The never-ending dirt pedal search

[Guest]

A few years ago I got caught up in the cycle of buying the latest pedal from Darkglass each time they came out. Until one day I realised I was essentially buying the exact same sound over and over at ever-increasing prices. It also occurred to me that I was never quite finding “the one”, despite spending literally thousands of pounds along the way. I also bought other drives, distortions and fuzzes from many other manufacturers such as MXR, EHX, Ampeg, Way Huge etc. Some of the purchases were instantly regretted, some seemed like “the one” but not for long.

 

From this forum, other forums and Facebook groups, I can see that it’s a common affliction to never quite settle long term on a dirt pedal for bass. I’m wondering why that is. One of my theories is that there’s an inherent problem in actually distorting bass signals - the only way it can be done without totally losing note clarity is to add an unacceptable amount of upper mids and highs. Thus creating something which can sound great on a YouTube video in isolation, or at home playing on your own, but once added to a band mix it just doesn’t quite work. The bass is no longer the bass.

 

Or could the problem instead be that we just get bored with sounds coming from our pedals? Like the initial excitement of a new dirt tone wears off once it becomes too familiar, and we then go searching for the next “fix”?

 

I would love to read other people’s thoughts. I know some people will say they’ve used the same pedal since 1982 and that’s fine - what I’m more interested in is hearing from people who’ve also been on an endless quest for the right dirt pedal, and why you think you’ve never quite found it?

[Franticsmurf]

I know what you mean about getting the 'right' dirt/grit/fuzz/drive sound and how elusive it can be. I haven't tried as many pedals you but I do find that what works one week doesn't seem to be right the next. I know my isolated sound isn't representative of the sound and effect within a band and so I'm talking about the sound in the context of a band as well. I'll find something that sounds interesting, try three or four variations and take them to the rehearsal. One usually works or is close enough to be worth chasing, and I'll use it for a while. But then I'll try something else and suddenly the previous sound isn't good enough/doesn't cut/isn't smooth enough etc. 

 

I play in two bands; one is a big outfit (13 players at the last count) which plays a jukebox of different styles. While a few of the songs could use a little grit in the bassline, with all the other instruments it's better that I stay reasonably clean to keep my place in the mix. With them I've been using a Behringer TS clone recently, which with the settings I'm using I find smooth and not too much for the mix. But with the last couple of gigs and rehearsals, it's sounding 'wrong' so I'm on the lookout for something else now. The bass guitar I use for this band doesn't change.

 

The other is a rock trio where there is definitely room for some grit or drive to thicken the sound. This band still in the early stages of development so my pedal board has several options on it but I'm favouring a combination of drive and subtle phase for the songs that need it. 

 

I've come to the conclusion that it's a combination of me not really knowing what I want in the first place, and (in the trio) changing the basses I play. There is also an element of boredom with the same sounds which is something I know I suffer from in other areas (I like to change basses, arrangements etc to keep motivated during practice and rehearsals, for example). 

 

[itu]

I have tried a few, and my holy grail was a X-over. With it I can keep the lows clean, and distort (or flange, or...) everything from 400 Hz upwards. Four hundred suits me, your choice may be something else.

 

Even pretty bad OD/dist/fuzzes sound decent, when they do not mush the lower register. I think Rolls has a cheap unit for trials.

[bassist_lewis]

Up to now I've probably owned about 15 drive pedals, 10 of which I still own. The one I keep coming back to and is on my big board is the Origin Effects Halcyon, a tube screamer circuit and the chank of which seems to fit with the style of fusion/jazz/prog/wtf I play with my original trio. However, I keep the other 9 because I think they sound cool (I sold a bunch earlier this year because they had no Je ne sais quois). I love the low gain of the Jive, BB Preamp and the Black Vehicle (they'd be on my board as well if space and loops weren't an issue), but I also like the aggression of The Crook and the Tesla Wolf so. And my DG B3K is special because it was built by Spencer Doran of 3Leaf Audio.

 

To address a point you made specifically, I think the reason so many people on these forums are constantly searching for and buying drive pedals (among other things) is because buying something feels like progress. I started spending an obscene amount on pedals, guitars and other paraphernalia when lockdown happened. Up until that point I'd been gigging very regularly (at least weekly) and hardly ever bought gear, but suddenly I dropped to nothing. Luckily I have a job that can facilitate such spending (much curbed now), but in lieu of gigging I bought gear instead.

