Basses for sale on Basschat - post Brexit.

[wombatboter]

I was and am a bit curious if there is a change in sales or offers here on Bass chat after the new policy regarding shipment or sales to Europe...

Has it had an influence on the people buying basses around here ? Do British music shops feel that Europeans buy less because of the import tax or the paperwork which has to be done or did everything stay the same ?

Not that I want to start a discussion about Brexit...I am just curious if other basschatters have certain views on how this has affected their GAS ?

If I speak for myself it has had a huge affect on buying basses around here because in the back of my head not only the calculator pound/euro is working and the costs for shipment but also the calculator import tax etc..

My enthusiasm of seeing certain basses around here has changed a bit because I know that there are extra costs so I buy less than I used to...

Any other views from fellow "Europeans" but also the British themselves about buying basses since this change ? Thanks for any opinion (and sorry for any mistakes in my English)

[cetera]

Sadly I'm a lot less tempted to buy from a European seller as a result of Brexsh*t. Whereas I may have taken a chance on a bass before, I now have to REALLY want it and the price has to be HUGELY competitive in order for me to even think about it...

[Old Horse Murphy]

9 minutes ago, cetera said:

Sadly I'm a lot less tempted to buy from a European seller as a result of Brexsh*t. Whereas I may have taken a chance on a bass before, I now have to REALLY want it and the price has to be HUGELY competitive in order for me to even think about it...

Sadly this sums it up for me, likewise in selling to the EU. 

[Lozz196]

Haven`t given it any thought really, if I wanted to buy something from overseas I would, very doubtful I`d sell overseas now, that being more to nightmare courier experiences that I read on here than anything else.

[Doctor J]

It has killed the FS section, for me, to the extent that I rarely bother looking anymore. Aside from adding 25% to the price of everything, I think often sellers are less inclined to go through the paperwork hassle, too, and ship outside the UK.

 

I think there's validity in a section in FS for EU-based ads but perhaps not an appetite to create another sub-section in there?

[meterman]

I used to buy and sell on eBay and Gumtree all the time when I still lived in the UK. I’d buy from Europe, Japan, USA etc usually with no problem. There was the occasional customs charge but nothing I wouldn’t have expected.

 

When I sold my Hofner violin bass it was post-Brexit, I’d already moved to France, and I had zero takers from the UK. No enquiries, nothing. Same with a vintage Fender Telecaster. Both sold on Reverb to EU buyers so I’m guessing that the possible customs and handling charges put UK buyers off?

 

I’ve bought mics and small bits of recording gear from the UK in the last couple of years without any outlandish charges on delivery, but not any Wal-sized purchases. But, if there was something I really wanted and could only get from the UK I’d probably do it anyway and pay the customs and handling on it. GAS isn’t a big thing with me though, so it would have to be an essential bit of kit.

 

 

[ped]

I have to admit that from my point of view, Brexit has had very little effect on the numbers of instruments being posted and the revenue generated from ads. I suppose it’s created a stronger domestic market in some ways although personally I think paying import duty for used basses from somewhere else is absolute BS. 

[Newfoundfreedom]

I'll still buy smaller, low value items from the UK, pedals, cables, parts etc, because I have a good forward shipper and very rarely get stung with any extra costs. But I wouldn't buy a bass or any other mid to high value items. 

 

Also, sadly the second hand market here is absolute dross and decent music shops are very thin on the ground. Even when anything decent comes up it's always well overpriced. So now I almost always buy new. Thomann now gets pretty much all my business. 

 

I often drool at the second hand basses in the for sale section here. There are some absolute bargains, but it's just not worth the risk or hassle for me now. 

[warwickhunt]

I've bought dozens (literally) of used £1000+ basses from Europe over the past 20 or so years and price/value was/has been one of the reasons I bought from Europe (+ a few from the USA when £ v $ was good).  However post Brexit, the 25% increase and the weakness of the £ has meant that there's never a point where an instrument purchase makes financial sense, I may as well wait and see if the instrument that I've an interest in, appears for sale in the UK.  Likewise, I've sold/traded basses 'to' Europe in the past but now, European buyers won't pay what the value is now!  

