Funk It Up ?

[JackLondon]

Hi Folks,

First of all sorry to the mods if this is in the wrong place but I though it will best fit into this space

Right, about a 8 months ago I've joined my band which can be found here [url="http://www.myspace.com/sugaforthehouse"]Sugar For The House[/url]

It's a 4 piece with 1 guitar and the guitarist is quite genre disabled with funk which is a good thing for the band but not for me.
To be honest it's the first time I've played anything ''funky'' and it proves a bit of dead spot for me. In my previous years I've been playing a lot of Heavy-ish Rock and then moved on to Heavy/Trash Metal so moving to a funk band was a bit of a shock for me.

My question to you guys is how can I aproach my playing so I can literally ''Funk It Up'' I bought myself this book [url="http://www.musicroom.com/se/ID_No/035/details.html"]Funk Bass[/url] but most of it is slap based. I'm not the greatest fan of slap for 2 main reasons : 1. I find it hard to play on a 6-string which I play, 2. I think that funk can be played without going slap-happy. Whenever we write songs my basslines are kind of heavy orientated ( I can hear it so I assume other can as well) and some people say it's a good thing but I'm not convinced myself.

I haven't been listening to loads of funk music in the past so I don't even have anything to be influenced from os maybe some of you can suggest where to start ? The only bands I've been listening to that have something to do with funk are RHCP and Infectious Grooves - This list is that short and I know this is a very open question but having listened to likes of 51m0n on this forum I know there's some of you out there who are funk inspired

So to summarise and make it easier for answers :
1. What bands/bassist should I listen to to get a good feel for funk music and get some infuences
2. What exercises can I use to adapt my playing to have more feel for funk
3. Any pointers / links to where to start

Any suggestions and help will be much apreciated.

Cheers
Jack

[AM1]

[quote name='JackLondon' post='488586' date='May 15 2009, 10:04 AM']My question to you guys is how can I aproach my playing so I can literally ''Funk It Up'' I bought myself this book [url="http://www.musicroom.com/se/ID_No/035/details.html"]Funk Bass[/url] but most of it is slap based. I'm not the greatest fan of slap for 2 main reasons : 1. I find it hard to play on a 6-string which I play, 2. I think that funk can be played without going slap-happy. Whenever we write songs my basslines are kind of heavy orientated ( I can hear it so I assume other can as well) and some people say it's a good thing but I'm not convinced myself.

I haven't been listening to loads of funk music in the past so I don't even have anything to be influenced from os maybe some of you can suggest where to start ? The only bands I've been listening to that have something to do with funk are RHCP and Infectious Grooves - This list is that short and I know this is a very open question but having listened to likes of 51m0n on this forum I know there's some of you out there who are funk inspired

So to summarise and make it easier for answers :
1. What bands/bassist should I listen to to get a good feel for funk music and get some infuences
2. What exercises can I use to adapt my playing to have more feel for funk
3. Any pointers / links to where to start[/quote]

Hi - take a look here:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=45455&hl="]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=45455&hl=[/url]

Also, I recommend the Funk Fusion book referenced in this thread, it has some useful exercises and technique aspects.

[The Funk]

Don't bother with books. Listen to Bootsy!

Play less - much, much less - and think rhythmically more than anything else.

Listen to as much funk as you can and try to copy the brass parts as much as the bass parts.

[ryan0583]

Prince is great for funk, especially the live stuff. There's a lot of slap but also some great finger style stuff. Also Jamiroquai, especially when Stuart Zender played bass for them (first three albums). James Brown and Stevie Wonder are very good too, and any old motown stuff (although not technically funk, I think it's where it all started).

[mcgraham]

Listen to funk and learn from it. Play along with it and try to figure out for yourself what drives it as a genre. Although it depends what sort of funk you're after. If you're after the fundamental basics of funk and funky music, I'd go straight to James Brown stuff. I discovered that later in my playing career, but it's simple, to the point, sparse, tight, tight, tight... did I mention tight? If you mean 'funk' just in a sense of getting a serious groove on, then Jamiroquai is a sound bet (IMO). Jackson 5 has some real funky numbers, even if it doesn't qualify for 70s-cheese-funk... which sounds like some kind of infection. Tower of Power is also good but perhaps a bit intense for getting into funk as a genre, so much going on.

Just listen to stuff, get into a groove, and the rest will follow. It's not about the notes or number of notes, it's about trying to flow with the song. Try and sync up your playing with the part of you that's tapping along to the song.

Mark

[alexclaber]

Listen to James Brown, The Meters, Sly Stone, Parliament.

I'd avoid slap for now, and much in the way of books at all - listen to the music and really focus on your note lengths. A lot of funk is about how you make the pulse as deep as possible without actually playing it simplistically - you imply it through dancing syncopations around it.

