3Leaf Audio Octabvre - November 2023 release

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

Absolutely gutted that I've once again missed out on an Octabvre.

I waited ages for Spencer to announce another run and 100 of them went live at 9am PST (5pm GMT).

I couldn't possible have got through the order process quicker than I did. The clock was still showing 1700hrs when I clicked purchase and they had sold out.

I thought FEA Labs were bad, but at least I was able to get on a list with them and they did eventually deliver.

It seems a lot of these Octabvre pedals get re-sold for profit. What's worse 3Leaf have put 7 of the 100 on eBay and they're all going way above the site price of $333.

Not a chance in hell I'm bidding any of them.

 

I'll do without.

[Quatschmacher]

4 hours ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

Absolutely gutted that I've once again missed out on an Octabvre.

I waited ages for Spencer to announce another run and 100 of them went live at 9am PST (5pm GMT).

I couldn't possible have got through the order process quicker than I did. The clock was still showing 1700hrs when I clicked purchase and they had sold out.

I thought FEA Labs were bad, but at least I was able to get on a list with them and they did eventually deliver.

It seems a lot of these Octabvre pedals get re-sold for profit. What's worse 3Leaf have put 7 of the 100 on eBay and they're all going way above the site price of $333.

Not a chance in hell I'm bidding any of them.

 

I'll do without.

Sorry to hear that.

 

Probably not much comfort but there are other options out there. The 3Leaf stuff is pretty nice but it’s overpriced and not the only game in town for that sound. I had one and sold it about a month after I got it. 

[admiralchew]

I’m sorry you missed out too. I think the intention is for larger releases next year so there should be more than a hundred available of each pedal throughout the year. Hopefully, with those released next year and the larger releases next year, there should be greater availability and reduced resale prices.

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

8 hours ago, admiralchew said:

I’m sorry you missed out too. I think the intention is for larger releases next year so there should be more than a hundred available of each pedal throughout the year. Hopefully, with those released next year and the larger releases next year, there should be greater availability and reduced resale prices.

Yeah, that’s what he said last year. Nice to see he’s going to make a cracking profit on those ones on eBay. I do not understand the logic behind that at all.

[Sibob]

4 hours ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

Yeah, that’s what he said last year. Nice to see he’s going to make a cracking profit on those ones on eBay. I do not understand the logic behind that at all.

As good as he is, from what I understand, he's not against annoying a few people. Very basic maths suggests that he made upwards of $33k before costs for this months sale.......why would he bother creating more abundance or going back to supplying dealers who take 20-50 points margin?
Create scarcity, drives up used prices to silly amounts, means people are easily going to sell-out a pedal at a 'very reasonable' $333 when he releases them. Still a little overpriced IMO, sounds the same as an OC-2/OC-5 or a MXR Vintage Octave (granted with a couple extra little features).......but GAS & Economics & FOMO & stuff.

 

Si

Edited November 27, 2023 by Sibob

[Oomo]

I tried buying a pedal from one of the earlier releases, but it was such an unpleasant experience all round that I just decided not to bother in future (I'm sure the pedals are nice, but I don't think they're worth that much hassle, at least not to me).

 

Creating artificial scarcity and encouraging a feeding frenzy of buying is not something I really want to support.

 

Plenty of small builders do just fine without all of that by having waiting lists - means no wasting time in front of a computer hitting refresh constantly, scalpers setting up bots to autopurchase, etc. It also lets the builders gauge demand in advance, or take pre-orders to help with cash flow.

[knicknack]

I was considering going for one (having ordered then cancelled when this first came out and I waited 9 months for nothing!) but honestly when it came to it I couldn't bring myself to press the button. I think Spencer comes across as quite prickly, especially when the first batches had print problems and he was slow to rectify. The preamp debacle last time around was spectacular... it's his product so he can do what he likes but he does seem to hate his own customers sometimes.  

 

Wish someone else would get a small OC-2 with a SUB solo out on to the market! Cog mini t-47 looked promising but again, good luck getting one!

Edited November 27, 2023 by knicknack

[Sibob]

5 minutes ago, knicknack said:

I was considering going for one (having ordered then cancelled when this first came out and I waited 9 months for nothing!) but honestly when it came to it I couldn't bring myself to press the button. I think Spencer comes across as quite prickly, especially when the first batches had print problems and he was slow to rectify. The preamp debacle last time around was spectacular... it's his product so he can do what he likes but he does seem to hate his own customers sometimes.  

 

Wish someone else would get a small OC-2 with a SUB solo out on to the market! Cog mini t-47 looked promising but again, good luck getting one!

Boss would clean up if they would just do what I say (😆) and release a OC2W (Waza) and expose that sub-only function via a double-tap or EXT footwitch out.

