Streaming Platforms

[wateroftyne]

Apple, 'cos it fits in with what I use, and they pay artists a little more than Spotify's atrocious pittance (although still not enough).

[JPJ]

I’m a Spotify family user. I used to move around a lot with my day job, so having music so easily accessible on any of my devices was the driver. Apple Music launched after I got into Spotify. I use Spotify to find new music, if I like your band, then I’ll buy the content which will then live on all my Apple devices (Mac, iPhone, iPad) thanks to the additional paid-for iTunes Match service. 

As I’m an Apple fanboi I should probably move over to Apple Music, but this is a low priority at the moment.

[SumOne]

If you can be bothered with it: Free trial for a month, build lists of everything you want, record, cancel subscription. Repeat with different services.

 

It's not illegal: https://audials.com/en/company-audials-ag/streaming-recording

 

And if you feel bad for the denying the income an artist would otherwise have made from streaming (I wouldn't feel too bad, Spotify pays artists $0.003 per stream - artists are on there for exposure rather than direct revenue) then you could help them out a lot more by spending the money you saved in subscriptions by buying stuff like vinyl and merchandise direct from them and seeing them live. 

 

 

Edited June 4 by SumOne

[rainbowreality]

I never stream music,  it's not great for artists.  I use Bandcamp and although not strictly a streaming service you get the lovely feeling of directly supporting the artists and discovering lots of great underground bands

[BillyBass]

I use Deezer.  It appears that, so far, I am the only one on this site to do so.  I got Deezer free for three months when I bought some Sonos stuff about 10 years ago and have kept with them.  I paid double to get the higher quality streams (not sure just exactly how 'lossless' this is) and then all the prices came down...and then came down a bit more with a yearly subscription.

 

I use playlists on my iPad to practise along with the songs my covers band(s) play.  I haven't actually listened to music at home that wasn't band related for a long time.

[ped]

I always wonder when buying a CD from Amazon for example how much £ actually goes to the artist. Can it be much more than streaming the album say 50 times? I only ask because I generally buy a CD or Vinyl of any albums I really like, mostly because it’s nice to have a booklet and physical copy

[BigRedX]

28 minutes ago, ped said:

I always wonder when buying a CD from Amazon for example how much £ actually goes to the artist. Can it be much more than streaming the album say 50 times? I only ask because I generally buy a CD or Vinyl of any albums I really like, mostly because it’s nice to have a booklet and physical copy

 

Almost impossible to say, because it will depend on the details of the contract that the artist has signed with their record label as well as what percentage Amazon take from the sale. It has generally been known that the retailer gets the largest proportion of the purchase price whether they be an on-line giant like amazon or an actual "record shop".

 

Even artists releasing their own records or CDs aren't making very much money as most of the purchase price has already been accounted for in the cost of recording and pressing. 

 

If you really want to support your favourite artists you should go and see them play live and buy an official T-Shirt after the gig.

[ped]

4 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

 

Almost impossible to say, because it will depend on the details of the contract that the artist has signed with their record label as well as what percentage Amazon take from the sale. It has generally been known that the retailer gets the largest proportion of the purchase price whether they be an on-line giant like amazon or an actual "record shop".

 

Even artists releasing their own records or CDs aren't making very much money as most of the purchase price has already been accounted for in the cost of recording and pressing. 

 

If you really want to support your favourite artists you should go and see them play live and buy an official T-Shirt after the gig.

If they ever come to the UK and not just London I usually do 👍🏼

[Mickeyboro]

Don’t stream, won’t stream. 

[NancyJohnson]

1 hour ago, Mickeyboro said:

Don’t stream, won’t stream. 

 

I mean, each to their own - and don't quantify your answer here on the basis of format wars - but the question for me is how do you go about discovering anything new or do you just rest on your laurels and feel warm and fuzzy about the music you may already own?

 

 

 

[tegs07]

2 hours ago, Mickeyboro said:

Don’t stream, won’t stream. 

