silent stage .. passive / active ?

[Tjhooker]

Hi all .

Anyone here that uses iem and goes out through the pa alone do you use a passive or active bass to do this?

 

I have used my trusty limelight p bass and also my Yamaha BB 615 also. Both go out through a small pedalboard with a tc electronic spectradrive handling the EQ and di duties.

 

I have started to prefer using the active bass as it gives me much better tone shaping quickly for this ampless set up

(Cover band through the ages)

 

 

[BigRedX]

For me it makes no difference.

 

I use an active 5-string with one band and a passive bass VI with the other both go through a Line6 Helix and a good quality passive DI box which feeds the PA. All the "tone shaping" is done by the Helix. I never touch the controls on either bass.

[Tjhooker]

Ah...

 

I was sort of wondering if anyone would mention the helix..

 

So do you have presets for each bass?

[BigRedX]

Just now, Tjhooker said:

Ah...

 

I was sort of wondering if anyone would mention the helix..

 

So do you have presets for each bass?

 

I have a separate presets with up to 4 snapshots for each song.

 

For the band where I play bass VI, I alternate between "bass" and "melody" parts with the synth player, and TBH with the amount of processing I'm using, the choice of bass makes little difference. When I switched from using a Burns Barracuda to the Eastwood Hooky I only had to tweak some of the "guitar" snapshots slightly to get the right sound.

 

For the other band where I play a more conventional bass role the difference between the presets I use for each song are more subtle, but have still been arranged so as to give the correct bass sound in the other all band mix.

[Phil Starr]

I use either with the bass matched to who I'm playing with. A passive J with my duo and an active P with the band. TBH I could probably swap them round and nobody would notice.

 

I don't do a lot of tone shaping though and I have control of the desk so I adjust it there if I need to adapt to the venue. I use a SansAmp or my Zoom B1 for a little pre shaping to get 'my' tone. My plan is to get two or three pre shapes for the duo where there is less opportunity for changes in texture when there is just the two of us.

[Muppet]

4 hours ago, BigRedX said:

For me it makes no difference.

 

I use an active 5-string with one band and a passive bass VI with the other both go through a Line6 Helix and a good quality passive DI box which feeds the PA. All the "tone shaping" is done by the Helix. I never touch the controls on either bass.

I'm very similar, 5 strings, both passive and active in to Helix but them I'm going from Helix to PA. Should I be using a passive DI box too? 

 

I'm using IEMs and I try to avoid if at all possible to modify any EQ once it's set, as what I might hear in my ears might not be the desired effect FOH.

[gafbass02]

I’ve spent a long time tweaking my iem signal route to accurately reflect what I’m sending to foh, (compensated for the headphones), so that if I tweak the onboard eq (or passive tone) it’s in line with what the audience are hearing. This took bloomin ages to get right though! 

[fretmeister]

You don't need a DI box with the helix, but it can help protect it from the FOH guy accidently turning the phantom power on!

[Muppet]

7 minutes ago, gafbass02 said:

I’ve spent a long time tweaking my iem signal route to accurately reflect what I’m sending to foh, (compensated for the headphones), so that if I tweak the onboard eq (or passive tone) it’s in line with what the audience are hearing. This took bloomin ages to get right though! 

This sounds like it's well worth doing. Any tips? 

 

[BigRedX]

42 minutes ago, Muppet said:

This sounds like it's well worth doing. Any tips? 

 

Technical rehearsals. Including some in decent sized room with the sort of PA you'll be using at a gig.

[BigRedX]

57 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

You don't need a DI box with the helix, but it can help protect it from the FOH guy accidently turning the phantom power on!

 

For some gigs I still use an FRFR cab which I run from the XLR output of the Helix. I also have the Helix set up so that the volume control only affects the XLR output. That way I can control my on-stage volume when I'm using the FRFR without affecting the FoH feed. It is relatively easy to change the volume control assignment but by always using a DI box it means that I don't have to, and also I don't inadvertently send full volume bass signal the the FRFR when I am using it. 

[gafbass02]

1 hour ago, Muppet said:

This sounds like it's well worth doing. Any tips? 

 

Spend a lot of time getting to know your sound at volume and through your rig, and then go back and forth tweaking the IEM signal path to be as representative as possible. 

Edited August 17, 2023 by gafbass02

[Tjhooker]

Can the hx stomp do the things people are describing here?

 

Is it a slimmed down version of the helix?

 

 

[BigRedX]

14 minutes ago, Tjhooker said:

Can the hx stomp do the things people are describing here?

 

Is it a slimmed down version of the helix?

 

Essentially yes.