[chris_b]

Before Brexit I bought and sold basses from/to Europe. Never any hassle.

 

Now the additional costs make buying from abroad prohibitive.

[BigRedX]

I'm lucky in that exhausted my cravings for second hand exotic basses from outside the UK in the days when getting them was cheaper and easier.

 

At the moment all the gear I am interested in is new, and either made in the UK or has an official UK distributor.

 

On a separate note, I lost part of my business and ultimately a whole client due to problems shipping stuff outside of the UK after we had left the EU.

[G-Lo]

I'll look on non- UK sites first. I spent time in the UK, my partner is British so we would gravitate more to bying from the UK but no longer do due to tax etc. I have also found that for some reason folks selling used items privately dont want to sell to the EU. Im not sure why as in that case it's just post- it's me who would pay taxes on receipt.

Thankfully I finally got to meet my partner's mother in Yorkshire and had an amp sent there and picked up a cab in a carpark too.... thanks basschatters! 

[BigRedX]

15 minutes ago, G-Lo said:

I'll look on non- UK sites first. I spent time in the UK, my partner is British so we would gravitate more to bying from the UK but no longer do due to tax etc. I have also found that for some reason folks selling used items privately dont want to sell to the EU. Im not sure why as in that case it's just post- it's me who would pay taxes on receipt.

Thankfully I finally got to meet my partner's mother in Yorkshire and had an amp sent there and picked up a cab in a carpark too.... thanks basschatters! 

 

There's increased paper work for senders, customs and shipping delays, and unexpected charges for EU customers who haven't realised the implications of now buying from the UK.

 

After having several items (not musical instruments but part of my day job business activities) go astray in customs or be refused by the recipients (not necessarily the customer depending on circumstances) because they didn't want to pay import and customs charges, I had to suspend a rather lucrative part of my business because it was no longer cost effective for me to produce the items here in the UK and then ship them to an EU country for distribution; and that decision ultimately cost me all business from one of my better clients.

 

I'm sure that if your business is of a sufficient size you can get around these problems but for smaller concerns and private sellers it has turned out to be far more trouble then it is worth.

[Man.about.Tyne]

I think it’s fair to say that Brexit has cured my GAS but I can’t, in all honesty, put that down as a “benefit”.

 

[Dan Dare]

12 minutes ago, Man.about.Tyne said:

I think it’s fair to say that Brexit has cured my GAS

 

Every cloud has a silver lining

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

I'm not even remotely interested in selling outside the UK now, which is a bit of a shame as all the interest I've had in my Spector has been from outside the EU.

I think the last time I bought anything from a private seller outside the UK was many years ago, probably from @BassTractor.

I try not to think about it as it makes me quite annoyed in much the same way inheritance tax does.

[BassTractor]

2 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

I'm not even remotely interested in selling outside the UK now, which is a bit of a shame as all the interest I've had in my Spector has been from outside the EU.

I think the last time I bought anything from a private seller outside the UK was many years ago, probably from @BassTractor.

I try not to think about it as it makes me quite annoyed in much the same way inheritance tax does.

Yeah, and I'm similarly quite annoyed I let you have my perty bass!  😁

[Lfalex v1.1]

3 hours ago, ped said:

 I think paying import duty for used basses from somewhere else is absolute BS. 

 

Precisely this. 

If it were a truly exotic, big ticket item and in Northern Europe (a day's travel from the Channel ports) I'd probably drive across with an empty old flight case, collect it and take my chances at customs on the way back. 

[BlueMoon]

Basschat is a great site in general and, in particular, a relatively safe marketplace to buy/sell stuff.

 

Unfortunately, the extra import costs linked to purchase value makes it such that the prospect of snagging bargains is long gone for me………which is a real shame.
 

Bargains are still there for EU-based BC members to other members located within the EU and, of course, for UK-based members from those BC members also based in the UK. Probably two largely separate mini-markets within BC marketplace.

