Letts Bass

[TheGreek]

IIRC wasn't there an issue with delays with Jon Letts delivering orders to people who had paid for their custom builds. Is this right?

 

He has at least 3 basses for sale on the Reverb site

 

https://reverb.com/uk/item/66134166-letts-woden-ultra-lightweight-short-scale-5-string-bass-guitar-handcrafted-in-the-uk-2023?bk=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJqdGkiOiI2NDU0ODlkNC1iM2U0LTQ4ZTUtOTRhNS0zZDc2YzZjMDNiNjMiLCJpYXQiOjE2NzkxNzI1NTIsInVzZXJfaWQiOiIxMTMwOTM1NyIsInNlc3Npb25faWQiOiI0ZjVmMGZmOC0zODQ3LTQ0NmEtOTkxNy1lODY1MzcwOWVhZmEiLCJjb29raWVfaWQiOiI3NjVlYjk3OS1jYzU1LTQxZjAtOTAwOS0zYjUyNjg1NzgwMmIiLCJwcm9kdWN0X2lkIjoiNjYxMzQxNjYiLCJzb3VyY2UiOiJOT05FIn0.bolw4j5D0jGTgOrL1s-l_UFPENjGS_RNKpsWP8N8bpM

 

https://reverb.com/uk/item/66693499-letts-mini-headless-fretless-bass-guitar-handcrafted-in-the-uk-2023?bk=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJqdGkiOiI2ZWRkNDViZC1hYjg4LTRiY2QtODk4OS04MzdlNjRkODc2ZWEiLCJpYXQiOjE2NzkxNzI1NTIsInVzZXJfaWQiOiIxMTMwOTM1NyIsInNlc3Npb25faWQiOiI0ZjVmMGZmOC0zODQ3LTQ0NmEtOTkxNy1lODY1MzcwOWVhZmEiLCJjb29raWVfaWQiOiI3NjVlYjk3OS1jYzU1LTQxZjAtOTAwOS0zYjUyNjg1NzgwMmIiLCJwcm9kdWN0X2lkIjoiNjY2OTM0OTkiLCJzb3VyY2UiOiJOT05FIn0.U1bVO-CqgnmZI-8qD_gEBWETACS6Lo16QSftlxY907k

 

https://reverb.com/uk/item/66185720-letts-woden-ultra-lightweight-short-scale-fretless-4-string-bass-guitar-handcrafted-in-the-uk-2023?bk=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJqdGkiOiI1Y2M5YWE4MC0xYzU4LTQyYTktOTI1Zi0xYjY4MjY2Y2JkNGIiLCJpYXQiOjE2NzkxNzI1NTIsInVzZXJfaWQiOiIxMTMwOTM1NyIsInNlc3Npb25faWQiOiI0ZjVmMGZmOC0zODQ3LTQ0NmEtOTkxNy1lODY1MzcwOWVhZmEiLCJjb29raWVfaWQiOiI3NjVlYjk3OS1jYzU1LTQxZjAtOTAwOS0zYjUyNjg1NzgwMmIiLCJwcm9kdWN0X2lkIjoiNjYxODU3MjAiLCJzb3VyY2UiOiJOT05FIn0.uMmGV-JhAZDRoFX0XjzsqfUvjQLh92MgzhSrmYN3hmM

[Count Bassy]

Personal opinion only, but my God those are ugly basses.

[nilorius]

Design and sound is always your own choice. I have never touched or heard this guy instruments, so i have nothing to say. The 1st. one looks better than 2 and 3. to me.

Edited March 18, 2023 by nilorius

[itu]

27" scale, these are tiny.

[TheGreek]

IIRC a number of BCers were burnt after handing over money for basses which they never saw and arguments about having their money returned. 

 

I believe there's a thread somewhere. 

[fretmeister]

I remember that!

[TheGreek]

You may want to jump to page 7 for the name and shame and page 11 for the outcome.

 

Edited March 18, 2023 by TheGreek

[BassTractor]

.

Edited March 19, 2023 by BassTractor

[miles'tone]

...put on your red muse and play the blues 🎸

 

(Sorry just woke up)

 

 

Edited March 19, 2023 by miles'tone
Dad joke filter slow to boot up

[Matt P]

I was one of those that ordered a bass from Jon before it all went t!ts up, I did actually get my bass ( a bit later than promised but i considered myself fortunate that mine was delivered)

 

Mine is a 5 string fretted singlecut through neck with the Letts pickups and it's been my workhorse since I got it. the tone and fit and finish are pretty good, if a fretless popped up secondhand i'd be tempted as iI played one back before the problems and it was very nice.

 

I'm not sure if i'd pay 3k for one of the shortscales he has for sale though, as much as i love short scale basses 27" is too short for me.

 

 

Matt

[oldslapper]

45 minutes ago, Matt P said:

 

 

I'm not sure if i'd pay 3k for one of the shortscales he has for sale though, as much as i love short scale basses 27" is too short for me.