I stream everything these days. Like it or not analogue id dead, broadcast TV and radio are in the old folks home along with physical currency. Everyone is entitled to take a stand but it’s not going to make any difference and you are missing out on a whole lot of benefits. I try to compensate by getting to hear new artists before they get big and going to their gigs and buying their merchandise. I would never have heard of most of these guys otherwise.

Edited June 5 by tegs07

[Mickeyboro]

11 minutes ago, NancyJohnson said:

 

I mean, each to their own - and don't quantify your answer here on the basis of format wars - but the question for me is how do you go about discovering anything new or do you just rest on your laurels and feel warm and fuzzy about the music you may already own?

 

 

 

I don’t have many principles but I just feel it’s exploitation. I buy new stuff from bands I know and follow up new music recommendations from friends (Whatsapp groups) and websites. And yes, you’re right - probably 2/3 of what I listen to is at least 30 years old…

Edited June 5 by Mickeyboro

[NancyJohnson]

28 minutes ago, Mickeyboro said:

I don’t have many principles but I just feel it’s exploitation. I buy new stuff from bands I know and follow up new music recommendations from friends (Whatsapp groups) and websites. And yes, you’re right - probably 2/3 of what I listen to is at least 30 years old…

 

On the question of exploitation, would you expect to be recieving a royalty for work you did 30 years ago?  The royalty model is truly broken, the big money is off touring and merchandising.

 

I've haemorrhaged thousands on music where 80% of the tracks are just filler and would wager I'm not alone.  

[chris_b]

I don't stream. There are very few people these days writing songs that I would listen to more than once.

 

I don't do musical wallpaper. If I want to listen to something specific I'll use YouTube.

[SumOne]

35 minutes ago, Mickeyboro said:

I don’t have many principles but I just feel it’s exploitation. 

 

Couldn't the 'it exploits artists' issue also count for Radio? Artists want to be on these platforms as they mostly treat it in the same way as Radio (and at least they can choose to be on streaming platforms or not).

 

They'll get a small amount of income (streams or royalties), but that's not the real benefit - it gives them exposure so they can make money in other ways:  merchandise, vinyl, downloads, live audiences, and increases their social media audience (Selena Gomez gets $2.5m per advertising Instagram post, Ariana Grande $2.2m) 

 

It's why I wouldn't be too concerned about recording from streaming services, it doesn't make much difference to artists and still helps them achieve their main objective of getting their music heard - so you are more likely to see them live, or follow them on social media etc. And I don't think the amount of people that can be bothered to record are going to be the downfall of streaming services.

 

There was probably fuss over jukeboxes 'killing live music', and radio, and home taping, and go back far enough there was probably concern that recorded music being bad for live musicians. Streaming is just the latest thing, there will be something else in a couple of years: AI is already curating playlists.

[BigRedX]

3 minutes ago, SumOne said:

Couldn't the 'it exploits artists' issue also count for Radio? Artists want to be on these platforms as they mostly treat it in the same way as Radio (and at least they can choose to be on streaming platforms or not).

 

They'll get a small amount of income (streams or royalties)

 

Actually if you are receiving songwriting royalties you get quite a lot (at least in the UK) for being on broadcast radio. Looking at my PRS statements a single play on 6 Music was worth approximately £13. You need to rack up an awful lot of streams even without a record label taking their excessive cut to match that.

[meterman]

12 minutes ago, NancyJohnson said:

 

On the question of exploitation, would you expect to be recieving a royalty for work you did 30 years ago?  

Oddly enough I still get PRS payments for 30+ year old records I co-wrote and played on. For things from the 1990s I don’t receive loadsamoney for what I did but when it comes in it’s usually enough for a night out or something. Not U2 or G’n’R level obviously, but it’s a nice little bonus when it happens. 
 

I have a ‘no streaming platforms’ clause in any contract I sign now, so rely on brokering licensing deals in foreign territories and receiving boxes of free stock from labels. That just about keeps things ticking over financially. Streaming has done büggér all for me in the past, either for royalties or exposure, so I don’t get involved with it now.

 

For discovering new music there’s always the Bandcamp recommendations which you can tailor by genre (and if someone buys any of my releases from there I can have a look at what else they’ve bought - that’s been really good) and online websites (Outsideleft from Birmingham is a good one, Ban Ban Ton Ton from Japan is another, but there’s so many out there).
 