 

Ultimately, if you can afford to by lots of drive pedals then enjoy the journey; if you can't, then stick with what you've got. Whatever music you're making won't be made significantly better or worse because of what drive pedal you're using.

[Guest]

35 minutes ago, bassist_lewis said:

Up to now I've probably owned about 15 drive pedals, 10 of which I still own. The one I keep coming back to and is on my big board is the Origin Effects Halcyon, a tube screamer circuit and the chank of which seems to fit with the style of fusion/jazz/prog/wtf I play with my original trio. However, I keep the other 9 because I think they sound cool (I sold a bunch earlier this year because they had no Je ne sais quois). I love the low gain of the Jive, BB Preamp and the Black Vehicle (they'd be on my board as well if space and loops weren't an issue), but I also like the aggression of The Crook and the Tesla Wolf so. And my DG B3K is special because it was built by Spencer Doran of 3Leaf Audio.

 

To address a point you made specifically, I think the reason so many people on these forums are constantly searching for and buying drive pedals (among other things) is because buying something feels like progress. I started spending an obscene amount on pedals, guitars and other paraphernalia when lockdown happened. Up until that point I'd been gigging very regularly (at least weekly) and hardly ever bought gear, but suddenly I dropped to nothing. Luckily I have a job that can facilitate such spending (much curbed now), but in lieu of gigging I bought gear instead.

 

Ultimately, if you can afford to by lots of drive pedals then enjoy the journey; if you can't, then stick with what you've got. Whatever music you're making won't be made significantly better or worse because of what drive pedal you're using.

This is a great point - a purchase feels like progress. I’ve definitely duped myself into believing that in the past. Trying to spend my way to becoming a better bass player rather than accepting it’s all really down to hard work and time.

[uk_lefty]

I find when there's a lull in band activity I am thinking about my gear and buying/ selling stuff to make improvements to what I can offer. I've recently splurged on five Marshall guitar effects pedals, three are on my bass board, one came as part of a package deal and the other my guitarist has. If I was busy gigging I wouldn't have had the time to think about this. 

 

I also think the forums are full of people saying "this is a game changer" and there's either words to describe the gear or maybe a sound clip, but it's too easy to chase that quick fix that worked for someone else. Rather, consider if it works with your existing kit, playing style, etc... 

 

My band recently reminded me of my audition less than 2yrs ago when my modest pedal board was an HX Stomp and outboard tuner and wah. "I'm not really a pedals guy" I said. I've gone through tons of pedals since then, always trying to find something that gives the band a sound off a popular song, or to create something that crosses over from bass onto keyboard territory.

 

Today, I'm almost happy with my rig. Tomorrow, the search continues!

[Lfalex v1.1]

I still can't find a drive/distortion  that I like in a pedal. 

Everything pales next to the Ampeg SVP-PRO, but the footswitch controls only the mute and graphic EQ, not the drive. 

However, I may be tempted to buy a Boss LS2 and do it that way;

 

Bypass (clean)

Loop A (dirty, Ampeg pre)

 

Or blend clean and dirty by just running a cable as loop B;

 

A/B mix ---- Bypass

[fretmeister]

I went through a lot of Darkglass stuff too. I've got a VMT and I would like to get an Alpha Omega again but mainly because neither of them are as common as the B3K sound that is now so common it's become passé.

 

I bought an EBS Sheehan Ultimate Drive purely because it is so different to the DG stuff and I've been very surprised at how versatile it is.

 

But I have no doubt I'll still want to try other things.

 

 

[0175westwood29]

i find even a sound i love after a time will get old or in need of a freshen up.

 

ive had a few Darkglass and theres something it does with the mids i cant get on board with, i love a clanky tone but i prefer a rat based distortion, i def love using the damnation blenders to not just add in clean but help the lowend to allow basically any pedal on bass!

 

 

[MrDinsdale]

Ive been through a few drives and its a constant battle of trying to make incremental improvements vs giving into GAS. I agree with @0175westwood29 though that sometimes even if it's a perfectly good sound things can still get stagnant and it's nice to mix it up.

 

My favourite drive at the moment is the Halberd V2 by Electronic Audio Experiments. It feels odd describing a drive as "transparent" but even with gain and depth pushed it still sounds like your bass, just a gritty thick chewy version of it. Very versatile little pedal and sits great in the full band context.