 

 

Matt

Blimey that’s over £100 an inch. 

I’ll leave that there. See if anyone picks it up 🫵😇

[LukeFRC]

On 18/03/2023 at 21:59, TheGreek said:

IIRC a number of BCers were burnt after handing over money for basses which they never saw and arguments about having their money returned. 

 

I believe there's a thread somewhere. 

 while I wouldn’t touch him with a barge pole and would suggest anyone interested read the thread…

the guy messed up big time - but that’s sadly not uncommon with people taking too much on and overstretching themselves…. And if this is his income he still deserves to eat, and finished basses via reverb isn’t a bad way of doing it and making sure he doesn’t mess up again

[asingardenof]

On 18/03/2023 at 21:26, Count Bassy said:

Personal opinion only, but my God those are ugly basses.

It's not just you, they look awful.

[asingardenof]

2 hours ago, Matt P said:

...as much as i love short scale basses 27" is too short for me.

It's dangerously close to guitar territory

[cyril233]

Did he reopen the business? I'm quite interested in the 2-string basses he built. Great value for price too imo.

[binky_bass]

8 hours ago, cyril233 said:

Did he reopen the business? I'm quite interested in the 2-string basses he built. Great value for price too imo.

From personal experience, I'd swerve anything made by Jon. 

 

The bass I eventually got from him (after having to resort to sending him a Letter Before Action) was not playable, the bridge was fixed and the intonation was way off - not a useable bass. The build quality was passable, but quite amateur in comparison to the likes of ACG, Shuker, Overwater etc. 

 

Horses for courses and such, but I'd not go near one of his instruments again for numerous reasons. 

[ead]

i had a 4-string fretless Letts bass, bought ex stock before his difficulties.  Nice bass tbh; very light and actually nicely made too.

 

 

 

[EddieG]

This is the first time I've noticed this thread about Letts, but I feel absolutely duty-bound to jump in with my story, which if the person reading has any kind of sense will see them avoid this thief. Because that's exactly what he is, and I'm talking from first-hand experience. This will be spread over a couple of replies, because it simply can't be told in one. 

 

I came across Jon Letts in June 2013 and like most on here, couldn't believe a guy was charging so little for custom work. With my 40th birthday impending the missus agreed to me ordering from him, and after some back and forth I agreed the details of a custom 33" scale neck-through 5-string, paid him the deposit, paid above the normal price for a decent top and my own choice of neck laminates, and he said he'd order the materials and get started.
 

He talked a good game, and so after some more chat and his guarantee that paying in full up front would punt my order to the top of the pile, (like a moron) I transferred the balance in good faith. At first he would keep in touch regularly, let me know when the woods arrived etc, but it wasn't long before problems began...

 

Letts disappeared, and it was hard to get hold of him. Now and again I'd see his website updated, at one point with the materials for my bass. I kept seeing him and his stooge Brent appearing here to answer questions and tout for more business, while I was waiting for word on mine. He gave me a deadline of 24 weeks on the invoice which, as it got closer I started to press him on when it would be done. Eventually, he started sending me photos, as the deadline came and went. But seeing some progress, I felt a bit more comfortable that he would deliver what I paid for. So I didn't press him too hard, and let him carry on. 

[EddieG]

Letts began disappearing more regularly, and I noticed more and more unhappy customers on here and elsewhere. 
 

2013 dropped into 2014, and at the beginning of February Letts sent me a photo of where he was at so far, and it became obvious to me that something was very wrong with the bass. So I emailed him to point it out; I ordered a neck through, but the neck blank he sent me photos of was FAR too short for that!

 

After a couple of days he emailed back, admitting that he'd gone ahead and built the neck for a glue-in build! And this was despite having looked at the order!!

Letts tried to tell me there was a way he could "make it work", but I told him it was a deal breaker, and he agreed to start again. 
In the meantime, he completed the bass with the materials he originally had for mine, and sold it on with a glued in neck, which he had to in order to recoup the material costs again to correct the mistake with mine. You may have seen the demo video of this bass which used to be up on YouTube.

 

At this point Letts started talking about how things would "cut into his profits ha ha", somehow trying to twist it that my insistence on him sticking to my order and him needing to pay to rectify his mistake was my fault!!

 

Anyway, on the 22nd February, my father collapsed with a massive brain haemorrhage, and I spent his last hours with him at his bedside. In the midst of handling all that, I was still dealing with the Letts fiasco, which rumbled on, with Letts now gathering more materials at his own cost. But I decided to go up to a buckeye burl top on the bass, paid for it from Cook Woods, and had it delivered to Letts. The neck laminate layout was different as he insisted he couldn't get the same ones as previously, though it's fairly obvious that he didn't want to pay for them. 

 

[EddieG]

Letts sent me photos of the wood for the replacement bass, and at one point had it as the front page of his website. I thought that given things had been clarified, coupled with his assurances that he would bash on and fulfil my order (which was now WELL overdue), I would have a finished bass in my hands before the end of the year. 
 

