 https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/beta_57a https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/beta_58a 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chienmortbb Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 The thing to remember is that the null points on a Super Cardioid are not directly behind as with an SM58 or other cardioid mic. They are off to the side. So if you are using monitors, you may need to move them off to one side. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezbass Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 1 hour ago, neepheid said: SM58 and SM57 are regular cardoid, Beta 57A/58A are supercardoid, unless I'm reading the Shure website incorrectly? https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/sm57 https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/sm58 https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/beta_57a https://www.shure.com/en-GB/products/microphones/beta_58a Appreciate the clarification, thanks. 👍 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 3, 2022 Share Posted October 3, 2022 2 hours ago, Chienmortbb said: The thing to remember is that the null points on a Super Cardioid are not directly behind as with an SM58 or other cardioid mic. They are off to the side. So if you are using monitors, you may need to move them off to one side. The area directly behind is used for rejection. That's the whole idea of them. Narrower beam at the front and greater rejection from the rear. As long as the levels from the rear aren't stupidly high. Putting monitors to the side will only help if your mics are static. But the super cardioid reduces the likelihood of feedback when the singer starts walking around the stage for the very reason you state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyb625 Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 4 hours ago, TimR said: The area directly behind is used for rejection. That's the whole idea of them. Narrower beam at the front and greater rejection from the rear. As long as the levels from the rear aren't stupidly high. Putting monitors to the side will only help if your mics are static. But the super cardioid reduces the likelihood of feedback when the singer starts walking around the stage for the very reason you state. Not on a super cardioid, they have a lobe to the rear, so rejection from there isn't as good as a cardioid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 (edited) 6 hours ago, jimmyb625 said: Not on a super cardioid, they have a lobe to the rear, so rejection from there isn't as good as a cardioid. Not as good, but still 12dB+ lower than on axis at the front for frequencies above 1kHz and 6dB+ for lower than 1kHz. That's why they're extremely good for live vocalists who move around a lot. Edited October 4, 2022 by TimR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzmanb Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 Same when you do shared stage multi band gigs Same set up you always have etc i have good basses through a radial bassbone ,much better di than my amp .Great sound every week Sound guy ," what are you using that for ,just go from your amp " etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Posted October 4, 2022 Share Posted October 4, 2022 On 03/10/2022 at 11:03, Dan Dare said: Let's unpack this a little. Sound equipment is not designed or built to perform badly. Assuming it's of decent enough quality and adequate for the job, how else can it sound bad other than through operator error? Well firstly I think the emphasised bit (my emphasis) is an incredibly big assumption, given the nature of most Basschatters who are in working pub bands. Granted, someone in the higher echelons of touring or something might not have those worries. My first PA was a pair of Maplin 15" tops, I then added home-made subs. Ah, the good old days. Odd-shaped rooms, boomy rooms, echoey stages. having to set up in an acoustically-stupid place, a local restaurant around me is nearly all glass and metal. Then there's things like room and stage sizes and shapes being 'not right' so you can't place your amps where you'd like or having to live with a power alley as you can only really have one sub per side. My tops are lovely, but they're only 75 degrees dispersion so I can struggle in wide rooms, maybe that comes under the 'adequate for the job' statement above. Imposed volume requirements. The last obvious one I can think of is sort of an excuse, but also just a reality: we (I) run sound from the stage. A wireless unit for my bass, a trick digital mixer and working on a tabley all help, but realistically I'm not quite the sound man I should/could be if I was sitting in the right place. I could continue but I think we've dragged this on long enough. I don't think bad sound is inherently somebody's fault. At least not always. Not in the same way where if I heard someone playing an instrument badly I would probably just assume that they couldn't play it right (I mean they could be injured or whatever I suppose). If I hear a bad sounding bad one night my automatic assumption isn't that they're incompetent. Although that is certainly one possibility I would entertain others. I've seen Iron Maiden at the local arena 3 times now. They sounded great twice and pretty bad once. Was it because I was in a different place in the venue? Different rental PA? Some imposed noise limits? Architectural changes? (it was the most recent that sounded bad). Or, possibly, they may have hired an incompetent sound crew. