8x10 Conundrum

[SamPlaysBass]

I’ve recently acquired my dream head - an SVT CL. I love it to pieces already and is rendering many of my pedals semi-redundant as it’s made me realise how my pedalboard was entirely geared up to try and emulate the sounds of an SVT. Long story short, I’ve got the real McCoy (except for maybe an early 70s SVT) and I love it.

 

In the spirit of upgrades, I’m playing through Ashdown ABM 4x10 and 2x10 cabs which do the job admirably. However, I’ve always fancied an 8x10. I’ve played many over the years and I played through one on Saturday night. There’s something so visceral about the playing experience. The air moving around you, the monitoring that having speakers so close to the ear creates - I’m sold.

 

The only consideration for me regarding an 8x10 is weight, and it’s more for weight in the van rather than loading purposes (though that will inevitably be a factor). 

 

I’d love a Barefaced 8x10, but cost is prohibitive at the minute. 
 

Fender’s 8x10 Bassman Neo is a bit lighter and comes with a tweeter, and I always have the tweeters engaged for a bit of sizzle. I’ve read that the Fender 8x10 is a ported design and I’ve never played a ported 8x10 - any major sonic differences to the sealed SVT cab?

 

I’ve also heard from a couple of veteran bass player mates that the Orange 8x10 is a worthy contender and that the Ampeg SVT 610 HLF is a real gem in the lineup. Meanwhile, Talkbass rates the 410 HLF as a complete dog, which seems contradictory if the 610 is essentially the same design but with 2 extra speakers and is considered a bit of a darling in the range.

 

I’m fortunate enough to be in a position where an 8x10 makes sense (or a 6x10, if that seems more viable). The man maths checks out but before pulling the trigger, I thought I’d ask the Basschat hive mind about a good recommendation as I’ve always found the best advice from Basschat.

 

So, good 8x10 (or 6x10) cab recommendations for an SVT CL that isn’t going to make a full van burst its tyres? 
 

(Pic - current set up)

[Lozz196]

If you like your Ashdowns why not get one of their 610s or 810s?

 

From the cabs mentioned I’ve used Ampeg 610HLF and it was a really nice cab, same with the Fender 810 NEO, and of course the Ampeg 810, but having also helped move one I would never want one.

 

 

 

 

[fretmeister]

Can you stretch to a Barefaced 6x10?

Even on their website it says "get the 6x10 instead of the 8x10"

 

There's been a couple come up on here over the last year. Never seen a BF 8x10 on here though.

 

Sealed cabs do sound quite different to ported ones. Ampeg sound is a lot to do with the sealed cab. Not sure you'd be happy with a ported one.

[Downunderwonder]

A bass rig only needs to be as loud as the drums. A 4x10 is all you need.

 

Get thee to Barefaced Town where all the x10 cabs come with low passing on one side to avoid the nasty comb filtering of mids and beaming highs that come from the x10 format.

[Noisyjon]

@SamPlaysBass There's always the option of getting another identical 4x10 instead of the 2x10.

Personally I would look at that because you get the 8x10 but in a modular format which would be easier to move and use.

[SamPlaysBass]

1 hour ago, fretmeister said:

Can you stretch to a Barefaced 6x10?

Even on their website it says "get the 6x10 instead of the 8x10"

 

There's been a couple come up on here over the last year. Never seen a BF 8x10 on here though.

 

Sealed cabs do sound quite different to ported ones. Ampeg sound is a lot to do with the sealed cab. Not sure you'd be happy with a ported one.

I’ve often thought about the Barefaced 6x10 and they are a real contender. I’ve never used one, so I was wondering if by the magic that Alex manages to cram into them they achieve the same ear-level monitoring as an 8x10? I’m 5ft 9” and an SVT 8x10 is a great fit to be able to hear and feel the notes. The Barefaced looks quite squat but I’m aware, having owned a Compact many moons ago, of the design and engineering that goes into them. I don’t run an 8x10 particularly loud either, it’s a tactile/haptic thing about feeling the air and movement in my body. Otherwise I’d just wear in-ears all the time if it was purely for monitoring purposes.

