Zoom H series with 32bit float. Now in the UK

[dave_bass5]

Ive been researching getting a H5 or H6 over the past few days, mainly to use as an ambient mic on stage and  to use close to the drums so i get a decent recording of them. Pretty much decided on the H5 and then i saw these new ones. 

All the new range have 32 bit float and the new H5 has a much nicer screen. Also BT controlled. 

Quite ugly looking though (IMO). Still not convinced i shouldn't get the old H5, but might wait and see how these do in reviews. 

 

 

 

Edited February 20 by dave_bass5

[Happy Jack]

As a long-term user of the whole range (old H2, late-model H1, H4 and H6, not to mention all the Q2n-4k's we have lying about) I like these new versions and the upgrades that come with them, but certainly not enough to warrant spending still more money to get them.

 

The extra features would be nice, but none of them are - by any definition - essential.

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

I'm a big fan of my H2n, and use it to record every rehearsal and gig. I will probably wait for the next iteration of the h2 before thinking of upgrading, but the 32 bit float, usb-c, and bluetooth control look like worthwhile updates.

[dave_bass5]

38 minutes ago, Jean-Luc Pickguard said:

I'm a big fan of my H2n, and use it to record every rehearsal and gig. I will probably wait for the next iteration of the h2 before thinking of upgrading, but the 32 bit float, usb-c, and bluetooth control look like worthwhile updates.

Those are the 3 things that will make me want the new H4 over the old H5. 

[dave_bass5]

These are now in stock in the UK

I’ve ordered the H1 as i felt i didn’t really need any of the multitrack stuff, and wanted to keep it as small as possible. 
Should arrive tomorrow and I’ll get to put it to the test on Friday. 
 

At the moment I’m having to run my Roland recorder on 1 and still getting a lot of cymbal compression. Hoping the H1 will fix this. 

[dave_bass5]

1 hour ago, dave_bass5 said:

These are now in stock in the UK

I’ve ordered the H1 as i felt i didn’t really need any of the multitrack stuff, and wanted to keep it as small as possible. 
Should arrive tomorrow and I’ll get to put it to the test on Friday. 
 

At the moment I’m having to run my Roland recorder on 1 and still getting a lot of cymbal compression. Hoping the H1 will fix this. 

Changed the order to the H4e. It seems like it will handle slightly higher sound levels. 

[Happy Jack]

I've kept digging on this subject due to an issue with my old H4n Pro - the Mic capsule has for some months now been producing seriously lop-sided recording levels, as if panned Left by about 50%. The Input signal is perfectly balanced and no adjustment I can make to the Mic capsule (switch between 90/120, hard-pan the signal to the Right by 50%, etc.) seems to cure the problem. Unfortunately, the capsule itself is not removeable, so cannot be replaced.

 

All this is First World problems, and I can 'fix' the sound by hard-panning Right in post (at the cost of losing rather more than half the level which must then, in turn, also be fixed), but it is clear that my trusty H4n Pro is no longer completely reliable. Given that it's done well over 300 gigs with me and my bands, that's a shame - I don't see this device as 'optional'.

 

So I've taken a long hard look at the H4 Essential and decided that actually the only thing I really like is the Float 32 thingy. Pretty much everything else appears to be at best on a par with the H4n Pro and in many cases (pun intended) it's clearly a step towards "built down to a price". This would make sense if it was cheap, but they sell the damned things for £186 at Bax and that's the cheapest price I could find. 🙄

 

Meanwhile, the H4n Pro is clearly now seen as obsolescent, so GAK are selling them at a heavy discount, down from £205 to £149. 

 

This just became a complete no-brainer for me. A fully-featured, solidly-built H4n Pro for £149 or a reduced-feature piece of flimsy plastic for £186? And very probably an H4 Essential Pro in the works right now which will retail for £220-£260?

 

I've just ordered another H4n Pro; I'll keep the old one as a spare and for use when all I need is a feed from the desk.

 

[dave_bass5]

Thats great, its always worth sticking with what works. In my case my Roland R-07 is perfect for most things, but i have had a few occasions where even on 1 the recorder has clipped when the cymbals have been hit a bit too hard. 

The whole 32 bit float thing is the only thing i care about with the Zoom. Never going to use the other inputs, Markers, mixer etc. Just plonk it down anywhere and not worry about levels or having to monitor them. Saying that, i do use the recorder on the drums as my ambient/Drum feed to IEM’s, so a nice cleaner feed to the XR18 is most welcome. 

