2023

[BassFace1991]

1 hour ago, cheddatom said:

I'm hearing a lot of panic from promoters and the like, and we have had a couple cancelled due to low sales, but every gig I've played seems to be as well attended as I expect. We've got loads in for 2023

 

I'm really glad to hear that. I've seen a lot of shows cancelled this year due to low ticket sales. Even tribute bands have been struggling. Personally got a couple of tours and a fairly big festival booked for next year already. So I'm grateful for that.

[chris_b]

I've heard that a few bands and duo's on the local circuit are getting cancelled at short notice because of low ticket sales.

[Lozz196]

I think that’ll be it, bands that pull the crowd irrespective of how good/bad will be ones floating to the top in this. 

[TimR]

It's weird. A lot of people have a lot of money and a lot of people have no money. 

 

It's not just gigs. It's lots of activities. Getting people out to anything is hard. 

 

I think the people who have found something else to do, have found subscriptions to TV streaming and box sets. My friends are always talking about this box set, that box set. My wife seems glued to the TV. I hardly watch it, I'm out most nights and most days during the weekend. I can't bear sitting at home not doing something. 

 

Online shopping and delivery takeaways means less eating out and trips to the shops. People are working from home. Some people have started to become hermits. Will take a coupe of years to get people to change from these new habits. 

Edited November 9, 2022 by TimR

[mrtcat]

12 hours ago, TimR said:

It's weird. A lot of people have a lot of money and a lot of people have no money. 

 

It's not just gigs. It's lots of activities. Getting people out to anything is hard. 

 

I think the people who have found something else to do, have found subscriptions to TV streaming and box sets. My friends are always talking about this box set, that box set. My wife seems glued to the TV. I hardly watch it, I'm out most nights and most days during the weekend. I can't bear sitting at home not doing something. 

 

Online shopping and delivery takeaways means less eating out and trips to the shops. People are working from home. Some people have started to become hermits. Will take a coupe of years to get people to change from these new habits. 

I think this is very true. The pub / club / theatre scene is probably suffering more whereas the wedding / function scene is busy. People aren't going out as much so people getting married are splashing the cash on bands, especially if that band has a good online presence with plenty of quality media. People can sit behind a PC and choose their wedding suppliers easily without having to leave the house.

[EBS_freak]

20 minutes ago, mrtcat said:

I think this is very true. The pub / club / theatre scene is probably suffering more whereas the wedding / function scene is busy. People aren't going out as much so people getting married are splashing the cash on bands, especially if that band has a good online presence with plenty of quality media. People can sit behind a PC and choose their wedding suppliers easily without having to leave the house.

Theatre is still moderately buoyant. Wedding scene is largely unimpacted, corporate is well down. Everything else is crashing compared to where it was 3 or 4 years ago. People just aren't spending the money. At the lower budget end of the wedding scene, people that would have stretched to a band are mostly going for DJs.

 

Trouble is for me personally, I'm bored of where I am. Weddings are pretty frustrating in the fact that it's so formulaic and predictable. I can't complain, I've earned some good money over the years and like yourself, spent a few years doing the big NYE gigs. They don't even excite me anymore!

 

Your comment did make me smirk though - one of the things that angers me a lot about the wedding scene, is that it's basically becoming a bunch of scratch bands - and that really doesn't sit well with me. There's folk like yourself with a static lineup which is great - but then, the vast majority seem to be a bunch of musicians thrown together at the last minute, going out with scrappy gear. It's amazing how many of the "UK's Best Wedding Band" go out with inappropriate "Powerful PAs" (a couple of Behringer tops), a sorry excuse for "Amazing light show" (a couple of par cans) and sound absolutely awful and totally non representative of the promo material that they present. I don't think thats fair on the clients who have no doubt spent hours choosing their ideal band only for a band of deps to turn up. That's becoming the norm as more and more musicians scrabble about, ditching gigs for other gigs to earn another fiver. I don't want to be part of that scene, especially when I'm the one holding the contract. The whole thing has mostly become a joke anyway, it's a battle of the promo - and as you'll know and I've stated, the promo rarely represents the reality of what the band sounds like live. It peeves me off seeing all these super produced mega band promos where you can hear the vocalists have been tuned within an inch of their lives, vocal stacks for days, a million over dubs yiddah, yaddah, you know how it is. It's Richard Turpin stuff.