Si

[knicknack]

@Sibob 100% to that! I love my OC-2 but honestly the 5 is so close, so that added function would be amazing. 

[Kev]

Bought an Octabvre and returned it pretty quickly, didn't understand the hype.  Lots of other options at much more favourable price points.

 

Don't get it really.

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

15 hours ago, Quatschmacher said:

Sorry to hear that.

 

Probably not much comfort but there are other options out there. The 3Leaf stuff is pretty nice but it’s overpriced and not the only game in town for that sound. I had one and sold it about a month after I got it. 

What did you go for in the end?

[Quatschmacher]

5 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

What did you go for in the end?

I’ve kept my MXR Vintage Bass Octave. (Would still like to get the Cog T-47 though for the dual channel thing but missed the last batch due to having to wait for a refund on something else; took weeks of chasing, by which time the Cogs had sold out.)

[ordep]

got both big and small box octavbres. For me the main advantage is the sub switch as I use it for some unison lines in my band. Luckily I got them when prices are normal otherwise I will just get 2 MXR minis 😁

[Daz39]

How long 'til DemonFX have a version out for £79...

[Kev]

20 minutes ago, Daz39 said:

How long 'til DemonFX have a version out for £79...

Given that almost everything Spencer makes are tweaked clones of other circuits, it's probably fair game 😅

[admiralchew]

I think the Chromatron and PWNZOR were original circuits weren’t they? I’m not sure if the Doom 2 is based on anything either. I’m not far enough into circuit design to know where the line is between different circuits though.

[Al Krow]

3 hours ago, knicknack said:

@Sibob 100% to that! I love my OC-2 but honestly the 5 is so close, so that added function would be amazing. 

 

+1 for the OC-5. One of the best value OC-2 clones on the market IMO by the folk who've a pretty good idea what went into the OC-2 😅, plus some really neat additional features e.g. octave up.

 

In Spencer's defence, if he can make a few quid to live off from his endeavours and other folk are willing to pay the prices he's asking, good luck to him!

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

32 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

In Spencer's defence, if he can make a few quid to live off from his endeavours and other folk are willing to pay the prices he's asking, good luck to him!

 Whilst I don't expect him to give them away, I find this a bizarre move motivated purely for profit.

 

[Oomo]

In case it's of use to anyone, I did a side by side comparison of 6 octave pedals (mostly 2nd hand, I wanted to try a bunch out then sell the ones I didn't get on with). I tested them all with 1 octave down at max, and no dry signal (since that's the thing I pretty much only use them for):

 

Boss OC-5

Boss OC-2

Cog T-16

MXR VBO

HX Boctaver

Broughton Subsonic

 

In rough order of least to most favourite for me (but there wasn't much in it for most):

 

HX Boctaver - I just didn't like the sound nearly as much as the others. A bit better after messing around with filters and EQ in other bits of the HX Stomp, but didn't like it at all as a solo effect.

 

MXR VBO - Had a bit too much of a high end fizzle/fuzz/overdriven type of sounde in comparison to some of the others. I prefer a rounded subby type sound from octavers, so this might be better if you prefer fuzz/octave type sounds. I also found the tracking cut out at higher volumes compared to the other pedals (e.g. if you play a note and let it sustain, most of the others kept the suboctave playing until the end, whereas this cut it off earlier).

 

Boss OC-5 - Really great all round pedal, and quite close in sound to the 3 below. Liked all the other sounds (e.g. octave up) it does, and probably the best for versatility. Octave down sound wasn't as rounded as the pedals below to me though. The main difference I found was in latency though - it's totally unnoticable when playing it alone for a while, but when swapping back and forth between an all analog pedal (e.g. the OC-2), it becomes really obvious (same with the HX Stomp).

 

Broughton Subsonic - Based on the OC-2, but fixes various foibles, and is nice and simple with just an octave down. Very close to the OC-2, but the sound to me was maybe 90-95% of the way there, but not quite as deep/rounded as I like.

 

Boss OC-2 - Probably my favourite sound all round, it's classic for a reason I guess. Tracking not as good as some of the others, but you get used to it. Very sub/round sound.

 

Cog T-16 - Don't like the sound as much as the OC-2, but having a filter on it makes it extremely versatile, and can dial in a much wider range of sounds. It also tracks a bit better, and has a tiny footprint, so great all round.

 

I'm using the T-16 on my board, but I'd probably use the Subsonic as a backup. The OC-2 I love for recording at home, but I don't trust its reliability enough to play out (but mine is a bit battered...). The OC-5 I'd also keep just for octave up sounds.

[Al Krow]

9 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

 Whilst I don't expect him to give them away, I find this a bizarre move motivated purely for profit.