 

For now I'm happy but I'm sure in a few months I'll be switching things up. 

[itu]

Not everybody is the same, but... It is nice to buy a pedal and expect to get an instant super sound from it, while it should be tested thoroughly. Yes, you can turn every knob to 11, but have you ever done it? Learning curve can be very steep even with simple units.

[Fionn]

I’m happy with my dirt section, at last. It has been settled for long enough, but it took many many years and going through more dirt pedals than I can recall to finally be satisfied I’d achieved my (subjectively) ideal dirt.

 

Inevitably, an epic saga of trial and elimination, weeding out the various circuit types that didn’t suit and figuring out which ones did. Then acquiring and comparing various interpretations of those circuits in pedal form. Always 2nd hand, so the cost of the eternal dirt grind stayed negligible when the pedal experiment ejected one after another after another …
 

Eventually I learned there was no single magic dirt pedal for me, and I had to adapt a multi pedal solution. I had to learn in the most practical sense, which isn’t a bad thing. This multi pedal solution is very flexible with lots of scope, and I doubt my tastes will ever evolve beyond their capabilities.

 

I will stir the hive from time to time, of course, just to put my dirt harem to the test. Gladly, the current selection has so far proved untouchable.

 

Long may it continue. 
 

Like the quest for a mate, the quest for dirt is a fun and interesting journey full of excitement and anticipation. As these things go however, I’m glad to be home with her with our feet up on the sofa.

 

It feels good 🤘🏻

 

 

Edited July 8, 2023 by Fionn

[LukeFRC]

On 06/07/2023 at 22:49, itu said:

I have tried a few, and my holy grail was a X-over. With it I can keep the lows clean, and distort (or flange, or...) everything from 400 Hz upwards. Four hundred suits me, your choice may be something else.

 

Even pretty bad OD/dist/fuzzes sound decent, when they do not mush the lower register. I think Rolls has a cheap unit for trials.

I’ve got a John K mini XO that does this quite nicely

A lot of it depends what kind/type and level of dirt you want though. I’m not totally in love with the drive/distortion sound of the mini XO - but I love the sound I can get out of my DIYclone of a barbershop 

[0175westwood29]

23 hours ago, MrDinsdale said:

Ive been through a few drives and its a constant battle of trying to make incremental improvements vs giving into GAS. I agree with @0175westwood29 though that sometimes even if it's a perfectly good sound things can still get stagnant and it's nice to mix it up.

 

My favourite drive at the moment is the Halberd V2 by Electronic Audio Experiments. It feels odd describing a drive as "transparent" but even with gain and depth pushed it still sounds like your bass, just a gritty thick chewy version of it. Very versatile little pedal and sits great in the full band context.

 

For now I'm happy but I'm sure in a few months I'll be switching things up. 

for me i switch out pedals that surround my main sounds, distortion being my Fuzzrocious Bongripper and my fuzz the blue colander dark emperor ( black big muff) low gain and extra fuzz are my other slots my low gain sways between fuzzrocious lil fella, dark driving and now lusithand gnp, fuzz is fuzzrocious heliotropic or coloursound bass fuzz

 

[Franticsmurf]

14 hours ago, Fionn said:

dirt harem

The name of my next band. 😄

[krispn]

Half the reason we buy all this stuff is we read about it on forums or watch you tube and think we should have the next best thing…

 

That aside we do change tastes too. I love my p bass but on a real jazz bass thing just now and have been playing jazzes exclusively for at least 6-8 months. Plugged in the p bass in the other night as I wanted to change the foam under the pick ups and tweak the heights to balance output between it and the jazz bass and did I not instantly play the bass bass for the next three days as much as I could 😀

 

Sometimes ‘different’ from what we’ve grown accustomed to is enough to make us think it’s the new best thing ever and make us rethink our rig. How many folk have pulled out an old dusty pedal only to have an epiphany moment that it should never have left the board but in six months time the one we took off the board will suddenly sound amazing again. 
 

TL:DR

We’re fickle.😀

Edited July 12, 2023 by krispn

[MrDinsdale]

I find idle hands are the worst cause of GAS and tone searching personally. Same with all hobbies.

 

When I'm out there doing stuff and busy with band stuff the GAS is way less aggressive, as soon as we have to miss a couple because people are busy it's back with a vengeance.

 

Same was true with skating, I'd barely buy anything over summer but once winter hit and weather got crappy I'd find myself buying gear and trading stuff.