Take a normal 8th note bassline and play short-long-short-long etc - that's the classic Sly Stone / Larry Graham funk groove. You can hear me doing this on the track entitled 'Funeral Song' in my sig. No slap, just plenty of grease (though it sounds a lot greasier on my new bass, damned excessively punchy old Warwick).

Alex

[dannybuoy]

There's a great book&cd on Amazon with all the best James Brown bass tabs plus backing tracks. Also, a P or J bass strung with flats going into an envelope filter and phaser will endow you with more funk than you can shake a stick at!

[JackLondon]

[quote name='dannybuoy' post='488995' date='May 15 2009, 03:39 PM']There's a great book&cd on Amazon with all the best James Brown bass tabs plus backing tracks. Also, a P or J bass strung with flats going into an envelope filter and phaser will endow you with more funk than you can shake a stick at![/quote]

Effects - Yes
Fender-like bass - NO, NO, NO, NO

[51m0n]

[quote name='JackLondon' post='488586' date='May 15 2009, 10:04 AM']This list is that short and I know this is a very open question but having listened to likes of 51m0n on this forum I know there's some of you out there who are funk inspired [/quote]

Eeeek, I must really bang on about this.

Sorry :blush:

You've already had the best advice.

[b]Listen to it[/b]

Where to go?

Well you'd do a lot worse than the Craig Charles show. He covers _alot_ of ground.

Spotify is good, the Radio channel allows you to select an era and a genre (Funk 70's is good, if often mellow place to start)

+1 to James Brown, The Meters, Sly Stone, Parliament and Bootsy

+1 to "Leave out slapping for now" - it will take you a while to get there.

There is a funk101 Topic over on Talkbass which has links to LOADS of great funk tracks, really get over there and get downloading, a lot of it is not available any other way (not on CD, vinyl out of print etc)

In terms of syncopation, that will become natural in the end, I dont even know I'm syncopating any more, really, its just what happens when I play - drives my band up the wall when they want to get all butch and rocky - there I am playing Sly and The Family Stone style grooves

[JackLondon]

[quote name='51m0n' post='489004' date='May 15 2009, 03:51 PM']Eeeek, I must really bang on about this.

Sorry :blush:[/quote]

It's not that It was one of your recordings that you've put up on the forum that made me think : WOW I realy do like that

With regards to slapping I don't like it that much to be honest but my guitarist thinks that slapping=funk. I do have one song that I've done using a basic combination of slapping and tapping which is quite funky in the eyes of the whole band but I'm not planning on using it in many songs. It's just not my thing and trying to do it on a 6-string is a challenge in itself

Cheers for the advice guys I shall get listening and I think my girfriend will have enough of funk after this weekend

[51m0n]

If you can find them these are all fantastic:-

Remember the Titans - Express Yourself
100% Pure Poison - Windy C
Aaron Neville - Hercules
Ike Turner's Kings Of Rhythm - Funky Mule
The Meters - Chicken Strut
The Meters - Fire On The Bayou
The Meters - Funky Meters' Soul
Rhythm Heritage - Theme from S.W.A.T.
Dennis Coffey - Scorpio
Dennis Coffey - Getting it On
Dyke And The Blazers - Funky Walk Part 1
Dyke And the Blazers - Let a Woman Be a Woman
Dyke And The Blazers - We Got More Soul

James Brown - There Was A Time (I Got Move)
James Brown - Talkin' Loud and Sayin' Nothing
James Brown - Soul Power
James Brown - licking stick
James Brown - Pass The Peas

Jean Knight - Mr. Big Stuff

Tower Of Power - So I've got to groove
Tower Of Power - On The Serious Side
Tower Of Power - Bump City - live

Brothers Johnson - brothers johnson
Brothers Johnson - Mista' Cool

Tricky - Wonder Woman (f. John Frusciante & Flea)

The Vibrettes - Humpty Dump

[51m0n]

[quote name='JackLondon' post='489010' date='May 15 2009, 04:01 PM']With regards to slapping I don't like it that much to be honest but my guitarist thinks that slapping=funk.[/quote]

Sounds to me like he's the one in need of education, sir!

[The Funk]

There was a horrible time when every guitarist's sound was drenched in chorus, when every keyboard player used the weakest synth pad patch they could find, when every drummer had the life sucked out of his kit with abused noise gates - and when every bass player slapped on everything.

Slap can be funky - it can also be totally unfunky.

[51m0n]

[quote name='The Funk' post='489031' date='May 15 2009, 04:25 PM']There was a horrible time when every guitarist's sound was drenched in chorus, when every keyboard player used the weakest synth pad patch they could find, when every drummer had the life sucked out of his kit with abused noise gates - and when every bass player slapped on everything.

