Which wireless?

[redbandit599]

1 hour ago, Chienmortbb said:

The Harley Benton seems OK . I have had one for about 6 months https://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_airborne_pro_5.8ghz_instrument.htm

I sold my GLXD and Smoothhound and went for one of these. It's been great.

[Happy Jack]

11 hours ago, BassAdder60 said:

Limited space at venue to move much but no leads to stand on or singer to trip over !! 
 

 

 

How dare you stand in front of the singer?

Bassists! Know your place!

 

[peteb]

3 hours ago, Al Krow said:

Given just how important a desk (and PA) is to band's sound, it just feels the wrong priority to be spending £500 on a wireless just for the bass, when you and I have both spent less on our mixing desk?

 

 

Generally speaking, your sound is only as good as the weakest link in your chain (from bass to cab / PA speaker). I play in a number of bands and to me it makes sense to keep my signal chain as simple as possible, but with the best individual components I can realistically afford. I don't use any pedals these days, apart from a compressor and a tuner. However, I do have a basic pedalboard, just in case a gig comes up where I need a few FX.

 

To me, using is a good wireless system is a worthwhile investment as it makes gigging a lot easier and it has paid for itself many times over as far as I'm concerned. Generally I leave the responsibility of providing a good PA to the band I'm playing with or the promoter (although I do have a reasonable mixer amp for rehearsals or small gigs, just in case). 

 

[Happy Jack]

I've read through this thread with great interest, but like @Al Krow I'm reluctant to spend well over £500 on a wireless system. And I can't really avoid mentioning to @peteb that the weakest link in my chain is ... erm ... well, me actually.

 

With my rock'n'roll band every gig is a doubling gig and I need something different to be happening at the amp for double bass and electric bass. That means that wireless solutions get doubled, doubled in number of units, doubled in cost. Much as I'd like to go the Shure route, buying two of those buggers is a bridge too far.

 

I've had easily the best results (out of the many, many solutions I've tried) with the X-vive U2 units. They're cheap enough that running two pairs of them isn't much of an issue, the rechargeable batteries are always good for a 3-hour gig plus encores with much-reduced 'green' issues, they're tiny and really simple to use, and they work just fine at 80%, maybe 90% of the gigs I play.

 

But every now and then we get something like last night. The editing here is designed to draw the viewer's attention away from the issue so watch for me getting all distracted.

 

 

At that point we were 35 minutes into the first set and there had been no issues at all. So what happened?

Well we can't know for sure but I did notice that a group of half a dozen youngsters came into the Club pretty much then and sat quite close to the band, mobiles in use. An easy finger to point but I don't recall anything else changing.

 

At the end of the set I shifted to cable leads for the rest of the gig, and this morning I put a Line 6 receiver that I had knocking about (once owned by @PaulKing) on my pedal board so that I can shift over to it mid-set if it happens again.

 

The combined cost of both sets of X-vive stagebugs PLUS both high-quality cable leads PLUS the Line 6 wireless unit is still  less than the cost of the Shure ...

 

[peteb]

2 hours ago, Happy Jack said:

I've read through this thread with great interest, but like @Al Krow I'm reluctant to spend well over £500 on a wireless system. And I can't really avoid mentioning to @peteb that the weakest link in my chain is ... erm ... well, me actually.

 

 

Due, the best and worst part of any signal chain is always the player. 

 

2 hours ago, Happy Jack said:

I've had easily the best results (out of the many, many solutions I've tried) with the X-vive U2 units.

 

I've got an X-vive U2 system next to me right now that I picked up for £30 off eBay for use with my little practice amp on my desk. I got it because I was sick of damaging leads by running over with my workstation chair. I've used it a couple of times for rehearsals, but to be honest, I wouldn't trust it on a gig. 

 

Edited July 30, 2023 by peteb

[markbunney]

3 hours ago, redbandit599 said:

I sold my GLXD and Smoothhound and went for one of these. It's been great.

How do you find the battery life on this?

[markbunney]

Thanks, how do you find the battery life on it?

[markbunney]

4 hours ago, BlueMoon said:

I use this as back up. Seems to fit the bill at £100 ………but have never had to test it out except in rehearsals.

