What do all these Preamps Actually Do?

[Tokalo]

I got myself a MTD Kingston Z4 with my Christmas bonus.

All seems good (very good - really light, punchy p/ups, wonderful neck), although I can’t try it out at volume with a band for a couple more days.

 

Reading around (on here and TB), there seems to be a consensus that the G&B preamp is a bit weak/thin. I’ve stretched my budget to buy the bass, and I’m not looking to spend more.
 

It occurs to me that I have 3 preamps in my chain:

1 - on the bass;

2 - a Laney Digbeth on my pedalboard;

3 - the eq controls on the amp.

 

So I’ve got plenty of options to thicken the sound and give it a bit of welly.

 

Would I really see any benefit from swapping in a £170 - £210 preamp?

[tauzero]

Wait and see what it's like at volume before deciding if you need to do something about the preamp. Can you switch between active and passive?

[Paolo85]

EDIT: on second read, the question is different than I thought

Edited January 2 by Paolo85

[Beedster]

21 minutes ago, Tokalo said:

Reading around (on here and TB), there seems to be a consensus that the G&B preamp is a bit weak/thin

 

Musicians forums are echo chambers, there's the tendency for people to repeat things they've read irrespective of whether they have the experience/opinion in question. As @tauzero suggests, use a bit of trial and error

[Beedster]

Just now, Beedster said:

 

Musicians forums are echo chambers, there's the tendency for people to repeat things they've read irrespective of whether they have the experience/opinion in question

 

BTW I read that on the internet so thought I'd repeat it here 👍

[lemmywinks]

It depends how you shape your sound and what you want from it, lots of people are happy with stock preamps and are just looking to send a good sounding, clean signal to their amp, external preamp or desk. I do most of my tone shaping on the bass so need the onboard pre to cut/boost at frequencies my ears find pleasing. For me that usually means being able to cut excess treble without sounding too dull and maybe boost bass a tiny bit without sounding muddy.

 

The annoying thing is when you find a preamp with features or a baked in sound you really like it's sometimes hard to switch to a different one, it's only a minority that are finding the Korean MTD preamps underwhelming and that's probably because they had an East or something in their previous basss and really liked it. At least we're not stuck in the 90s and early 2000s where cheaper onboard preamps sounded almost universally awful with harsh, noisy treble controls, just about everything is giggable these days.

 

Modern problems eh?

Edited January 2 by lemmywinks

[chris_b]

As a non pedal using player, my first thought is how important is the sound of the bass if you have that many preamps.

 

My guess is that you shouldn't have a problem getting the sound you want, but if you still want "more" I'd start with the pickups.

[neepheid]

1 hour ago, Tokalo said:

Reading around (on here and TB), there seems to be a consensus that the G&B preamp is a bit weak/thin. I’ve stretched my budget to buy the bass, and I’m not looking to spend more.

 

That's of utterly no consequence.  The only important opinion is yours, and what your ears tell you.  Honestly, the amount of "tales round the campfire" "lore" that gets thrown around like fact and dogma annoys the waste water out of me. 

 

Make up your own mind when it comes to subjective matters of taste.  And if I may offer advice, I'd say don't even think about modding a damn thing on a bass until you've at least played it at "war volume" in the context you intend to use it most in, be that playing live with bands or recording stuff at home on your own.

Edited January 2 by neepheid

[Beedster]

3 minutes ago, chris_b said:

As a non pedal using player, my first thought is how important is the sound of the bass if you have that many preamps.

 

My guess is that you shouldn't have a problem getting the sound you want, but if you still want "more" I'd start with the pickups.

 

Always felt pre-amp number/choice was more about convenience/playing style than tone shaping, onboard for those who like/need to make minor tweaks during the set, pedal for more binary changes during set, amp for more global settings. 

 

But yes, PUPs a very good place to start 👍 

[No lust in Jazz]

Record the rehearsal with your bandmates. A few days later, or if you are patient, a couple of weeks later, listen to the rehearsal recording.

 

Ask yourself does the sound I'm getting work with the material of the band? If yes - great. If not, think what is the bass sound missing and try to address the issue with your existing gear.  

 

It's worth taking time to listen to what you're getting from your existing gear before entering the 'world of dicking about with gear'.