[Barking Spiders]

13 hours ago, TimR said:

It's weird. A lot of people have a lot of money and a lot of people have no money. 

 

It's not just gigs. It's lots of activities. Getting people out to anything is hard. 

 

I think the people who have found something else to do, have found subscriptions to TV streaming and box sets. My friends are always talking about this box set, that box set. My wife seems glued to the TV. I hardly watch it, I'm out most nights and most days during the weekend. I can't bear sitting at home not doing something. 

 

Online shopping and delivery takeaways means less eating out and trips to the shops. People are working from home. Some people have started to become hermits. Will take a coupe of years to get people to change from these new habits. 

Yep I concur with that. In my social circles, nobody but nobody EVER talks about music. We'll discuss many other topics including good stuff to watch on Netflix and the like, sports, travel, current affairs, gaming, work, environmental topics, cost of living, growing your own, family matters, food and cooking, booze, bikes etc etc but absolutely zilch about gigs, instruments, listening tastes etc. I just think for most people it's slipped right down to the bottom of their lists of priorities and interests.

Edited November 10, 2022 by Barking Spiders

[mrtcat]

5 minutes ago, EBS_freak said:

Theatre is still moderately buoyant. Wedding scene is largely unimpacted, corporate is well down. Everything else is crashing compared to where it was 3 or 4 years ago. People just aren't spending the money. At the lower budget end of the wedding scene, people that would have stretched to a band are mostly going for DJs.

 

Trouble is for me personally, I'm bored of where I am. Weddings are pretty frustrating in the fact that it's so formulaic and predictable. I can't complain, I've earned some good money over the years and like yourself, spent a few years doing the big NYE gigs. They don't even excite me anymore!

 

Your comment did make me smirk though - one of the things that angers me a lot about the wedding scene, is that it's basically becoming a bunch of scratch bands - and that really doesn't sit well with me. There's folk like yourself with a static lineup which is great - but then, the vast majority seem to be a bunch of musicians thrown together at the last minute, going out with scrappy gear. It's amazing how many of the "UK's Best Wedding Band" go out with inappropriate "Powerful PAs" (a couple of Behringer tops), a sorry excuse for "Amazing light show" (a couple of par cans) and sound absolutely awful and totally non representative of the promo material that they present. I don't think thats fair on the clients who have no doubt spent hours choosing their ideal band only for a band of deps to turn up. That's becoming the norm as more and more musicians scrabble about, ditching gigs for other gigs to earn another fiver. I don't want to be part of that scene, especially when I'm the one holding the contract. The whole thing has mostly become a joke anyway, it's a battle of the promo - and as you'll know and I've stated, the promo rarely represents the reality of what the band sounds like live. It peeves me off seeing all these super produced mega band promos where you can hear the vocalists have been tuned within an inch of their lives, vocal stacks for days, a million over dubs yiddah, yaddah, you know how it is. It's Richard Turpin stuff.

It's a real wild west out there and there are endless scratch bands with naff gear like you say. I couldn't work like that and I also couldn't work with musicians who mess the band around and ditch bookings they're already committed to for better paid gigs. Weddings are definitely very formulaic and are more about earning than a love of the music you are playing. They can however be fun if you all get along well and can be philosophical about the bad ones. For me, the worst thing is being in a band with a solid lineup who can perform a good set and own a quality PA system (we no longer own that massive old LD Systems rig thankfully) but then have to plug into a venue's system that makes it all sound terrible. I'd like to think our promo material is generally pretty honest and we do post quite a lot of live stuff too. My biggest ssue with our promo material is that it is produced by the agency who churn out endless carbon copy videos so all the bands look the same.

[EBS_freak]

Indeed - it’s a formulaic process from that agency for sure. It’s not particularly inspiring - but it does make it even more important that the lineups are static as it’s certainly not the difference in the look and feel that makes a band stand out. Mind you, with that agency, I don’t think they care. If it’s not broken and all that.  