 

 

But why do you find it odd? He's simply establishing a market price for his kit by putting it on eBay - I mean why should the folk who buy purely to resell kit on eBay make all the mark-up on his work (or to cite another example which I personally find galling, those secondary ticket resellers who buy up tickets purely to resell them at vast profits). 

 

Surely he's free to make use of eBay along with the rest of us?

 

No one's forcing anyone to buy anything here.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Al Krow

[admiralchew]

1 minute ago, Al Krow said:

 

But why do you find it odd? He's simply establishing a market price for his kit by putting it on eBay - I mean why should the sharks who resell kit on eBay make all the mark-up on his work (or those secondary ticket resellers who buy up tickets purely to resell them at vast profits). 

 

Surely he's free to make use of eBay along with the rest of us?

 

No one's forcing anyone to buy anything here.

Agreed.
 

I think Spencer’s come under a lot of criticism for offering a product that has allowed scalpers to make big profits. I’ve seen on other well known forums the sentiment that people would rather pay him than a scalper. I suppose the auctions at least take scalpers out of the equation as the prices paid are the effective market prices. If he charged the current market price (as more easily seen on eBay and Reverb than his website) then they would be beyond the reach of all but a few and he would make even greater profits. I’ve seen the prices start to come down as substantially more Doom 2s etc hit the market than over the last three years (when months could pass without seeing one) and I think that trend will continue to some degree.

 

I’ve seen some pedal manufacturers do timed drops, others take preorders and others still do surprise drops. My least favourite is the surprise drop but they all have issues. The timed drop rewards those using certain platforms and payments. Surprise drops penalise those that can’t refresh all day (at least small batches where seconds count). Preorders work but place an immense amount of mental stress on builders (as seen previously with Cog and 3 Leaf).

 

Ultimately there’s a lot more demand than there is supply. I know Spencer is highly committed to what he does and, if he considers himself making art rather than a product, demanding that he make ever more may not fit in with his goal or his reason for making pedals in the first place. It’s a shame for pedal-users, because he makes great pedals, but there are some excellent alternatives.

[Kev]

42 minutes ago, hiram.k.hackenbacker said:

 Whilst I don't expect him to give them away, I find this a bizarre move motivated purely for profit.

 

Surely that's a scalper and can't actually be 3Leaf listing their own pedals for auction?

 

Zero feedback makes me think it must be, no?  Also, surely if it was 3Leaf themselves, they'd have gone for the first 10 serial numbers or similar, rather than random ones?

Edited November 27, 2023 by Kev

[Kev]

1 hour ago, admiralchew said:

I think the Chromatron and PWNZOR were original circuits weren’t they? I’m not sure if the Doom 2 is based on anything either. I’m not far enough into circuit design to know where the line is between different circuits though.

I think the Chomatron was just a development of the meatball clone series he did, Groove Regulator, Wonderlove etc?  Might not be though.

 

No idea about the compressor, but you may well be right with the Doom/2 being an original design?

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

20 minutes ago, Al Krow said:

 

But why do you find it odd? He's simply establishing a market price for his kit by putting it on eBay - I mean why should the folk who buy purely to resell kit on eBay make all the mark-up on his work (or to cite another example which I personally find galling, those secondary ticket resellers who buy up tickets purely to resell them at vast profits). 

 

Surely he's free to make use of eBay along with the rest of us?

 

No one's forcing anyone to buy anything here.

It’s odd because it does not resolve the issue. His justification is that he’s had complaints about buyers reselling pedals at inflated prices, so his solution is to do what everyone has complained about, the only difference being, he gets the money instead. Well done Spencer 👏👏👏👏. By the way, he marketed this endeavour as ‘I’m selling these pedals at 99% off standard price’ which was the starting bid on the auction 🤷‍♂️. It doesn’t resolve what the buyers have complained about, but it does resolve what he obviously has a beef with. Now if he was passing the profits above $333 on to charity - different story.

 

Maintaining an order list, in my view a fairer way to do things, would be more labour intensive for him, but at least he would know where they are going and just under 100 pedals wouldn’t disappear in an instant to bot buyers. At the time, I was really frustrated with FEA Labs (more the lack of commas than anything), even though I knew I was on their waiting list, but at least they came through in the end.

 

I now have zero interest in passing any of my hard earned in his direction. I shall investigate other options instead.

[hiram.k.hackenbacker]

7 minutes ago, Kev said:

I think the Chomatron was just a development of the meatball clone series he did, Groove Regulator, Wonderlove etc?  Might not be though.

 

No idea about the compressor, but you may well be right with the Doom/2 being an original design?

It is 3 Leaf Audio. It’s exactly as announced on the web site along with links to those auctions.