 

Also, as much as I hate to ask as describing sounds is so much more difficult than actually hearing them for yourself, but what sonic differences are there between big sealed and ported cabs? 

[SamPlaysBass]

2 hours ago, Lozz196 said:

If you like your Ashdowns why not get one of their 610s or 810s?

 

From the cabs mentioned I’ve used Ampeg 610HLF and it was a really nice cab, same with the Fender 810 NEO, and of course the Ampeg 810, but having also helped move one I would never want one.

 

 

 

 

Again another great idea, I love that if a speaker ever goes pop then Mark, Dan and co. are the most helpful guys in the business for replacements and spares. They are heavy, though. Heavier than the Fender and on par with the Ampegs. 
 

Out of interest, any comments on the sound of the Fender? I’m used to Ampegs but if there is a way of shaving a few KG off, I’d be happy to entertain the thought. 

[Wilson_51_]

I have a svt cl and  had a barefaced 6x10 for a little bit. It was glorious but I never felt like I was pushing it in anyway, I ended up selling it because it was a pain to get it to gigs. I now use a two10 with my ampeg. 
 

I know it is tiny in comparison but I’ve found when at gigs I pop it on top of whoever’s cab is already there to raise it up and it’s mighty loud enough and gets the up to ear height feel of a big cab. It’s a lot cheaper and easier it shift around. 

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

27 minutes ago, SamPlaysBass said:

 I was wondering if by the magic that Alex manages to cram into them they achieve the same ear-level monitoring as an 8x10?

 

A pair of vertically stacked 2x10 will.

 

Quote

Also, as much as I hate to ask as describing sounds is so much more difficult than actually hearing them for yourself, but what sonic differences are there between big sealed and ported cabs? 

Sealed don't go as low. Where the bottom end is concerned a pair of ported 2x10 will match a sealed 8x10. 

[fretmeister]

41 minutes ago, SamPlaysBass said:

Again another great idea, I love that if a speaker ever goes pop then Mark, Dan and co. are the most helpful guys in the business for replacements and spares. They are heavy, though. Heavier than the Fender and on par with the Ampegs. 
 

Out of interest, any comments on the sound of the Fender? I’m used to Ampegs but if there is a way of shaving a few KG off, I’d be happy to entertain the thought. 

ported- more boomy bang 

sealed - less boom more gronky grindy squidge 

[SamPlaysBass]

26 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

ported- more boomy bang 

sealed - less boom more gronky grindy squidge 

This makes insanely good sense. Thank you, Fretmeister! 
 

Sealed would make more sense, less hard work for the sound engineer and less boom on stage. I’m lucky enough to be playing 500+ capacity venues fairly regularly so a big cab as much for looks as well as functionality. 

[SamPlaysBass]

48 minutes ago, Bill Fitzmaurice said:

A pair of vertically stacked 2x10 will.

 

Sealed don't go as low. Where the bottom end is concerned a pair of ported 2x10 will match a sealed 8x10. 

Thanks, Bill. Honoured to have input from a legend!  
 

In a roundabout way, I can see that an 8x10 is not the most efficient design by any stretch and two 2x10s will work well. However, I do worry about putting a big SVT on top of a couple of 2x10, although I could just leave it on the floor and save the backache of getting it up there in the first place. 

[Lozz196]

1 hour ago, SamPlaysBass said:

Again another great idea, I love that if a speaker ever goes pop then Mark, Dan and co. are the most helpful guys in the business for replacements and spares. They are heavy, though. Heavier than the Fender and on par with the Ampegs. 
 

Out of interest, any comments on the sound of the Fender? I’m used to Ampegs but if there is a way of shaving a few KG off, I’d be happy to entertain the thought. 

Yes it sounded very nice. Was at a gig so only had gig-sound experience but really nice cab.

[cetera]

My choice would be a Bergantino NV610. It's lighter, fantastically made and known as the SVT killer.

 

Look out for a used one at Bass Direct or here on Basschat.

 

https://www.bassdirect.co.uk/bass_guitar_specialists/Bergantino_NV610.html

 

 

[BigRedX]

50 minutes ago, SamPlaysBass said:

I’m lucky enough to be playing 500+ capacity venues fairly regularly so a big cab as much for looks as well as functionality. 

