Escalating Prices

[CookPassBabtridge]

Warwick are a good example of this situation for me. In my opinion their Teambuilt GPS models used to represent good value for money, but new their prices are pretty eye watering now. They were also notorious for not holding their value second hand but are now often advertised used for more than they cost new a few years ago. I went to view a particular limited edition second hand model 2/3 years ago with an asking price of £1k. I’ve seen an identical one advertised here for £1800. 

[Ralf1e]

14 hours ago, nige1968 said:

 

I got a couple of cans of Heinz tomato soup going if anyone's interested. £150 a tin? After all, in a few years it will be vintage.

I have most of a box of instant Chinese noodles (shrimp flavour) out of date by a few months so already vintage.

I will swap them for a good Precision. Preferably fretless

[nige1968]

36 minutes ago, Ralf1e said:

I have most of a box of instant Chinese noodles (shrimp flavour) out of date by a few months so already vintage.

I will swap them for a good Precision. Preferably fretless

 

Love a good noodle me -- I'm in. Any interest in trades for a Cleartone Conversions 7-to-6string "Big Hander"? Cost £600 back in the day.

[Waddo Soqable]

1 hour ago, nige1968 said:

 

Love a good noodle me -- 

 

Mmm.. Bombay Bad Boy.. (or the sweet & sour one) 

Out of date? Who cares they'd prob last for decades and be fine.. 

[uncle psychosis]

One thing which magnifies the problem in my eyes is the way Reverb and eBay work. 

 

You only pay fees when you sell, and items can sit there forever, so there's literally zero cost to listing things at stupid prices and chancing your arm. 

 

Its a stupid policy that encourages chancers IMO. 

 

 

 

 

[BigRedX]

What's wrong with chancers?

[Paolo85]

Admittedly I look at eBay and Reverb only occasionally, mostly for stuff that is up to £500-600 new. I never bumped into something offered at an interesting price. The differences with new prices are so small that it does not make sense. I am not sure this harms the market though. As you can see on BC, if a seller really wants to sell the price gets reduced and fairly quickly. If the bass sells, clearly somebody thought it was worth the money

[Barking Spiders]

On 26/03/2023 at 19:34, Rayman said:

I’m wondering if the current crazy upwardly directional prices of bass guitars is disproportionate to the increase of the cost of living and manufacturing?

 

 I mean, not that long ago you could pick up a Stingray for 6/700 quid? And an MIT Yamaha BB1100 for example, might have been 3/400 tops…. Now you can double those prices. I’ve had a bunch of BBs, inc a couple of 1100s…. they’re alright? Decent like? But a grand for a Made in Taiwan model? Nah mate.

 

So why are basses commanding such high premiums now? The used market, especially on here, used to be full of bargains! Now, you need a couple of grand in your back pocket while searching the ads?

 I've been selling off much of my collection of basses and guitars so have been very pleased to have been able to sell at much higher prices this year than say 2 years ago. Fr'instance I sold a 4-year old Sub Ray 4 for pretty much the same price I bought it for. The higher prices are pretty much entirely due to the hangover  from Covid impacting on shipping costs and the much longer lead times UK retailers have been reporting. Guy at my local store told me he's been experiencing lead times up from 3-4 weeks to 6 months plus at least a quadrupling in container costs.

[Bassfinger]

And don't forget what the tabloids are calling "greedflation", unscrupulous retailers hitching their own extra percentage on the back of inflationary price rises.

[Waddo Soqable]

1 hour ago, Bassfinger said:

And don't forget what the tabloids are calling "greedflation", unscrupulous retailers hitching their own extra percentage on the back of inflationary price rises.

Greedflation.. great term, I've not heard that one, but fairly obviously there's a lot of it about.. 

[Rayman]

5 hours ago, Bassfinger said:

And don't forget what the tabloids are calling "greedflation", unscrupulous retailers hitching their own extra percentage on the back of inflationary price rises.

Like Holidays companies, airlines, holiday home owners hiking their prices during peak holiday periods….. when in the off season it’s half the price for the same option….. should be illegal that.

