The Continuing Story of Problem Bandmates.

[Chienmortbb]

We have generally a good band, but one member slightly irritates me. Last night I played a wrong note, he told everyone out loud. I admit that I am not the greatest bassist the world has known but? However, I can rarely;y hear our monitors (vocals only) and last night I hear this horrible noise during one song. He is trying to sing backing vocals and it's horrible.

 

I am the newest member of the band, and he has been in almost since the start, so how do I approach the subject without causing a major incident.

[Supernaut]

A simple proposal will do the job:

 

Stop the unprofessional comments or I walk. 
 

Speak to your other bandmates before speaking to the problem child. They may share a similar opinion. 

[Lozz196]

Think the above is spot on

[Doctor J]

When he's doing BVs call out if he hits a right note.

[Beedster]

There will always be a bit of this, it's basic (sub) human pecking order stuff, but it's worth finding a way around it either way, and over weeks and months engineering that solution in. For example if his BVs are that bad suggest they record the rehearsals to identify 'areas for improvement'? My (sarcastic) approach to poor vocal pitching has always been "sounds like the band are out of tune with the vocals there, we'll all need to work on that? 

[tauzero]

I'm terrible at social niceties and quite honest, so I say if something's wrong (but I try to do it nicely). If you're playing a note wrong consistently, that does need pointing out. If it's a one-off, it doesn't.

 

As for BVs, try the approach of asking him if he can hear himself properly as he doesn't seem to be pitching them right. Adopting a sympathetic approach will probably be more productive than either ignoring it or being confrontational. If all else fails, start recording rehearsals.

[Happy Jack]

Hmmmmm. Recording rehearsals can be a classic example of "You can lead a horse to water ...".

 

Don't ask me how I know.

 

[Beedster]

8 minutes ago, Happy Jack said:

Hmmmmm. Recording rehearsals can be a classic example of "You can lead a horse to water ...".

 

Don't ask me how I know.

 

You the horse or the water Jack 😆

[Happy Jack]

4 minutes ago, Beedster said:

You the horse or the water Jack 😆

 

The water, baby, deffo the water.

 

I often record rehearsals for my own benefit and I'd not bother to do that if I wasn't going to actually listen to those recordings, maybe learn something from them. If I've gone to the trouble of making a recording, then of course I'm going to offer it to my bandmates, but without insisting that they listen, learn, and inwardly digest. 😟

 

I'm well aware that not everybody shares that approach, and offering to share rehearsal recordings has been met over the years with the full range from enthusiasm and gratitude via complete apathy to outright suspicion and hostility.

[Beedster]

17 minutes ago, Happy Jack said:

 

The water, baby, deffo the water.

 

I often record rehearsals for my own benefit and I'd not bother to do that if I wasn't going to actually listen to those recordings, maybe learn something from them. If I've gone to the trouble of making a recording, then of course I'm going to offer it to my bandmates, but without insisting that they listen, learn, and inwardly digest. 😟

 

I'm well aware that not everybody shares that approach, and offering to share rehearsal recordings has been met over the years with the full range from enthusiasm and gratitude via complete apathy to outright suspicion and hostility.

I think I've been quite lucky in that most of the folks I've played with seem able to listen to a rehearsal recording and calibrate it against their and the band's expectations. Where I find it most helpful is in timing, IME most decent musicians can hear pitch problems in real time and respond accordingly but many really struggle to hear rhythmic problems, especially when systemic.

 

But yes, I've been lucky 👍

[wateroftyne]

1 hour ago, tauzero said:

I'm terrible at social niceties and quite honest, so I say if something's wrong (but I try to do it nicely). If you're playing a note wrong consistently, that does need pointing out. If it's a one-off, it doesn't.

 

I don't know which scenario is the case in this instance, but the above is true.

[AndyTravis]

Fingers crossed - my current lot are just right.

 

I think guitarist put it right “it’s like winning the band lottery”.

 

All similar ability, all learn quickly and happy to leave each other to play our way. Open to suggestions on parts…

 

So far, so good.

 

The last band was me writing songs with a clear idea of what I wanted (not always what the song needed), drummer wanted more bass playing at all times, singer who made up new lyrics every time we played a song and would tell everyone how to play “y’know more wakka wakka, play simpler but with more parts, like faster but clearer…” and a guitarist whose catchphrase was “I’m staying out of it”

 

No wonder it was a car crash.