Slap can be funky - it can also be totally unfunky.[/quote]

Wow, that describes Level42 to me perfectly

[lowdown]

[quote name='The Funk' post='489031' date='May 15 2009, 04:25 PM']Slap can be funky - it can also be totally unfunky.[/quote]

Its not the Slap thats unfunky...
Its usually the tit playing it, thats unfunky...........


Sex Machine - James Brown is worth a listen.



Garry

Edited May 15, 2009 by lowdown

[dannybuoy]

Here's that book by the way: [url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Funkmasters-Rhythm-Sections-1960-73-Guitar/dp/1576234436/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1242404358&sr=8-4"]http://www.amazon.co.uk/Funkmasters-Rhythm...4358&sr=8-4[/url]. I have a copy but haven't busted it out yet so I can't vouch for it but it looks good.

[quote name='JackLondon' post='488998' date='May 15 2009, 03:44 PM']Effects - Yes
Fender-like bass - NO, NO, NO, NO[/quote]

No Fenders? You think he should be playing something like this then?

[url="http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/space-bass---bootsy-coll/67561"]http://www.guitarampkeyboard.com/en/space-...otsy-coll/67561[/url]



^ Legend

Edited May 15, 2009 by dannybuoy

[alexclaber]

[quote name='51m0n' post='489037' date='May 15 2009, 04:28 PM']Wow, that describes Level42 to me perfectly [/quote]

The finest example that slap does not equal funk.

One other thing - you've mentioned that your guitarist is unfunky, so don't try to force a funky peg into an unfunky hole. You can't simply throw some funky bass playing into a straight rock band and expect it to sound good, let alone funky. Funk relies on the whole band working together as a giant rhythm section to make the groove bounce, it's a very organic thing.

However although funk has never been a mainstream genre it's been hugely influential in the use of syncopations and other rhythmic cunning in popular music - disco, house, hip hop, garage, drum n bass, big beat, modern RnB, etc and much commercial pop would not sound the way it does if funk had not come first. So because of the inevitable exposure to funk ideas your bandmates may be more receptive than they realise - try subtly slipping in syncopations and so on and see how they react, if they catch on and adjust their playing. Better still, work out a nice funk groove at home and take it in to start a jam and see how they work with it.

There is also a LOT of rock that has some serious funk action going on in the rhythm section - not just the obvious stuff like the Chilis (they're by far their funkiest on BSSM) but a lot of Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, etc. Listen out for rock drummers doing 16th ghost notes on the snare in between the back beats - that came from James Brown funk.

Alex

[dannybuoy]

Edited May 15, 2009 by dannybuoy

[JackLondon]

WOW

That's a lot of info to take in but I shall make yo all proud make your effort count and put all the above to practice

Thanks guys for all the input and taking the time to asnwer this post

Being on the subject of effects, I know some people are fans of them and some not so much. I like effects as long as it's not too much so what would you suggest for good funky sounds ? I always find that a subtle addition of octaver gives a lot of liquid sounds to my ears

I've got a GT10-B so my possibilities are endless so fire away

[51m0n]

Well I used to use quite a lot of effects, octaver can certainly help especially if you have a line thats based on the A D & G strings.

Envelope filters are [b]the[/b] funk effect thanks to Bootsy, they are rarely up to much in a multi-fx though.

These days I only use some compression and leave off all the squelch, I even gave my BP8 to my eldest to get me away from that particular distraction. I foound myself plugging in to practice and then playing with sounds all night

I can still do that just with the focusrite if I'm not careful - have to leave it off if I want to practice for real

[The Funk]

[quote name='lowdown' post='489094' date='May 15 2009, 05:15 PM']Its not the Slap thats unfunky...
Its usually the tit playing it, thats unfunky...........[/quote]

Agreed!

[crez5150]

[quote name='51m0n' post='489037' date='May 15 2009, 04:28 PM']Wow, that describes Level42 to me perfectly [/quote]

Sucks teeth....

[51m0n]

[quote name='crez5150' post='489387' date='May 15 2009, 10:58 PM']Sucks teeth.... [/quote]


oops sorry - bound to hit a nerve for some!

[AM1]

[quote name='51m0n' post='489037' date='May 15 2009, 04:28 PM']Wow, that describes Level42 to me perfectly [/quote]

Racist.

[funkypenguin]

listen to all the music suggested here and try and get the feel of the music. check out some of MKs bass grooves (he's got some fantastic fingerstyle stuff going on thats too often overlooked)...
check some of these out for fingerstyle funk

The Sunbed Song - level 42
True Believers - level 42
Flying on the Wings of love - level 42
My Hero - level 42
Too Young to Die - Jamiroquai
Give it away - RHCP

Listen to the nuances in the groove, the way certain beats and notes are emphasised/phrased. and also, how the bassist locks in with the drummer. MK and Gary Husband do this VERY well.