[Bassfinger]

4 hours ago, Waddo Soqable said:

Greedflation.. great term, I've not heard that one, but fairly obviously there's a lot of it about.. 

It's reckoned by some sources that greedflation - or excessive rises in corporate profits - is a bigger contribution to inflation than other oft stated factors (not naming factors, don't want to wander onto the realm of the political)...

 

https://views-voices.oxfam.org.uk/2023/01/greedflation/

 

[Waddo Soqable]

5 minutes ago, Bassfinger said:

It's reckoned by some sources that greedflation - or excessive rises in corporate profits - is a bigger contribution to inflation than other oft stated factors (not naming factors, don't want to wander onto the realm of the political)...

 

https://views-voices.oxfam.org.uk/2023/01/greedflation/

 

Very interesting link that 👍

[40hz]

I maintain the Bass/Guitar market is heading for an 'event' (I stop short of saying 'crash').

 

Prices were already rising very sharply, year on year, before COVID (and that's just accelerated it). My concern, that I often gripe about, is given these rises year on year, if it continues at this rate, as I'm sure it will, we can't be more than 3-4 years away from the average person being unable to afford/justify all but the cheapest options. Musicman stingrays are at 3k. Fender USA Standards at 2k, Warwick Teambuilt at 2-3k (just as examples). We have import lines now breaching the £1000 mark.

 

I just don't see how this is all sustainable.

Edited March 29, 2023 by 40hz

[Dad3353]

7 minutes ago, 40hz said:

I maintain the Bass/Guitar market is heading for an 'event'. I stop short of saying crash. Prices were already rising very sharply, year on year, before COVID (and that's just accelerated it). My concern, that I often gripe about, is given these rises year on year, if it continues at this rate, as I'm sure it will, we can't be more than 3-4 years away from the average person being unable to afford/justify all but the cheapest options. Musicman stingrays are at 3k. Fender USA Standards at 2k, Warwick Teambuilt at 2-3k (just as examples). We have import lines now breaching the £1000 mark.

 

I just don't see how this is all sustainable.

 

'Back in the day', pro-level basses and guitars were only for those with deep pockets, so not much has changed in that respect. The more affordable instruments, though, are now of a very high quality, compared to daze of yore. The high 'pro' price is maybe just to differentiate them, as I suspect that real production costs are very similar across the range (I'm excluding 'custom' or boutique' basses, here...). I couldn't afford a new Precision then, and can't afford a new Precision now. 

[40hz]

34 minutes ago, Dad3353 said:

 

'Back in the day', pro-level basses and guitars were only for those with deep pockets, so not much has changed in that respect. The more affordable instruments, though, are now of a very high quality, compared to daze of yore. The high 'pro' price is maybe just to differentiate them, as I suspect that real production costs are very similar across the range (I'm excluding 'custom' or boutique' basses, here...). I couldn't afford a new Precision then, and can't afford a new Precision now. 

I don't disagree at all. Maybe this prolonged period of wage suppression has a lot to do with it too.

[linear]

The thing that I don't understand is what happens to all the old basses?  Not the 'vintage' Fenders and what have you, but all of the other ones.  Where do they all go?  It's not like they rust away.  Surely by now there must be more bass guitars in existence than people who actually want one.

[Lozz196]

In 1987 I bought my first “real” bass, a Yamaha BB1100s, was £400. Fender Precisions were about £325 (and out of stock hence the Yammy purchase).

Now at that time a pint of beer was about 70p so a Precision was equal to approximately 460 pints.

Nowadays a pint is around a fiver and a Precision is about £1700, so approximately 340 pints.

 

 

[uncle psychosis]

10 hours ago, BigRedX said:

What's wrong with chancers?