 

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/SubZero-Digital-Wireless-Guitar-Pedal-System/36K1?_gl=1*1jkmxiu*_ga*MTk0MDk0NTI3MS4xNjkwNzQwNjM5*_up*MQ..*_ga_0WF1R5QW3K*MTY5MDc0MDYzOC4xLjEuMTY5MDc0MDg2My4wLjAuMA..

 

Not affiliated with seller!

Thanks, how do you find the battery life on this?

[redbandit599]

11 minutes ago, markbunney said:

Thanks, how do you find the battery life on it?

It's fine. We usually play two sets, anything up to about 2 1/2  hours in total. I tend to stick the transmitter on to the unit to top it up in the break, but I have forgotten before and it's been fine.

The Shure has epic battery life, but just didn't work well for me.

[Al Krow]

2 minutes ago, redbandit599 said:

It's fine. We usually play two sets, anything up to about 2 1/2  hours in total. I tend to stick the transmitter on to the unit to top it up in the break, but I have forgotten before and it's been fine.

The Shure has epic battery life, but just didn't work well for me.

 

What was the issue with the Shure for you?

I was going to ask how the HB compared to the Shure and it seems you're actually happier with the HB?

[BlueMoon]

8 hours ago, markbunney said:

Thanks, how do you find the battery life on this?

Transmitter is on a small pedalboard with supplied power. Receiver still works fine after 3 hours and can be charged via the docking station on the transmitter, even independent of supplied power. I have not used the rig in one session beyond 3 hours, to be fair.

[redbandit599]

9 hours ago, Al Krow said:

 

What was the issue with the Shure for you?

I was going to ask how the HB compared to the Shure and it seems you're actually happier with the HB?

I think I mentioned it above, but I got dropouts in busy pubs. Happened with my Smoothhound too.

Ok if stood within a couple of meters but much further sometimes became glitchy.

Since being on 5.8 with the HB it's been fine and I can get about a bit. Shame because the other units were very nice and seem to work well for most, but very happy with the unit.

[BassAdder60]

I’ve used Boss and Lekato and briefly Harley Benton and they all worked and some better than others 

 

The Shure unit in my opinion is high priced but you get a very robust receiver with excellent tuner and dual band ( best part ) 

The transmitter is also very robust with replacement batteries when required. 

I think it’s worth it and one less thing to worry about in terms of quality. 
 

 

[Woodinblack]

44 minutes ago, redbandit599 said:

I think I mentioned it above, but I got dropouts in busy pubs. Happened with my Smoothhound too.

 

My smoothound never actually dropped out (until it actually fell apart - now fixed) but there were times when the inteference bar on the side lit up full, and the signal bar was almost empty which made me feel a bit nervous! It does seem 5.8GHz is better for less inteference. Maybe just because it is less crowded in general, and this is with me using 5.8GHz for the connection for the X18 and iPad.

[Lozz196]

If the receiver unit in the Shure was battery powered I`d have one but due to my back I don`t want to be leaning over amps & cabs to find plug sockets as this really aggravates it.

 

I redently decided to go back to cables so sold a couple of wireless kits but then our singer bought a Shure unit and said that given his situation - he had part of his leg cut off last year and now has a prosthetic leg - he can`t afford to have leads all over the place so I`ve bought one of the 5.8 NUX units as it seemed to be the most user friendly for my needs. It`s being delivered today and I have a rehearsal on Thu so I`ll report my findings.

[Al Krow]

54 minutes ago, redbandit599 said:

I think I mentioned it above, but I got dropouts in busy pubs. Happened with my Smoothhound too.

Ok if stood within a couple of meters but much further sometimes became glitchy.

Since being on 5.8 with the HB it's been fine and I can get about a bit. Shame because the other units were very nice and seem to work well for most, but very happy with the unit.

 

10 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

 

My smoothound never actually dropped out (until it actually fell apart - now fixed) but there were times when the inteference bar on the side lit up full, and the signal bar was almost empty which made me feel a bit nervous! It does seem 5.8GHz is better for less inteference. Maybe just because it is less crowded in general, and this is with me using 5.8GHz for the connection for the X18 and iPad.

 

Seems like there's a 2.4 GHz crowding issue that's going to be there regardless of the quality of the unit i.e. not something that the Shure GLDX16 is going to be able to escape - which makes sense.