 

We had a rehearsal with my H4e on Friday and i was really pleased that 32 bit float is not just a PR spin. It really did do what it’s supposed to, and even the drums couldn’t cause any clipping. I had it set in the middle of the room, and it picked up everyone clean and clear. My Apple Watch kept complaining the volume levels were over 90db, so we were loud, and the room is small (thats for another thread)……but……..there is some low freq rumble. I didnt hear it at first, but once i was aware of it i can hear it quite a bit. 

The H4e was on a stand and no one was near it. It wasnt a volume issue as i can hear it at the start of a song where just one guitar is playing. At first i put it down to vibration, but i dont think it’s that, unless the stand was somehow wobbling (cant see how though). I also thought maybe it was to do with the portable AirCon machine maybe blowing and it picking that up, it was quite high and in line with the recorder, but not really near it, but the parts where no one is playing are fine. 

 

So its going back and ill stick with what i have for now. Next rehearsal isnt for about a month and if i keep it to try it again ill loose the return window. 

[SimBass]

For a bit of long term feedback on the 32 bit float recording 

I've been using a Tsacam Portacapture x8 for nearly a year now after my Zoom H6 fell of a mic stand.

The Portacapture is basically the same as the H6 except rather than the minimal approach of the new "essential" it goes the opposite way with a big touch screen interference.

 

Whilst I love the interface (although you pay a premium for it). It is the ease of the 32 bit float recording that I love. It's just so easy.

I was using it on Saturday evening (as ambient mic for in ears but also to record) and half way through the gig realised the monitor feed I had as an extra input was coming in red hot and blasting the input. Listen back afterwards and no issues. Just throw it into he DAW and hit "normalise" on the audio track and it's as if you set the most perfect gain.... love it. And from my experience with products from Zoom, I'm sure they'll be great, although really very ugly?

[dave_bass5]

With the H4e and H6e you can even normalise and convert to 24 bit in the device which i think is quite cool if you need compatibility with other devices. 

 

Im not giving up completely with 32 bit float, but for now im going to go back to 24 bit until i can be bothered to try again. Quite disappointed with the extra noise that i got on the recording, but we have another rehearsal in a months time so im hoping Amazon have them in stock so i can try another unit. 

 

 

[dave_bass5]

On 25/02/2024 at 19:10, Happy Jack said:

I've kept digging on this subject due to an issue with my old H4n Pro - the Mic capsule has for some months now been producing seriously lop-sided recording levels, as if panned Left by about 50%. The Input signal is perfectly balanced and no adjustment I can make to the Mic capsule (switch between 90/120, hard-pan the signal to the Right by 50%, etc.) seems to cure the problem. Unfortunately, the capsule itself is not removeable, so cannot be replaced.

 

All this is First World problems, and I can 'fix' the sound by hard-panning Right in post (at the cost of losing rather more than half the level which must then, in turn, also be fixed), but it is clear that my trusty H4n Pro is no longer completely reliable. Given that it's done well over 300 gigs with me and my bands, that's a shame - I don't see this device as 'optional'.

 

So I've taken a long hard look at the H4 Essential and decided that actually the only thing I really like is the Float 32 thingy. Pretty much everything else appears to be at best on a par with the H4n Pro and in many cases (pun intended) it's clearly a step towards "built down to a price". This would make sense if it was cheap, but they sell the damned things for £186 at Bax and that's the cheapest price I could find. 🙄

 

Meanwhile, the H4n Pro is clearly now seen as obsolescent, so GAK are selling them at a heavy discount, down from £205 to £149. 

 

This just became a complete no-brainer for me. A fully-featured, solidly-built H4n Pro for £149 or a reduced-feature piece of flimsy plastic for £186? And very probably an H4 Essential Pro in the works right now which will retail for £220-£260?

 

I've just ordered another H4n Pro; I'll keep the old one as a spare and for use when all I need is a feed from the desk.

 

Ok, so listening back to the recording i did with the H4e i can hear more and more of those rumbles. Even when only one instrument is playing (or even when we are all playing). No idea what was causing this but i don’t think I’ll go there again, at least not for now. Shame as the recording was the cleanest and clearest ive done with a digital recorder. 

 

Ive been looking at the H4pro and it does look like a much more robust recorder. It seems like it will work for me as it seems to handle high signal levels. I need to have this right next to the snare/High hat without clipping. 

 

[Happy Jack]

7 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

I need to have this right next to the snare/High hat without clipping. 