Plus I find new music almost every day on Instagram. Otherwise, Radio Nova from Paris, or Soho Radio or NTS from the UK are good for contemporary things. I might not like all of it but at least I’m getting to hear it and I don’t have to sign up for anything to hear it.

 

Not knocking anyone that chooses streaming as their way of listening to music at all, everything’s valid IMO.

[gjones]

I'm with Deezer, as it pays higher royalties, to the artists, than most other platforms.

[SumOne]

6 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

 

Actually if you are receiving songwriting royalties you get quite a lot (at least in the UK) for being on broadcast radio. Looking at my PRS statements a single play on 6 Music was worth approximately £13. You need to rack up an awful lot of streams even without a record label taking their excessive cut to match that.

 

Do streaming services pay any PRS royalties at all?

Edited June 5 by SumOne

[BigRedX]

14 minutes ago, SumOne said:

 

Do streaming services pay any PRS royalties at all?

 

Yes, of the total amount paid by Spotify per stream it's approximately 75% mechanicals and 25% performance royalties. I suspect that all the other streaming services will be similar.

[Mickeyboro]

Its all the money being made by others (the non musicians/composers) in the streaming process that I object to. Unfair shares…

[BigRedX]

4 minutes ago, Mickeyboro said:

Its all the money being made by others (the non musicians/composers) in the streaming process that I object to. Unfair shares…

 

That's mostly the record labels and it's the same situation as if you'd bought a record or CD. The streaming services themselves make very little money; most make a loss and are being propped up by the more profitable parts of their parent organisation), and none make anything like the kind of money that old fashioned record distributors made.

[Mickeyboro]

3 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

 

That's mostly the record labels and it's the same situation as if you'd bought a record or CD. The streaming services themselves make very little money; most make a loss and are being propped up by the more profitable parts of their parent organisation), and none make anything like the kind of money that old fashioned record distributors made.

The median estimated compensation for executives at Spotify including base salary and bonus is $240,842, or $115 per hour. At Spotify, the most compensated executive makes $450,000, annually, and the lowest compensated makes $53,000. Estimated salaries.
 

GIVE THE MUSICIANS A FAIR SHARE!!

[BigRedX]

4 minutes ago, Mickeyboro said:

The median estimated compensation for executives at Spotify including base salary and bonus is $240,842, or $115 per hour. At Spotify, the most compensated executive makes $450,000, annually, and the lowest compensated makes $53,000. Estimated salaries.
 

GIVE THE MUSICIANS A FAIR SHARE!!

 

That money doesn't come from the advertising revenue or premium subscribers. It comes from investors who are hoping that Spotify will eventually work out how to make their business model turn a profit without requiring investment support. If they want to waste their money on extravagant executive wages then more fool them.

 

And judging by the ads I was getting this morning whilst checking out a playlist for new bands Spotify are in trouble. During a 3 hour listening period I had the same 4 ads repeated over and over and 2 of those were trying to persuade me to "upgrade" to a premium account.

[NancyJohnson]

15 minutes ago, Mickeyboro said:

The median estimated compensation for executives at Spotify including base salary and bonus is $240,842, or $115 per hour. At Spotify, the most compensated executive makes $450,000, annually, and the lowest compensated makes $53,000. Estimated salaries.
 

GIVE THE MUSICIANS A FAIR SHARE!!

 

Business model applies globally.  Doesn't matter if you're digging coal or working on a shop-floor, the guys who own the business will always be the ones that reap the greater reward.  The guy who set up Spotify (Daniel Ek) is still CEO at the business; I say well done to him for creating his niche and good luck to him and the people he has working for him.  Same goes Deezer/Tidal etc.

 

This might sound a bit naive, but the whole royalty thing is a bit odd to me and I find it difficult to actually put down in words as to why.  As I said earlier, personally I don't expect to be getting a reward for work I did 30 years ago, so why shouldn't the same apply to music/film/books/media creators?  They've done the job of creation, so why is there this expectation of a continuing royalty/percentile?