Talk me out of going fretless

[madshadows]

Just don't fret about it !!  😛 

 

John 😎 

[DTB]

11 hours ago, dclaassen said:

I’m not sure why you would want to use rounds on a fretless. Could someone tell me?

My Jaco rep came with rounds and it’s what the manufacturer recommends. 
They are chewing up the fingerboard a little bit though, but it’s not that bad and I don’t like flats. 

[Cato]

I got decent at fretless just by having mine as the most reachable bass for home noodling.

 

Most of the time I don't do the 'mwah' thing at all, I'm just using it to work out or practice lines that weren't originally played on a fretless.

 

I don't want to get into the whole lined vs unlined thing but my personal experience was that having a lined fretless meant that I could intonate notes more or less accurately from day 1, albeit requiring a bit more concentration and care.

[Fishfacefour]

Definitely heading for a lined neck for that reason. 

[Boodang]

Apart from the sound, for my money, a fretless is more expressive. 

Lined fretless is a good place to start. If you can find one, get a s/h Squier vintage modified jazz fretless... it has a lined resin fingerboard which is glassy smooth. 

[Oomo]

I'd never talk you out of it, definitely worth a go!

 

A few things I found after playing a while that I hadn't initially considered though:

 

* the mwah type sound is great, but can feel a bit gimmicky after a while and not a good fit for many types of music

* better my intonation got, the less different it started sounding from my fretted bass (so I started wondering why I was bothering...)

* I found setups a bit more painful to do myself (getting the right level of buzz, avoiding dead spots, etc.)

* needs regular playing to keep intonation good (if I don't play mine for a week, I really notice how sloppy I sound...)

 

but they are great fun

[Fishfacefour]

Not going to go full on mwah I think as it definitely can sound gimmicky. I think I'm interested as a new challenge and to push my ear and technique. 

 

How do you approach a setup? I guess the intonation on a lined can be checked and the string height dictates the sound? 

[Barking Spiders]

I've had three fretlesses over the last 20 years - Dean, Vintage and Cort - and have sold all 3. I really only bought them because of the 'mwah' sounds of Mick Karn in Japan and Pino Palladino on No Parlez but you can't just play like that on every song. Other than the 'mwah' sound  I don't see much point in them. Might as well stick with fretted. Unlined fretlesses look cool admittedly, while lined ones are a bit like trainer wheels on bicycles.

[lownote]

Why fretless?  Makes playing a more crafty thing, less mechanical. 

 

You don't have to mwah....  I really dislike it.  

 

Think carefully about nut slot height. I have mine so I can drop the action and get 'mwah' if I want it, which is rare, but raise the action a tad and it sounds likle a normal bass.  For me around 0.3mm at the slot usually does.

For those who ask what's the point if you don't mwah, I would say you have the choice with very little adjustment.

 

I'm an unlined lover.  If you going to have lines you might as well have frets, IMHO only, obv.  But I would strongly urge you to consider buying one with dots on the notes: having to interpolate between the side dots to work out where the note is is just masochism.  It shouldn't cost much if you have to have the dots 'moved'. Bass Gallery charged me £30.

 

Cheap unlined fretlesses:  Revelation, Vintage V940FL.  

 

[Oomo]

26 minutes ago, Fishfacefour said:

Not going to go full on mwah I think as it definitely can sound gimmicky. I think I'm interested as a new challenge and to push my ear and technique. 

 

How do you approach a setup? I guess the intonation on a lined can be checked and the string height dictates the sound? 

 

Usually the same way as a fretted bass for intonation, though it's slightly trickier (even on lined), since the finger you press down is broader than a fret, so can be easy to be a bit sharp/flat depending on finger angle, etc. (I've heard some pros use a thin capo or metal ruler to press down at exactly the point they want, but haven't tried that).

 

I'm no expert, but I think it's a mix of string height and neck relief - I've usually got less relief that my fretted basses (i.e. as flat a neck as possible without buzzing), and enough to get enough buzz to give it a mwah sound. But I often screw it up

[Grahambythesea]

You should try fretless and if your a 5 string player, it might be better to get a 5 fretless. If you can find one the now discontinued Spector Spectorcore is a great choice. Comes as 4 & 5 lined ebony board with either EMG or Bartolini pickup and a Fishman Piezo bridge.  Or too expensive and high quality.

 

 

[Boodang]

2 hours ago, Barking Spiders said:

I've had three fretlesses over the last 20 years - Dean, Vintage and Cort - and have sold all 3. I really only bought them because of the 'mwah' sounds of Mick Karn in Japan and Pino Palladino on No Parlez but you can't just play like that on every song. Other than the 'mwah' sound  I don't see much point in them. Might as well stick with fretted. Unlined fretlesses look cool admittedly, while lined ones are a bit like trainer wheels on bicycles.

Well, a few points in their defense;

Mwah sound is not compulsory. I've got a fretless strung with roundwounds which has an ebony fingerboard, with a scooped eq you can even slap it.

The point of them? Well, to my mind they're more expressive than a fretted. Cello style vibrato and slides being the most obvious. And unlike a fretted the whole board is available to use not just the bit behind the fret.

And as for white fret lines, Jaco and Mark Egan were/are on training wheels for a very long time.

[lownote]

1 minute ago, Boodang said:

Well, a few points in their defense;

Mwah sound is not compulsory. I've got a fretless strung with roundwounds which has an ebony fingerboard, with a scooped eq you can even slap it.