[fretmeister]

19 minutes ago, MrDinsdale said:

I find idle hands are the worst cause of GAS and tone searching personally. Same with all hobbies.

 

When I'm out there doing stuff and busy with band stuff the GAS is way less aggressive, as soon as we have to miss a couple because people are busy it's back with a vengeance.

 

Same was true with skating, I'd barely buy anything over summer but once winter hit and weather got crappy I'd find myself buying gear and trading stuff.

 

 

Definitely - pre lockdown I was earning by performing magic and the amount of new effects and props and even cards with different construction is amazing.

 

I once bought a set of tiny weights that would be used for prop building - a set of 10 and there was only 2g difference between the heaviest and lightest and I made up 10 versions of the prop to see which I liked best and what handled and balanced easiest. Then I spent ages changing the placement of the weights in the prop to see if that made a difference I cared about.

 

I must have been out of my mind!

[Baloney Balderdash]

Blending 2 drives in parallel with each other, and eventually blending in some parallel clean signal as well, or perhaps even staking a 1 octave up effect into it all, I found to be the answer.

 

A Joyo Orange Juice, set to a low gain overdrive, stacked into a Metal Zone to tighten it up, then blended in parallel with a Turbo Rat, works for me.

 

Edited July 12, 2023 by Baloney Balderdash

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Baloney Balderdash said:

Blending 2 drives in parallel with each other, and eventually blending in some parallel clean signal as well, or perhaps even staking a 1 octave up effect into it all, I found to be the answer.

 

A Joyo Orange Juice, set to a low gain overdrive, stacked into a Metal Zone to tighten it up, then blended in parallel with a Turbo Rat, works for me.

 

Hmmm, this you being funny again?

[Baloney Balderdash]

1 hour ago, Lord Summerisle said:

Hmmm, this you being funny again?

Wouh, just what the...? 

 

Why on Earth would you think that?

 

I am being dead serious.

 

This gives me an awesome high gain distortion tone, really ballsy and heavy thick fuzz like, very doomy, type of distortion, but with a surprisingly amount of definition and articulation still.

 

Mixing two different types of drive in parallel really is the key to a great bas distortion tone as far as I am concerned.

 

You are of course still free to laugh at and ignore my advice.

 

Your loss...

 

Edited July 12, 2023 by Baloney Balderdash

[dannybuoy]

Speaking of finding happiness with cheap pedals that fly under the radar and parallel blending… I have found solace in the Hartke Bass Attack for my always on scooped dirty tone, with a TC Spectracomp in front of it. This is after trying almost everything on offer from the likes of Darkglass and Tech21, as well as the Origin Effects Super Vintage. Then I’m using the parallel out from the Hartke into a Boss HM-2 and using a Mosquite Blender to mix the 2 pedals in parallel.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Baloney Balderdash said:

Wouh, just what the...? 

 

Why on Earth would you think that?

 

I am being dead serious.

 

This gives me an awesome high gain distortion tone, really ballsy and heavy thick fuzz like, very doomy, type of distortion, but with a surprisingly amount of definition and articulation still.

 

Mixing two different types of drive in parallel really is the key to a great bas distortion tone as far as I am concerned.

 

You are of course still free to laugh at and ignore my advice.

 

Your loss...

 

Let’s see a video of this delightful setup then please. 😆

[MrDinsdale]

I've played around with similar approaches tbf using multifx.

 

Parallel drives with different characters which play well together sometimes just work really nice where in series it would be too much. Not far off the DG Alpha Omega in terms of approach.

 

Fun to play around with at home but found it totally impractical for band stuff, balancing levels was tricky and kept having to tweak the eq if i changed the blend at all. Always ended up swiftly returning to a more simple setup.

 

That particular combo doesn't sound appealing to me but whatever works for you!

[fretmeister]

I used to do a 4 way blend using a POD Pro XT Bass, an Ampeg SVP-BSP into a Yamaha P5000S power amp and a pair of cabs. There were additional compressors and octaves and stuff as well.

 

After a lot of tweaking I found the secret was multiple compression stages, but with the most important being on the cleanest tones, set to match the note decay times of the distorted ones so it sounded like 1 complex layered tone rather than 4 separate basses. It took a lot of work to get the natural decay of all 4 tones to fade away at the same time.

 

It was amazing, but the rack was so damn heavy.

 

Never again - unless I can have roadies.