"Muffled" Sounding P Bass - any suggestions

[Pirellithecat]

Thanks Bass Adder.   I'm pretty much a fingerstyle player, so your remarks are very pertinent.   I think the underlying issue is now under control and aggressive EQ helps a lot with getting the sound I want.  The original pickups are very hot, but also have a very shallow profile so whilst changing them is tempting I would need to route the current pickup cavity to fit eg a Geezer Butler.   I'll have a look at Dimarzio.  I'm guessing you think it might help the upper mids?

[Pirellithecat]

28 minutes ago, Baloney Balderdash said:

That depends, if for example a pickup pole grounding wire has been fused with the pickup coil ground, then it most definitely will.

 

Could you expand on this?   The grounding wires, including that from the pickup, are effectively "star earthed" before they reach the volume pot and then use the housing of each pot to daisy chain to the jack socket.  I did wonder whether I'd the polarity were reversed this might be the cause of the problem.   

 

Simply put, the bridge ground, and the ground soldered to the copper cavity screening are summed with the pickup ground immediately before the pot. This feed is soldered to the casing of the pot and a wire goes to the tone control casing and then to the jack socket.

[Baloney Balderdash]

44 minutes ago, Pirellithecat said:

Could you expand on this?   The grounding wires, including that from the pickup, are effectively "star earthed" before they reach the volume pot and then use the housing of each pot to daisy chain to the jack socket.  I did wonder whether I'd the polarity were reversed this might be the cause of the problem.   

 

Simply put, the bridge ground, and the ground soldered to the copper cavity screening are summed with the pickup ground immediately before the pot. This feed is soldered to the casing of the pot and a wire goes to the tone control casing and then to the jack socket.

Please have another look at my reply and what it was a reply to again.

 

What I basically was saying was just that if the pickup ground wire is swapped and used as the hot wire instead, but elsewhere is grounded, there will either be a somewhat reduced output or no output at all.

 

And what I was talking about more specifically was if it was fused already where the wire is attached to the pickup.

 

In that case you should also hear a really loud hum if touching the pickup poles with your fingers.

 

If not the pickup will work just as well.

 

 

Edited October 29, 2023 by Baloney Balderdash

[Pirellithecat]

Thanks. I'll double check for any partial shorts.

 

[BassAdder60]

12 hours ago, Pirellithecat said:

Thanks Bass Adder.   I'm pretty much a fingerstyle player, so your remarks are very pertinent.   I think the underlying issue is now under control and aggressive EQ helps a lot with getting the sound I want.  The original pickups are very hot, but also have a very shallow profile so whilst changing them is tempting I would need to route the current pickup cavity to fit eg a Geezer Butler.   I'll have a look at Dimarzio.  I'm guessing you think it might help the upper mids?

The Dimarzio pickups are definitely aggressive in the mids and not to everyone’s taste but they suit rock very well 

 

I struggled to lower them to make them less aggressive and decided they were not for me. I found the standard Fender Original Pickup ( not the CS62 which is a tad dark sounding ) a far better choice for clarity 

[Pirellithecat]

Well - clarity is what I'm after (in terms of reducing the Muffledness!).  

I wonder whether there's a cheaper option - just because if it doesn't work it'll be (another) expensive mistake!  

Tempted though, as I have a set of Seymour Duncan SPB-1's and SJB-1's which I could sell and fund (partially) the Fender originals. 

Maybe one more gig and rehearsal a decent set up and if it still looks promising ............ go for it! 
Thanks for the suggestion.

 

 

[Supernaut]

Try a Tonerider pickup first - killer sounding on my '66 slab P. 

[BassAdder60]

17 minutes ago, Supernaut said:

Try a Tonerider pickup first - killer sounding on my '66 slab P. 

Yes these pickups seem to get good reviews for a reasonable price 

[Pirellithecat]

Any views o the Seymour Duncan SPB1's - I had them in my "other" back-up bass until recently - be daft to sell these without trying them I guess. 

[Supernaut]

2 minutes ago, Pirellithecat said:

Any views o the Seymour Duncan SPB1's - I had them in my "other" back-up bass until recently - be daft to sell these without trying them I guess. 

Definitely try that. The SPB-1 is a more vintage voiced pickup. 

Edited October 31, 2023 by Supernaut

[Pirellithecat]

3 hours ago, Supernaut said:

Try a Tonerider pickup first - killer sounding on my '66 slab P. 

When you say "killer" .... how would you describe the tone?   I think I need to emphasise the mids rather than the deep bass, as there's plenty going on down there.

[Supernaut]

Just now, Pirellithecat said:

When you say "killer" .... how would you describe the tone?   I think I need to emphasise the mids rather than the deep bass, as there's plenty going on down there.

Tonerider emphasises the mids alright... 

 

https://youtu.be/1I0hJQPd9ww?si=VAcWeA_OojXc9FL7

[Pirellithecat]

But , of course you're right - try the SPB's first.    Trying to resist actually modding anything at the moment as tomorrow I'm routing out a battery box on my other bass and it would be tempting fate to disassemble both at the same time (although typical!!)

[Pirellithecat]

Double Post - oops

Edited November 12, 2023 by Pirellithecat

[Pirellithecat]

Update.

Before changing pickups I tried the P out at a couple of gigs.   It was very good.

So, thought I'd treat it to a setup at The Guitar Workshop (Manchester).   And it's brilliant.   They did a great job of setting it up and refiling the nut slots.  It now sounds unmuffled and is a delight to play.  Nice low action, no buzzing, tunes well and sounds like an old P

The pup is a tad hot and maybe a tad bassy but can now be EQ'd.  Might try swapping it one day but for now it's fine.

Edited November 12, 2023 by Pirellithecat