The point of them? Well, to my mind they're more expressive than a fretted. Cello style vibrato and slides being the most obvious. And unlike a fretted the whole board is available to use not just the bit behind the fret.

And as for white fret lines, Jaco and Mark Egan were/are on training wheels for a very long time.

 

yes, but think where Jaco could have got to without lines

[tauzero]

16 hours ago, dclaassen said:

I’m not sure why you would want to use rounds on a fretless. Could someone tell me?

 

Because they sound better than flats.

[tauzero]

15 hours ago, chyc said:

If you're serious about being talked out of a purchase, I get the vibe that when you ruck up with a fretless bass, people think you're a show-off, whether rightly or wrongly. Bizarrely nobody seems to think that about a violin or cello player, but life isn't fair.

 

Really? I had been playing for a year with one band before they realised I was using a fretless.

[lownote]

8 minutes ago, tauzero said:

 

Really? I had been playing for a year with one band before they realised I was using a fretless.

 

I think with a knowledeable audience, like at blues club or jam, expectations are raised, just as they are if you rock up with a six.  It's kinda "you better know how to play that thing, man".  And TBH I know that because I'm guilty of that prejudice when I'm in the audience. On the positive side I find getting an unlined out at a jam yields at least one gasp of astonishment from someone, usually the younger and more impressionable. 

Edited February 13, 2023 by lownote

[tauzero]

On the lined versus unlined debate: my first three fretlesses were unlined, the next couple were defretted but with filler that was quite close to the fretboard colour, and I currently have four - a lined Sei Original, an edge-marked Ibanez SRF705, and an unlined Warwick Corvette (all 5-strings) and a Warwick Thumb 4-string which was one of the defretted ones but which I've since had a new plain fretboard fitted to. I'd prefer unlined but I can disregard the lines (I don't look at the front of the neck when I'm playing) and I had the dots on the Sei moved to the "fret" positions.

[Boodang]

16 hours ago, dclaassen said:

I’m not sure why you would want to use rounds on a fretless. Could someone tell me?

Mostly because rounds sound different to flats and having a fretless doesn't mean you have to put flats on it.

I've got a fretless with flats for that classic sound, and I have one with rounds, an ebony board, and when eq'd with scooped mids and boosted highs has a great slap tone.

Why would I use this instead of a fretted? Well, I prefer the expressiveness I get from a fretless.

[knirirr]

28 minutes ago, tauzero said:

 

Because they sound better than flats.

 

Although I realise that rounds are very popular, I've never understood why as I don't find the either the tone or the feel appealing, plus there is the finger noise to deal with.
My first bass was an unlined fretless, a long time ago. Eventually I sold it as I didn't like the tone, but it had rounds on and at the time I had no idea that flats existed and would have fixed that issue.
I've never got on with frets, it's almost always been unlined fretless, EUB or DB since.

[Beedster]

8 minutes ago, Boodang said:

Mostly because rounds sound different to flats and having a fretless doesn't mean you have to put flats on it.

I've got a fretless with flats for that classic sound, and I have one with rounds, an ebony board, and when eq'd with scooped mids and boosted highs has a great slap tone.

Why would I use this instead of a fretted? Well, I prefer the expressiveness I get from a fretless.

 

I've got four fretless basses two of which wear flats. No better or no worse than rounds, just different. Both types of string are good for finger style and slap on fretless, but I much prefer flats if I'm using a pick. If there's one advantage flats have over rounds on fretless is that the bass is less likely to have that characteristic fretless envelope, so if I'm playing a gig on fretless but don't want to sound like Jaco/Pino (tongue in cheek there BTW, perhaps I should say 'even less like Jaco/Pino'), I'll use flats 👍

[ezbass]

 

58 minutes ago, tauzero said:

 

Really? I had been playing for a year with one band before they realised I was using a fretless.

 

52 minutes ago, lownote said:

 

I think with a knowledeable audience... 

I was in a Pink Floyd tribute once and there were members of another Floyd tribute in the audience. Their bass player came up to me afterwards and asked how I got a particular tone on Mother, I had to tell him it was a fretless. I'd been playing the same bass all evening.

[Dad3353]

17 hours ago, dclaassen said:

I’m not sure why you would want to use rounds on a fretless. Could someone tell me?

 

It was delivered that way, and they haven't broken yet, soooooo... 

Edited February 13, 2023 by Dad3353

[Boodang]

4 hours ago, Beedster said:

 

I've got four fretless basses two of which wear flats. No better or no worse than rounds, just different. Both types of string are good for finger style and slap on fretless, but I much prefer flats if I'm using a pick. If there's one advantage flats have over rounds on fretless is that the bass is less likely to have that characteristic fretless envelope, so if I'm playing a gig on fretless but don't want to sound like Jaco/Pino (tongue in cheek there BTW, perhaps I should say 'even less like Jaco/Pino'), I'll use flats 👍

Yep, my favourite strings are the Galli Synthesis flats. Nylon cored and smooth as butter. I play rounds when the session demands but they suck @ss!!

[dclaassen]

8 hours ago, Grahambythesea said:

You should try fretless and if your a 5 string player, it might be better to get a 5 fretless. If you can find one the now discontinued Spector Spectorcore is a great choice. Comes as 4 & 5 lined ebony board with either EMG or Bartolini pickup and a Fishman Piezo bridge.  Or too expensive and high quality.

 

 

Feeling bad about letting it go?

[Grahambythesea]

1 hour ago, dclaassen said:

Feeling bad about letting it go?

No, I know it went to a good home and that you will make the most of it (I still like the P😁👍🏼)