As @BassAdder60 mentions the ability to offer 5.8Ghz as well as 2.4 GHz seems to be a key upgrade feature of the Shure GLDX16+ and the unit automatically selects the optimal band/channel.

 

17 hours ago, markbunney said:

There seems to be a big gap in the market for reasonably priced 5.8ghz wireless units. they are either >£500 like the Shure or under £100 like the Lekato and similar.

I have a boss WL 20 which is great, but I want to try using it to power a Behringer P2 as we are moving to IEMs. This means that I need another wireless for my bass, but am concerned if I buy another 2.4ghz unit there will be problems with drop outs and clashed with other units in the band.

 

I think there's a few 5.8 GHz in the £100 to £250 price range i.e. comparable to the WL-20 e.g. the NUX C-5RC have an RRP of £189 but are available from some retailers for around £140.

[Woodinblack]

10 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

Seems like there's a 2.4 GHz crowding issue that's going to be there regardless of the quality of the unit i.e. not something that the Shure GLDX16 is going to be able to escape - which makes sense.

 

 

Agreed - I don't think I would intentionally pick anything that was 2.4GHz for gigging these days, unless there was no choice (like the U4s, and sometimes they do have problems). There is no actual wirelss I need any more, although the singer could do with a wireless microphone, or as mentioned previously, a reliable wireless sax connection, but that is his lookout!

[warwickhunt]

17 hours ago, markbunney said:

There seems to be a big gap in the market for reasonably priced 5.8ghz wireless units.

 

they are either >£500 like the Shure or under £100 like the Lekato and similar.

 

I have a boss WL 20 which is great, but I want to try using it to power a Behringer P2 as we are moving to IEMs. This means that I need another wireless for my bass, but am concerned if I buy another 2.4ghz unit there will be problems with drop outs and clashed with other units in the band.

 

Don't be put off by the low price of the 5.8 Lekato units.  I have a sub £50 unit and I've had zero issues with drop out and the signal sounds no different / better / worse than a cable or my more expensive 2.4 Line 6 unit.  

 

<edit>

 

I'm not saying for 1 minute the Lekato is better than Shure or other top brands, it isn't.  More expensive units have tougher construction, higher quality switches, jacks, sockets and likely chips in them but if you aren't throwing them around and abusing them I can't see that they are x10 worse a product than a £500+ unit.  IMHO

Edited July 31, 2023 by warwickhunt

[Woodinblack]

12 minutes ago, warwickhunt said:

Don't be put off by the low price of the 5.8 Lekato units.  I have a sub £50 unit and I've had zero issues with drop out and the signal sounds no different / better / worse than a cable or my more expensive 2.4 Line 6 unit. 

 

Same unit I had. I got it as I lost my 2.4GHz dongle I used for practice for a while (turned up in a lesser used gig bag after buying them), so I could continue practicing with them. I used them for all practices and then after a while it occured to me that I trusted them more than the smoothhound so I started gigging with them. Then I used them full time. Only downside is I wish I hadn't got the white ones and they are a bit wide.

[Dood]

@maidens97 re: A clip from last nights show in cleethorpes with a function band I work with, had a wander into the crowd with the wireless!I tested it earlier on in soundcheck and the range is more than you’d ever need!

 

Bass sounds great, aside from the GLDX+, what's your signal path? I take it your DI'd?

[Jack]

1 hour ago, Al Krow said:

Seems like there's a 2.4 GHz crowding issue that's going to be there regardless of the quality of the unit i.e. not something that the Shure GLDX16 is going to be able to escape - which makes sense.

Hmmmm, this is oft touted as gospel on here but to be honest it's not as cut and dry as that. I'm sure there are old pubs that still have just 2.4GHz infrastructure but even the free routers that come from ISPs have 5.8GHz these days, and it's been common on the punters' phones for years as well. Any proper 'venue' venue is going to be super busy across both spectra for sure. What's helpful with avoiding wireless clashes is thought, planning and care. One the massive benefits of the Shure GLX (both generations) is being able to scan and pick the least busy channel, they also transmit across multiple channels at once so that when one is temporarily jammed (and other units would drop out until the jamming stops) the Shure is listening across another 2 or 3 depending on mode and so there are no dropouts. There's no free lunch though, because now you're taking up more channels, limiting the options your guitarist's wireless unit has to work on.