[Owen]

A lot of my playing these days is DI'd. Therefore I like to have some control on my actual bass, not even at my feet. If I was going into backline I would be quite happy to be playing an instrument with no preamp. It is what works for you, not what works for someone on the internet who quite possibly thinks that particular set up might sound thin in their bedroom. 

[Muzz]

I don't use an amp much these days, and my 'base sound' comes from a Stomp, which would be a nightmare to tweak on the fly. I never liked tweaking my amp EQ live, either, so I've always liked East preamps - the sweepable mids are absolutely essential for me, and I've got one in most of my basses.

 

To the OP, tho, I'd say given your signal chain, tweak the sound elsewhere (tho if you want to to change it onstage you'll be tweaking either on the floor or at the amp - as mentioned above, I don't want to do that) and see how it goes. 

 

The only other issue is are you using more than one bass? You don't want to be tweaking pedals/amps for different basses live...

[chris_b]

45 minutes ago, Owen said:

. . . .  I like to have some control on my actual bass, not even at my feet. If I was going into backline I would be quite happy to be playing an instrument with no preamp.

 

This

 

2 of my top 3 all-time fantastic sounding basses were passive.

[Tokalo]

Thanks for all the comments.

I wasn’t particularly looking for an active bass: it was the neck and the weight (and looks!) I liked.

Stock p/ups are MTD proprietary Bartolini soapbars, which seem to do a good job through headphones.

 

I use the tube drive on the Digbeth pedal to thicken up the sound, and to adjust the eq according to the room etc.

My amp is a TC BQ500, which I tend to keep flat so it’s really just a power amp.

 

It seems to me that the role of electrics on a bass is to capture as much of the whole tone (ie note + harmonics + sub-harmonics) as possible. 

 

So as long as the onboard preamp doesn’t take away any of the signal from the pickups, it will be staying put (though I’ll be asking GaryMac to add and push/pull passive pot).

[Baloney Balderdash]

As other people have already pointed out the pickups have a much bigger say on the basic tone/character of your bass than any onboard preamp will ever have.

 

So I am going to repeat the advice those other people have already given, if, and only if, you need your bass to produce a different tone, start with swapping the pickups for some different/"better" ones, closer to your personal preference. 

 

Edited January 2 by Baloney Balderdash

[gjones]

I play a lot of venues where I'm going straight into a front of house PA. Any amp I have have onstage is just for monitoring. So I use my onboard preamp to tweak my sound before it gets to the desk. That means I have some control on how my bass sounds out front.

 

It also means that when I'm not going through the PA I can go out front at sound check and adjust my sound from my bass, rather than have to go back to the amp to change EQ..

[Downunderwonder]

If you can't get a good sound after it goes through the diggity gizmo maybe you need to play about with the diggity gizmo some more.

[KingPrawn]

I don't think preamps are the answer to every situation. I always think about my chain/ source. If I have a bass I like playing with a set of pickups I like that's where it stops. However, I do use a line 6 Helix and Radial preamps as my straight-to-desk option for lots of my dep gigs. it just means I travel light. I still have the source (bass) as the constant. As many have rightly suggested the pickups, and bass preamp are your main source in the chain. The rest is just personal preference your ears and in my case convenience.

[Boodang]

The problem I have with onboard preamps is that you've got limited space, limited power and limited controls as you're trying to squeeze it into limited real estate. Unless you have a 'thing' for the sound of a particular onboard preamp I wouldn't bother. I like to get it correct at the source, the pickups, keep it passive and then use a line driver to get the signal impedance down so little loss on the cable. These days I find I get my sound using a compressor rather than eq, but whatever works for you really. If you like the sound of the pups and you like the sound of your outboard gear, then all should be good.

PS I had a Tobias a few years ago (I know, not quite an MTD!) which had a pine body. Apart from being uber light it sounded great. Can't quite remember why I sold it now!

[Lfalex v1.1]

[YMMV!]

 

On-board- Tweaks the core tone of the bass.

 

Outboard Pre- Valve drive, switchable EQs (set to unity gain with bypass)

DI to desk so I can have control  over what they get.

 

Amp EQ- Tailors the sound of the backline to the stage environment without it affecting the FOH sound. 

 

Same for passive basses. Just no onboard EQ.