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jazzyvee Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 On 01/10/2022 at 15:45, paul_5 said: I’m of the opinion that if a band wants me to play a specific bass for the look of it, the band should buy that instrument. I’m not paying to go to work! Just my cantankerous opinion. Agreed, unless of course they are paying me shed loads of money for a tour, then i might take the mercenary approach and reconsider. So far no-one has ever told me not to use a particular bass. Either for aesthetic reasons or sonic reasons. 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javi_bassist Posted October 7, 2022 Author Share Posted October 7, 2022 11 hours ago, jazzyvee said: Agreed, unless of course they are paying me shed loads of money for a tour, then i might take the mercenary approach and reconsider. So far no-one has ever told me not to use a particular bass. Either for aesthetic reasons or sonic reasons. 🙂 Agree. I read an interview that Matt Reilly (I think it was him anyway) that was hired to play with Avril Lavigne, but he had to play a Fender Precision. So he went to buy one right away. Good gigs. That would be different if a band asks you play X bass and they will pay you like 100 bucks and you have 2 gigs a month... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamIAm Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 I play bass in a ukulele band, currently a Harley Benton 5 string long scale fretless. Whilst the band is happy with the glorious sound I produce (Simply root/thirds/fifths with the occasional walking join) they feel it is ... too big for a uke band! Fortunately, I've now got almost all the bits I need to start building Phoenix, which will be more in keeping with the aesthetic of the group. (Tho I will continue playing the HB as it is rather amazing!) S'manth x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 2 hours ago, Smanth said: I play bass in a ukulele band, currently a Harley Benton 5 string long scale fretless. Whilst the band is happy with the glorious sound I produce (Simply root/thirds/fifths with the occasional walking join) they feel it is ... too big for a uke band! Jon Banks, bassist for the Ukulele Orchestra of Great Britain, (many years ago we both depped for a local rock band) played an electric bass when they started, then moved to an acoustic bass. Sometimes the look is as important as the sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msb Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 I‘ve been asked to bring a specific bass , is that the same? One of the cheapest ones I own , Danelectro Longhorn , with ancient strings. It has a great , old school , woody thump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezzaboy Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 A guy who worked with a company I worked with for a while found out I was a bass player. He was on the lookout as he had apparently mislaid his bass player. He then proceeded to tell me in no uncertain terms that if I wanted the pleasure of playing for him I would need a P bass, Sansamp and use a pick. As I didn`t have a P bass, a Sansamp and can`t play with a pick to save myself, I told him where to go. This turned out to be the right thing to do as it turns out he was a right fu*kwit! 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JapanAxe Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 I’ve been the guitarist who was apparently playing too loud, except the person saying so was hearing the bass. I also once told myself not to buy a Dingwall because it wouldn’t look ‘right’ in a country band. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveXFR Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 3 minutes ago, JapanAxe said: I’ve been the guitarist who was apparently playing too loud, except the person saying so was hearing the bass. I also once told myself not to buy a Dingwall because it wouldn’t look ‘right’ in a country band. You need a BC Rich Warlock 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downunderwonder Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 8 hours ago, chris_b said: Jon Banks, bassist for the Ukulele Orchestra of Great Britain, (many years ago we both depped for a local rock band) played an electric bass when they started, then moved to an acoustic bass. Sometimes the look is as important as the sound. I saw them when they came out here on tour. The bassist had a slightly shorter then medium scale acoustic bass guitar. It looked all wrong when he could just as easily have played a uke bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msb Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 Should be playing a uke bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamIAm Posted October 8, 2022 Share Posted October 8, 2022 Been there with a UBASS, it’s intonation is a mare and it needs retuning every other minute and this with thunder gut strings! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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