[gjones]

4 hours ago, EBS_freak said:

 

 

 

 

Your comment did make me smirk though - one of the things that angers me a lot about the wedding scene, is that it's basically becoming a bunch of scratch bands - and that really doesn't sit well with me. There's folk like yourself with a static lineup which is great - but then, the vast majority seem to be a bunch of musicians thrown together at the last minute, going out with scrappy gear. It's amazing how many of the "UK's Best Wedding Band" go out with inappropriate "Powerful PAs" (a couple of Behringer tops), a sorry excuse for "Amazing light show" (a couple of par cans) and sound absolutely awful and totally non representative of the promo material that they present. I don't think thats fair on the clients who have no doubt spent hours choosing their ideal band only for a band of deps to turn up. That's becoming the norm as more and more musicians scrabble about, ditching gigs for other gigs to earn another fiver. I don't want to be part of that scene, especially when I'm the one holding the contract. 

A drummer I know has a band like that. He puts together several bands under the same name, with random musicians, depending on how many bookings he gets on the same date.

 

He calls them the A team, B team, C team etc depending on how competent and experienced the musicians are in each band.

 

He plays with the A team of course but gets his own cut from each of the other bands that are playing on the same night.

 

You wouldn't want to get the D team for your wedding. Les Dawson is on keyboards 🤣

Edited November 10, 2022 by gjones

[Muzz]

Looking up from my end, after a quiet year, mostly due to the winding-down of the main trio, as the singist/geetard has gone solo for double the money (and I don't blame him for a second), but I've found a new band (and I'm trying to get another rolling, too) with a full calendar, so, with a paid gig hosting a midweek jam night, too, I'll be doing 10 gigs in December...

[EBS_freak]

1 hour ago, gjones said:

A drummer I know has a band like that. He puts together several bands under the same name, with random musicians, depending on how many bookings he gets on the same date.

 

He calls them the A team, B team, C team etc depending on how competent and experienced the musicians are in each band.

 

He plays with the A team of course but gets his own cut from each of the other bands that are playing on the same night.

 

You wouldn't want to get the D team for your wedding. Les Dawson is on keyboards 🤣

Morally bankrupt isn’t it?

[bassbiscuits]

Two of the bands I play with have really wound down towards the end of this year, so my diary for 2023 currently contains no gigs at all, although I've got a few ideas on the go which will hopefully come to something in the meantime.

 

I'm lucky enough to be able to turn my hand to solo guitar/vocal gigs which have got me out of a tight spot before now. Might have to resurrect that a bit.

[la bam]

I got out of the corporate/wedding band thing after covid, I really started to dislike it and had a hankering for going back playing pubs where you connect better with the people there. I still do the tribute scene, but weddings and corporates are not for me anymore.

[The fasting showman]

On 07/11/2022 at 22:36, EBS_freak said:

I have never been so disinterested in gigging. I think covid really took the wind out of my musical sails and got me reevaluating what I want to do with my time. Couple that and dealing with people (music is never the problem, it’s the dealing with people that rips all joy from it) I’m just not excited for 2023 and the headaches it will no doubt bring.

 

Exactly where I'm at fellow Lichfieldian! See you down The Feathers...

 

[mrtcat]

12 hours ago, gjones said:

A drummer I know has a band like that. He puts together several bands under the same name, with random musicians, depending on how many bookings he gets on the same date.

 

He calls them the A team, B team, C team etc depending on how competent and experienced the musicians are in each band.

 

He plays with the A team of course but gets his own cut from each of the other bands that are playing on the same night.

 

You wouldn't want to get the D team for your wedding. Les Dawson is on keyboards 🤣

That really is pretty terrible. Depping one or, at a push, two members due to illness or unavoidable issues is one thing but depping whole bands is just misrepresentation. If our front man is ill or suddenly unavailable for a genuine reason then our agent will always notify the client and offer either a dep, a different band or a refund. The band has to look and sound as close as possible to what is advertised. 

[gjones]

4 hours ago, mrtcat said:

That really is pretty terrible. Depping one or, at a push, two members due to illness or unavoidable issues is one thing but depping whole bands is just misrepresentation. If our front man is ill or suddenly unavailable for a genuine reason then our agent will always notify the client and offer either a dep, a different band or a refund. The band has to look and sound as close as possible to what is advertised. 

He's a businessman who owns rehearsal rooms and hires PAs. His original wedding band was so successful that he got fed up turning people down. So he set up the second band so that he could take advantage of the demand and it just grew from there.