[Woodinblack]

"Sorry - I was just following your vocals"

[Chienmortbb]

Some good stuff on here. I was considering suggesting that we record the rehearsals on the basis that something was not right. 
 

As for the bum note. I wax tired, I have been sick for some weeks. It is not a regular occurrence. 
 

It was actually a good night overall and maybe my tiredness was also part of the problem. 
 

I will chat to the de facto band leader about my general concerns over the BVs. To be honest and much to my chagrin, we never rehearse  vocals. 
 

 

[chris_b]

27 minutes ago, Chienmortbb said:

. . . . . It is not a regular occurrence. . . . It was actually a good night overall . . . .

 

I had a similar situation a few weeks ago with a band leader who chose to hassle me about one verse in a song that went wrong (I'll hold my hands up, my fault) and ignored the other 23 songs which I played perfectly, even though he was making mistakes all night.

 

The best thing is to ignore twots like this. Just prove them wrong with your playing.

 

 

Edited December 30, 2023 by chris_b

[chris_b]

duplicate!!

Edited December 30, 2023 by chris_b

[Dan Dare]

I highly recommend sarcasm - "Thank you so much for pointing out my error. I would never have known I had made a mistake had you not drawn everyone's attention to it. I'll go home and practice for ten hours a day. Please, please forgive me. I am not worthy", etc, etc.

[Chienmortbb]

2 hours ago, AndyTravis said:

Fingers crossed - my current lot are just right.

I really like the band members but he can occasionally be a pain in the derrière. I do not want to ruin a good thing. What is quite worrying is that a good friend mentioned the poor BVs after the gig.

[Paul S]

One of my old bands did a 'good thing'.  3 of the 4 of us sang (not me) and they would have vocal rehearsals to get the harmonies spot on.  It was easy to do round someone's house, rather than eating into paid rehearsal room time, and it meant I didn't have to hang around counting my toes waiting for them to finish.  Maybe this would help with your guy, if it is isolated it might be more noticeable?

[Chienmortbb]

4 minutes ago, Paul S said:

One of my old bands did a 'good thing'.  3 of the 4 of us sang (not me) and they would have vocal rehearsals to get the harmonies spot on.  It was easy to do round someone's house, rather than eating into paid rehearsal room time, and it meant I didn't have to hang around counting my toes waiting for them to finish.  Maybe this would help with your guy, if it is isolated it might be more noticeable?

I have actually suggested this before, but nothing happened. I will try once more.

[jimmyb625]

The rule we have is "not in front of the public". Anything goes in rehearsals, but if it's in front of a crowd, we don't say anything (unless there's a mistake of epic proportions when you have to stop the song during the intro - usually the keys player in the wrong key).

[TimR]

That kind of behaviour will eventually wear you down and things will come to a head. 

 

Usually a lack of confidence or redirecting their own incompetence so that the rest of the band don't hear their bad singing. 

 

I had the same with a drummer who would glare at me, even during a gig, it becomes very limiting as you stop taking any risks with improvisation where an 'unexpected' note would be met with the glare. 

 

Needs to be handled carefully, or not, depending on what you want the outcome to be. Ultimately that kind of behaviour isn't productive in an open band. People should be able to smile when a wrong note creeps in without worrying about it being analysed to death. That takes all the fun out.

[TimR]

5 hours ago, Beedster said:

There will always be a bit of this, it's basic (sub) human pecking order stuff,

 

I can't be doing with it. It's childish. Should be happening in a creative environment as it stifles creativity if people are being told they're doing something wrong or being criticised.

 

There are much better ways of handling musical issues than blaming one individual for being wrong, especially when it's clear that everyone else isn't completely on their A game. 

[uk_lefty]

My approach to a bandmate with awful backing vocals in the past band was to ask "were you trying to sing higher or lower than the lead there?" And the answer of "I dunno, just singing along" led to others saying thanks but please don't. Job done, we then talked about who does which bit and how, practiced and got better.

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

My bandmates only mention my playing when I play a song without any wrong notes. As far as I'm concerned any right:wrong note ratio of over 0.5 is a win.

 

Life's too short to be in a band with an a-hole. In my previous band it was the drummer and in the one before that it was the second guitarist. In my current band there doesn't seem to be one, so I'm a little worried that it might be me.

Edited December 30, 2023 by Jean-Luc Pickguard