 

Tips

• For wifi mixers be aware of the transmit pattern of your mixer router if you have one, most transmit in a doughnut shape that is parallel to the floor. Turning my mix rack on its side can really change the reception to my tablet!
• For guitar wireless units think about the turn on order. If you have some 'dumb' units turn those on first and then let the 'scan and see which channels are free ones' work their magic afterwards.
• 5.8 is not a magic bullet. It's pretty busy these days too and usually has a shorter, more line of sight range than 2.4. The main benefits of a 5.8Ghz system for our purposes are either 1) they do BOTH, allowing more choice, or 2) they move something out of the way of the other, older 2.4GHz only stuff.
• You can get free wifi scanning apps for your phone that allow to to visualise what's going on in a venue and work around that.
• Have options, bring cables. I haven't had to use it yet with our new router but I always bring a laptop with an ethernet cable to corporate venues when we play hotels and such, they're usually more congested than pubs and it's saved bacon before.

[maidens97]

17 minutes ago, Dood said:

@maidens97 re: A clip from last nights show in cleethorpes with a function band I work with, had a wander into the crowd with the wireless!I tested it earlier on in soundcheck and the range is more than you’d ever need!

 

Bass sounds great, aside from the GLDX+, what's your signal path? I take it your DI'd?

cheers mate, my signal is pretty minimal nowadays. My signal path is just the Squire 40th anniversary P bass

 

shure wireless

boss lmb3

Boss OC2

JAM Bass Rattler

sansamp BDDI V2

fender rumble 500 combo 

 

[Al Krow]

15 hours ago, Happy Jack said:

I've read through this thread with great interest, but like @Al Krow I'm reluctant to spend well over £500 on a wireless system. And I can't really avoid mentioning to @peteb that the weakest link in my chain is ... erm ... well, me actually.

 

With my rock'n'roll band every gig is a doubling gig and I need something different to be happening at the amp for double bass and electric bass. That means that wireless solutions get doubled, doubled in number of units, doubled in cost. Much as I'd like to go the Shure route, buying two of those buggers is a bridge too far.

 

I've had easily the best results (out of the many, many solutions I've tried) with the X-vive U2 units. They're cheap enough that running two pairs of them isn't much of an issue, the rechargeable batteries are always good for a 3-hour gig plus encores with much-reduced 'green' issues, they're tiny and really simple to use, and they work just fine at 80%, maybe 90% of the gigs I play.

 

But every now and then we get something like last night. The editing here is designed to draw the viewer's attention away from the issue so watch for me getting all distracted.

 

 

At that point we were 35 minutes into the first set and there had been no issues at all. So what happened?

Well we can't know for sure but I did notice that a group of half a dozen youngsters came into the Club pretty much then and sat quite close to the band, mobiles in use. An easy finger to point but I don't recall anything else changing.

 

At the end of the set I shifted to cable leads for the rest of the gig, and this morning I put a Line 6 receiver that I had knocking about (once owned by @PaulKing) on my pedal board so that I can shift over to it mid-set if it happens again.

 

The combined cost of both sets of X-vive stagebugs PLUS both high-quality cable leads PLUS the Line 6 wireless unit is still  less than the cost of the Shure ...

 

Thanks for sharing that!

Two things - firstly: that drop out at 02.12 in the clip is a really good illustration of a typical drop out.

Secondly - love your band, very cool!  

[Woodinblack]

19 minutes ago, Jack said:

One the massive benefits of the Shure GLX (both generations) is being able to scan and pick the least busy channel, they also transmit across multiple channels at once so that when one is temporarily jammed (and other units would drop out until the jamming stops) the Shure is listening across another 2 or 3 depending on mode and so there are no dropouts.

 

I presume it does more than that though as even the cheap wireless systems automatically pick the least congested channels and switch to them if they are better than the ones they have rather than having to do it manually?

[BassAdder60]

9 minutes ago, Woodinblack said:

 

I presume it does more than that though as even the cheap wireless systems automatically pick the least congested channels and switch to them if they are better than the ones they have rather than having to do it manually?

I don’t think the low cost units scan at all and only “ pair” and stay at a fixed frequency