 

I was kidding about Les Dawson playing in the D team band 😂

[TimR]

I'm sure he will have a watertight contract that says he will just provide a band.

 

When I was married we just went with the house DJ. I wanted a band, but was overruled. 😆

 

To be fair, it's very difficult to find a band who play tonnes of modern tracks but aren't cheesy and can play for potentially a few hours. 

[chris_b]

If the musicians are good players and know what they are doing, then a scratch band is no worse than any other band and will be better than many.

[EBS_freak]

1 hour ago, chris_b said:

If the musicians are good players and know what they are doing, then a scratch band is no worse than any other band and will be better than many.

agreed up to a certain extent... but try telling that to an angry bride and groom who hate the "screeching sound" that the dep singer is making compared to the "buttery smooth tones" of that other singer in the promo. A dep is a dep. A dep band is something completely different.

 

or manage the dep bass player that turns up and slaps their way through every song...

 

or manage mr gospel chops on drums...

 

I've been in this game a long time and seen most iterations and sometimes unwittingly been involved in them - the most corrupt experience being 16 players meeting each other in the car park. We didn't even know each others names... but there was the charade of a band with promo that was nothing like and the supporting text that claimed the band had been playing together for 15 years.

[EBS_freak]

2 hours ago, TimR said:

I'm sure he will have a watertight contract that says he will just provide a band.

 

When I was married we just went with the house DJ. I wanted a band, but was overruled. 😆

 

To be fair, it's very difficult to find a band who play tonnes of modern tracks but aren't cheesy and can play for potentially a few hours. 

The contract usually points out that all members are able to be depped out - "to a same or better standard".

 

So makes all promo and associated marketing material meaningless really.

 

It's all about as useful as an agent's contract. (Spoiler, there isn't. They take the "desposit" their fee and broker the contracts between the client and the band. No repercussions on the agent - they don't have a contract with the client... the band does.

Edited November 11, 2022 by EBS_freak

[chris_b]

1 hour ago, EBS_freak said:

agreed up to a certain extent... but try telling that to an angry bride and groom who hate the "screeching sound" that the dep singer is making compared to the "buttery smooth tones" of that other singer in the promo. A dep is a dep. A dep band is something completely different.

 

or manage the dep bass player that turns up and slaps their way through every song...

 

or manage mr gospel chops on drums...

 

You can list as many extremes as you like. In my experience, with "good players" these situations don't occur. If you're not using "good players" then all bets are off. I'm not talking in general terms, but specifically saying you'll get a good band if you hire good players who know what they are doing.

[EBS_freak]

That's fine. You got your experiences, I got mine. I have played loads of gigs with deps on with no issues. There's defo been a shift post covid though.

 

Its not the capabilities of the players that are ever in question... it's whether they are actually dependable and reliable and know how to get the job done. It's largely a behavioural thing. The "best" musicians aren't necessarily the best musicians.

[scalpy]

We’re a function band with an established line up and a bank of regular deps who all know us. We’re up to 15 gigs for next year at pretty frequent intervals which is an improvement on our current lull post covid mania rebooking and some new gigs. It’s been a long slog for my wife who does all the promo etc, one of the biggest battles is being top of the search rankings which is where the agencies have us beat. I did one of those in the summer and wanted to hide the whole time- didn’t get the set until the day before, then the dep singer didn’t want to do most of them, then arrived to find the guitarist didn’t have most of the tracks, so spent an hour in the car park learning what he did have, sax player had no charts at all and noodled the whole gig. To cap it all there was no guitar in the in ear mix, so that coupled with unhelpful click guides made the whole thing torture. Best gig fee of the year….

[mrtcat]

There's agents and agents. Our agency usually comes really high on any search engine as it's one of the biggest. They absolutely do not allow bands to dep multiple members unless its an absolute emergency and they always speak with the client if the front person is unavailable. Yes they have the contract side of things absolutely sewn up but they aren't the band's enemy by any means. Our relationship with them is excellent and they really look after us. In the event of a client breaching the contract they will take over and have been excellent at making sure we get what we're owed. I don't doubt they would come after us if we were to breach an agreement but they have been extremely supportive throughout my time working with them. I am currently in my second band under the same agent and between the two bands have been with them for a total of 6 years now.