 

IME in venues that size the cab is entirely for looks. Why not build a mock 8x10 enclosure that can fold up for transport and can hold a smaller cab hidden inside for on-stage monitoring should you need it? Also IME you'll hear more from the PA foldback then you will from your backline unless you run it at insane levels.

[Happy Jack]

Yes folks, it's true! You need the all-new light-weight cheap-as-chips disposable Stadium Stack!

 

[thodrik]

As an owner of a Mesa 6x10 I can categorically state that in 2023, these kind of cabinets are completely unnecessary in this era of high powered compact cabinets and modern monitor systems and high powered venue PAs. I have also found that a heavy 6x10 is more awkward to move than an 8x10 because with it being shorter it is more difficult to tilt and slide into the back of a car/van. I generally use a single 1x15 for gigging. 

So why do I still own the 6x10? Quite simply the sound. Also, the idea of selling and shipping it is impractical. So it will never get sold, particularly as I got it for next to nothing. 

If I was looking at a new cabinet for an SVT, I would probably be looking at a Bergantino 4x10, Barefaced 4x10 or Ampeg SVT2x12 which is designed to sound like a mini 8x10 owing to the non-ported design. 

If you need an 8x10 and weight is a consideration? Definitely the Barefaced or (if you have £2,500 spare) EBS Neoline 8x10.

[BassAdder60]

I gigged the Ampeg SVT610 HLF and SVT CL for some time and it’s a perfect match 

 

Great rig 

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

3 hours ago, fretmeister said:

ported- more boomy bang 

sealed - less boom more gronky grindy squidge 

Not necessarily. Boom occurs in the 80-120Hz range, an octave above pant flapping lows. Ported cabs can be boomy, if they use drivers that don't have specs that are tailored for ported and/or the cab is tuned too high and/or it's too small. If anything sealed are more likely to have a response bump in the 80-120Hz range, while dropping off like a cliff below 80Hz. If you're used to the thin lows of sealed and prefer it that's fine, but where economy of size is concerned a pair of ported 2x10 will equal the low end output of a sealed 8x10, while you can cut back the lowest octave with EQ if that's your preferred tone. What you can't do is to boost the low end of a sealed cab with EQ to get those trousers flapping, as the drivers will run out of excursion.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

3 hours ago, SamPlaysBass said:

 I do worry about putting a big SVT on top of a couple of 2x10, although I could just leave it on the floor and save the backache of getting it up there in the first place. 

It saves your back and gets the cabs even higher, which is a good thing. 😉

[BassmanPaul]

I use a pair of 2x10s stacked on their ends for a vertical 4x10. The top cabinet lets me hear what I'm playing and both together disperse around the room far better.

[Downunderwonder]

The way to run a 210 vertical stack with a big tube amp is with a small shelf to stack the cabs on top of said tube amp. This saves the vents from being blocked and saves the amp case top from bowing under the weight. The shelf spreads the weight to the walls of the amp case.

[Japhet]

If you like the on stage monitoring of the 8x10 because it's at head height, why not use a flight-cased 4x10 and put the cab on top of the case? I've done that plenty of times.

[SamPlaysBass]

After some thought I’m set on a big cab, as impractical as they are…

 

Is an 8x10 an 8x10 or is there a ‘better’ and ‘worse’ cabs 8x10 cabs? 
 

 

[fretmeister]

8 minutes ago, SamPlaysBass said:

After some thought I’m set on a big cab, as impractical as they are…

 

Is an 8x10 an 8x10 or is there a ‘better’ and ‘worse’ cabs 8x10 cabs? 
 

 

 

 

Loads of difference! Different drivers, different bracing / construction, power handling.

Some are really two 4x10 that are joined together. Some are really eight 1x10 where each speaker is in it's own little box. Some are just a giant barely rigid shell.

 

If you are going to go full madman with this (me, jealous?) then save up and get the Barefaced. Then you get 1 column that have been LPF'd to get as much dispersion as possible, you get the lowest weight, and unlike the old heavy ones nobody wants, it will keep far more of it's value.

 

Do it once and do it properly.