 

That’s as close as a politically correct answer to the reality, which is hassle, extra cost and probably buckets of frustration..
 

 

[wombatboter]

I think I have seen at least ten basses I would love to buy (like that beautiful Carvin fretless or a lovely Smith) but unfortunately the taxes and the whole hassle turned me away..

I bought a  lot of fantastic basses around here and had excellent transactions with everyone..it's a pity that has changed which has nothing to do with the members themselves naturally..

[G-Lo]

All quite a shame but... surely a private individual selling a pedal just posts it? Sure I have the hassle this end, do you guys have more to deal with posting as a private individual?

 

Incidentally for EU chums. I have used myus.com to buy from the US. You get a US and UK address to use and generally better courier rates. Youre of course double paying post, and you pay them direct the import due as a buyer. It may be a solution if buying from the UK as the seller would have a UK adress to send to and none of the hassle. It may be right for you 

[Woodinblack]

I just don't look at anything from europe these days, its just too much hassle, which is a shame, there are some basses I would have got that I no longer can for same reasons as mentioned above. 

From my own point of view, my wifes webshop lost ¼ of her business selling to the EU, she had quite a loyal base there - as a sole trader below the vat threshold she hasn't got the time to do all the paperwork.

[Downunderwonder]

19 hours ago, ped said:

I have to admit that from my point of view, Brexit has had very little effect on the numbers of instruments being posted and the revenue generated from ads. I suppose it’s created a stronger domestic market in some ways although personally I think paying import duty for used basses from somewhere else is absolute BS. 

What's BS is the difficulty in obtaining an export tax credit for the exporter so the sale price is reduced. Commercial sellers can and do get a massive advantage on this.

[prowla]

There were a couple of half-baked aspects of the ready-baked deal, two of which affect musicians:

• Access for Touring bands - this needs to be sorted out, but perhaps is a thread in its own right.
• VAT & duties on used kit - this is not acceptable IMHO; why should individuals flogging s/h kit be taxed?

The taxes on new kit should be similar to before; it's just where they're collected which has changed:

• VAT is charged once (ie. you do not pay both EU + UK VAT).
• Import duties are not payable on EU-manufactured kit.
• Import duties are applied to overseas imports, but they were anyway.
• Bigger companies (eg. Thomann) handle the taxes for you, so it's invisible.

Caveats:

• If you are dealing with a smaller company, they may not be geared up to handle the tax and so it'll be levied at the point of entry to the UK.
• The courier companies will handle tax at the point of entry, but they may charge a processing fee of £10-20 for doing so.
• If you run a smaller company, then there is new admin overhead in processing taxes/duties; I would've thought this could be automated and I guess there are programs to handle it (or it could be handled in a fairly simple spreadsheet).

Other factors:

• Covid has arguably bumped up the prices of items as people have had money to spend and nothing to do.
• The war in Ukraine has bumped up prices of everything and inflation is much higher than pre-Brexit.
• Interest rates have gone up significantly, affecting the prices of everything.
• The OPEC cartel has raised the price of oil, which increases transport costs.
• There has been some opportunistic price-gouging by manufacturers & suppliers.

Me, I have to say I mostly bought in-UK anyway, as shipping costs could be a bit pricey pre-Brexit.

[Woodinblack]

1 hour ago, prowla said:

• If you run a smaller company, then there is new admin overhead in processing taxes/duties; I would've thought this could be automated and I guess there are programs to handle it (or it could be handled in a fairly simple spreadsheet).

 

Although that is OT, considering this is about sales of basses on BC, so not commercial stuff, but the taxes / duties is no issue at all. The reason my wife cannot export to the EU any more is the codes and regions of manufacture stuff - there frankly aren't enough hours in her day with everything else she is doing to come up with the paperwork to export stuff to the EU, even if she could understand it, so it is not something she can do any longer. She could get someone else to do it, but she doesn't earn enough to make it worthwhile. She doesn't get too much money, she is a small online shop, but it was 1/4 of her business, and her customers were very good so it is quite sad.