 

It won't do everything I need, but then I have very fairly heavy-duty effects processing and MIDI control demands, and I use the large display and LED "scribble strips" as an electronic set list. I bought the Helix Floor on the assumption that if I bought one of the lesser models I'd eventually need something that only the most fully featured version had and I was right. Also in real terms it offers way more processing power and programming flexibility than any other multi-effects unit I have owned.

 

Have a look at this comparison page as see if you think it will meet your requirements.

[Tjhooker]

Another question for you chaps with experience..

Do you have a pa set up that allows each band member to have an individual mix for their respective iem?

 

We are possibly about to pull the trigger on doing this...

I'm wondering if this alone would allow me to feel happier with setting up my tone and keeping my board as is.

 

With a bit of retrospective thought, I'm wondering if I prefer the bass with active on board EQ because I can bump up the mids and actually hear myself in a busy overall band mix 🤔

2 hours ago, Tjhooker said:

 

 

 

Edited August 17, 2023 by Tjhooker

[Tjhooker]

But everyone is going on about the helix stuff so I'm very curious 😅

[Muppet]

1 hour ago, Tjhooker said:

Another question for you chaps with experience..

Do you have a pa set up that allows each band member to have an individual mix for their respective iem?

 

We are possibly about to pull the trigger on doing this...

I'm wondering if this alone would allow me to feel happier with setting up my tone and keeping my board as is.

 

With a bit of retrospective thought, I'm wondering if I prefer the bass with active on board EQ because I can bump up the mids and actually hear myself in a busy overall band mix 🤔

 

Yes we have a Behringer XR18 desk that has enough aux channels for everyone to have their own mix, controllable via phone or tablet.  I actually use a Behringer P16M personal mixer that connects to the desk via Cat5 cable for my mix.

[gafbass02]

2 hours ago, Tjhooker said:

Another question for you chaps with experience..

Do you have a pa set up that allows each band member to have an individual mix for their respective iem?

 

We are possibly about to pull the trigger on doing this...

I'm wondering if this alone would allow me to feel happier with setting up my tone and keeping my board as is.

 

With a bit of retrospective thought, I'm wondering if I prefer the bass with active on board EQ because I can bump up the mids and actually hear myself in a busy overall band mix 🤔

 

Yeah, behringer here too, I use the app, it’s ace. 

[Tjhooker]

1 hour ago, Muppet said:

Yes we have a Behringer XR18 desk that has enough aux channels for everyone to have their own mix, controllable via phone or tablet.  I actually use a Behringer P16M personal mixer that connects to the desk via Cat5 cable for my mix.

Is this just to have a physical mixer then and not use the phone / tablet method or is there another benefit?

[KingPrawn]

3 hours ago, Tjhooker said:

But everyone is going on about the helix stuff so I'm very curious 😅

You need to check out some of the youtube stuff. I've used a Stomp for the last 5 years and they are a real game changer. I don't think it will ever replace a really high-quality amp and cab and the feel of a rig but for ease of use and set-up, they are incredible. There are so many options available for sound and processing. It allowed me to develop the various bass sounds I had in my head for different bands and songs. I've had so many players and audience come up and discuss my sound only to realise I have no rig. 

[Tjhooker]

11 minutes ago, KingPrawn said:

You need to check out some of the youtube stuff. I've used a Stomp for the last 5 years and they are a real game changer. I don't think it will ever replace a really high-quality amp and cab and the feel of a rig but for ease of use and set-up, they are incredible. There are so many options available for sound and processing. It allowed me to develop the various bass sounds I had in my head for different bands and songs. I've had so many players and audience come up and discuss my sound only to realise I have no rig. 

Was this a long process.. do you have to sit down with one of these plugged into your computer and tweak stuff?

 

[Muppet]

1 hour ago, Tjhooker said:

Is this just to have a physical mixer then and not use the phone / tablet method or is there another benefit?

Mainly for the physical mixer element, but also as it's in stereo and uses the Ultranet connector it frees up aux channels on the mixer for the rest of my band to also have stereo IEM mixes. 

[TeresaFR]

I've only ever used active basses, currently run them through a small pedalboard with a VTBassDI at the end of my chain.

[Downunderwonder]

10 hours ago, fretmeister said:

You don't need a DI box with the helix, but it can help protect it from the FOH guy accidently turning the phantom power on!

WOT not phantom power protection on a Helix, Shirley!?

[KingPrawn]

19 hours ago, Tjhooker said:

Was this a long process.. do you have to sit down with one of these plugged into your computer and tweak stuff?

 

It gives you both options. You can plug and play or build your own patches. My ability developed over time. I made a few then started to tweet the dynamics. Really easy to use. After a while I found it easier to use my laptop hooked up to the helix as all the functions were easier to access.