 

Nothing, really. People can do whatever they like with their own possessions, I just find the resulting distortion of the market a bit frustrating.  The asking prices on reverb are becoming mental---I was looking at Boss OC-5 pedals the other week. They're £150 posted brand new, or you could buy one of the two second hand ones listed on reverb for £140 plus postage. 🙈🙉🙊

 

 

Edited March 28, 2023 by uncle psychosis

[Dad3353]

Some forty-odd years ago now, we returned to the UK for a family visit. During a shopping trip to Tesco, I came across a pack of four potatoes, sized for oven roasting, in a plastic tray. I couldn't help exclaiming out loud at the price of £3.99 on the label: that's one pound per spud..! In my mind, that pound would have bought well over a stone of spuds at the greengrocers, back in Shepperton when I lived there. Prices creep up all the time, but we don't really notice it, it seems, and the decades slide by, untilwe are made rudely aware of these increases with a sharp awakening shock.

 

I've just looked it up; a stone of spuds in 1971 would have cost between 6s6d (35p...) and 11s.(55p...). The same spuds now are between 12 and 35 times dearer. A tenner or more for a stone of 'taters..! Cost of living, eh..? 

[Chaddy]

On 27/03/2023 at 19:52, casapete said:

I’ve been watching this thread with interest, especially as I’m currently looking for a bass for a 

friend of mine. He is a beginner, and asked me to help him find a bass. When he said how much

will he need to pay, I said probably around £100 which is what I thought it would cost to find him

a Squier Affinity or something similar. Been looking for a few days, and haven’t seen anything 

half decent for less than £150 or more. It would seem that even the budget end of the market

has not been immune to a big hike.
(I’ll maybe take a look at Thomann for a Harley Benton or something, but would have preferred

to have a go on a bass before buying.)

Loads of Ibanez basses for sale mate

[Chienmortbb]

On 27/03/2023 at 09:33, thebassist said:

According to Google, 2023 inflation rates so far for the following:

• UK is 6.1%
• France is 6.3%
• Germany is 8.7%
• USA is 6%
• Canada is 5.2%
• Australia is 5.5%
• New Zealand is 7.5%
• Norway is 6.3%
• Switzerland is 3.4%
• Japan is 3.3%

Personally I don't think its because of Brexit, Trump, Biden or any one government - these developed countries have governments spanning the spectrum of ideologies.

 

While it's far, far, far more complicated with many more factors involved, I think this inflation is, predominantly, down to the aftermath of covid and the Russia/Ukraine conflict.

The 6.1% figure is for Food inflation in the UK I believe as the RPI and CPI are both other 10% and have been for months.

[Chienmortbb]

11 hours ago, Dad3353 said:

Some forty-odd years ago now, we returned to the UK for a family visit. During a shopping trip to Tesco, I came across a pack of four potatoes, sized for oven roasting, in a plastic tray. I couldn't help exclaiming out loud at the price of £3.99 on the label: that's one pound per spud..! In my mind, that pound would have bought well over a stone of spuds at the greengrocers, back in Shepperton when I lived there. Prices creep up all the time, but we don't really notice it, it seems, and the decades slide by, untilwe are made rudely aware of these increases with a sharp awakening shock.

 

I've just looked it up; a stone of spuds in 1971 would have cost between 6s6d (35p...) and 11s.(55p...). The same spuds now are between 12 and 35 times dearer. A tenner or more for a stone of 'taters..! Cost of living, eh..? 

Over history the value of money has halved per decade to 35-56P woukld now be £5.60- £11.20?

[Velarian]

13 hours ago, linear said:

Surely by now there must be more bass guitars in existence than people who actually want one.

Yes but those who actually want one, will probably want 2, 3, 4, 5 etc. 😉

 

I have at least 7 more than I need. I should sell some but I’m waiting for the prices to go up 😂 (not actually true; I’d be happy to get somewhere close to what I paid for them).

[Rich]

On 27/03/2023 at 18:05, drTStingray said:

From my own experience - prices of Stingrays - early 2000s (NB certain models may be more - there are more than just a 3 band 4 string)

 

Used - £750

New - £1300

Pre EB - £1750

 

Now

 

Used - £1500

New (Stingray Special only available) - £2900

Pre EB - £3500

 

 

In the late 80s, I saw a pre EB Ray advertised for £250. I ummed and ahhed and walked away. *slaps self very hard*