 

My preferred use for the H4n Pro is to have it on a small but stable tripod on the floor just to the side of the drummer's throne, the two mic capsules of course pointing directly at the kit. Meanwhile, I take a stereo splitter cable from the Headphones Out on the desk (used to be an XR18, now a Ui24, works equally well with both) to a pair of 1/4" mono jacks which go into the combi sockets on the H4n Pro.

 

The recorder needs to be in 4CH mode for this to work and I leave mine set like that at all times regardless. 

 

That gives me a 2-channel stereo FOH mix from the board plus a 2-channel stereo mic close-up of the kit, which is the element that tends to feature least in the FOH mix.

 

In fairness, that's not actually "right next to the snare", but it's pretty darned close and anyway @Silvia Bluejay and I have taken more and more to mic'ing the kit using the Glyn Johns approach, so theres more snare & hi-hat in the FOH mix these days.

 

[dave_bass5]

10 hours ago, Happy Jack said:

My preferred use for the H4n Pro is to have it on a small but stable tripod on the floor just to the side of the drummer's throne, the two mic capsules of course pointing directly at the kit. Meanwhile, I take a stereo splitter cable from the Headphones Out on the desk (used to be an XR18, now a Ui24, works equally well with both) to a pair of 1/4" mono jacks which go into the combi sockets on the H4n Pro.

 

The recorder needs to be in 4CH mode for this to work and I leave mine set like that at all times regardless. 

 

That gives me a 2-channel stereo FOH mix from the board plus a 2-channel stereo mic close-up of the kit, which is the element that tends to feature least in the FOH mix.

 

In fairness, that's not actually "right next to the snare", but it's pretty darned close and anyway @Silvia Bluejay and I have taken more and more to mic'ing the kit using the Glyn Johns approach, so theres more snare & hi-hat in the FOH mix these days.

 

Cheers. As far as the drums go that's pretty much what I have to do. If there is a big stage I'll put it in the centre in front, but on smaller stages it needs to sit just off the snare and HH. The kick gets mixed up and my drummer doesn't use his toms much. Ive also found the vocal mics seem to do a good job of picking the drums up anyway, but I prefer a bit of stereo spread in my IEM's if possible. 

It all gets recorded in Logic on my iPad via USB so I can mix it later (and correct any mistakes I make before send it to the band ;-).

 

Think I'll look in to the H4n Pro this month. Having now seen a few reviews of the H4e it seems while the recording system is fine, the mics are a bit too sensitive to high pressure transients. This is probably what I was suffering from. 

[Happy Jack]

3 minutes ago, dave_bass5 said:

Think I'll look in to the H4n Pro this month. 

 

If it were done, 't'were best done quickly ...

 

That £149 price from GAK has already gone; presumably they've sold out, which doesn't even begin to surprise me.

 

Andertons still have some at £159 and bizarrely a new deal from Thomann has just popped up at £146, though I suspect they'll add £15 for P&P.

[dave_bass5]

Just now, Happy Jack said:

 

If it were done, 't'were best done quickly ...

 

That £149 price from GAK has already gone; presumably they've sold out, which doesn't even begin to surprise me.

 

Andertons still have some at £159 and bizarrely a new deal from Thomann has just popped up at £146, though I suspect they'll add £15 for P&P.

cheers. I was looking at them last night on Amazon for £170 but I'll check Thomanns out. IIR its free over £100. 

[dave_bass5]

Looks like it was £148 inc delivery, so ive ordered one. Thanks for the head up. Love the fact that its black as well 🙂

[dave_bass5]

Just a quick update. 

I used the H4n Pro last night at a rehearsal. Same place i used the H4e.

2 things.

First off,  there was way more of the rumble in the recordings that i complained about before. New stand, new recorder. I do have it figured out now. It seems that one of  the guitarists has a large floor fan and has started using it behind him rather in front. so now it blows across the room. I only realised this as my singer had to ask him to turn it down as she was getting blasted. This must be the cause. 

 

Second, although the recording came out well, and the levels were quite low so never peaked, its all clipped. Im not sure i can hear it, but i can see it in Logic. This was confusing as i even had the limiter on, just in case (i hadn’t used this before so wasnt sure how to set the levels).

After some searching no YT, it seems that when recording with the level set to 2 or lower (i was at just under 1, although in hindsight i could have gone to 2), the signal does clip. So it’s normal, and obviously not a big deal to most people. 

 

I think I’ll try and return it or sell it and go back to the H4e. Seems like it wasnt faulty after all and was more convenient to use.

Edited March 25 by dave_bass5