I was wrong. Very wrong. 
 

Letts got even more sketchy, and over the course of 2014 it became harder and harder to get hold of him. I kept seeing more and more unrest online about him not answering customers back who'd paid for basses. The excuses started coming thick and fast from him; helping his mother move house, kids being off on holidays and even his son's supposed ongoing medical conditions (later, he even sunk as low as using his brother's DEATH from meningitis).

 

2014 edged into 2015, after Letts himself telling me he'd had an issue with a customer (should have been a red flag!), suddenly his website and Facebook page were gone. I emailed him and was assured that he was still working on the bass. He began changing logos constantly, changing names etc, and I began getting very concerned. So I started being more forceful, and told him I was insisting on a delivery date, which he accepted. 
But shortly after that, the real problems began...

[chris_b]

On 18/03/2023 at 21:59, TheGreek said:

IIRC a number of BCers were burnt after handing over money for basses which they never saw and arguments about having their money returned. 

 

I believe there's a thread somewhere. 

 

There are also threads about similar instances of customers experiencing difficulties and his "behaviour" on Talkbass.

[EddieG]

It's now 2015, and still no bass. Letts would now start using any and every diversionary tactic and excuse he possibly could to explain why the bass was now OVERDUE BY MORE THAN A YEAR, and still nowhere near to being finished. He started falling on various sob stories and the excuse of his home life getting in the way constantly (not my problem!), then I started seeing posts on social media about how he likely "soon won't have a workshop". Concerned again, I emailed him and got the usual nonsensical excuses, "I'm trying to finish it, things are difficult" etc. Just a complete pack of lies, really.

 

But then in the first months of 2015 he sent me a couple of updates, and suddenly things started to look promising. What was a pile of wood now started to look like an actual bass!

 

Obviously he had a bit of wind at his back here, because he kept in touch a bit more at this point, and after almost two years it finally looked like I might be getting my bass after all.

 

[EddieG]

And then, in December 2015, he did it again....he messed it up. 
I paid for Hipshot single string bridges. When building the bass, Letts hadn't allowed for the height of these bridges in regards to the fretboard, so when it came to fitting them, it was an absolute physical impossibility. He'd messed the build up yet again, and yet again the only way to repair it would be him getting more materials.

The plan he offered was to lay a top right across the centre block, which I absolutely did not want. In fact, at this point and after all of the hassles that I'd gone through with him, I refused any concessions that would take me away from the bass I paid for.

 

From this point on, Letts offered nothing more than excuse after excuse as to why he couldn't rectify the mistake and complete my order. I was adamant I wanted what I wanted, and while he offered only excuses I kept seeing him complete instruments and have them online, which I pulled him up about frequently. 
 

The excuses carried on and on over the course of 2016. Back and forward constantly, and I strongly suspected at this point that his position was that he wasn't going to finish it.
Eventually, after being as forceful as possible and pushing him to complete, and warning him of the possible outcome heading his way, while all the time he continued to ignore communication, I was left with no other choice but to take court action, which was successful. 

 

 

Edited January 30 by EddieG

[EddieG]

I was awarded all of my money, plus costs against him. You'd think at this point that Letts would learn his lesson, pay back the money, and put an end to the situation, right?

 

Wrong!

 

Every month I would get excuse after excuse from him why he couldn't pay. It got to the point I had to send bailiffs to his address, to whom he claimed he had no money at all.
At one point I made a deal for him to build me a neck and I would take the cost off the outstanding amount, which he actually did.

I later suggested he build me a bass worth the outstanding amount of £1015, which he agreed to. But very soon the old Letts emerged again, the excuses started, and then during the pandemic he begged me to hold off payments as he claimed not to be earning....while unbeknown to me he was setting up his Reverb page on the side, and selling basses. Like an idiot, I agreed to it.

In February 2021, my mother died of breast cancer. I told Jon about this when it happened; I really needed that money back as I had immediate costs connected with her funeral.

I didn't get it. He didn't even try to pay. 

 

And that's where I currently stand. I'm now in the process of going through the court system yet again to pursue him. In the meantime, Letts is making videos on YouTube and trying to portray himself as an honest luthier, when the reality is that he still owes me a great deal of money, and I know of two other people he took for every penny they paid him. One gentleman who lives outside of the UK, paid the full amount as well which I think was more than me. Letts took him for the whole lot, because he knew this man had no legal recourse to get it back that was financially viable. 
 

The story of my dealings with Letts has much more detail than I posted here, but I've compressed it enough to give you an idea. I basically spent 4 years chasing Letts for a bass, and almost 6 years trying to get my money back. 
 

So when you're seeing that Jon Letts is advertising basses, and you think it might be worth dealing with him, let me give you some advice; DON'T.

 

Thanks for reading. 

[Machines]

I note the reverb items have been pulled, and YouTube videos deleted.