Commercially available 'narrow' (possibly tall and/or deep) cabs.

[JPJ]

One of the reasons I opted for the Vanderkley 2x12 I was using last night is that it passes your ‘door frame test’ and is (just) light enough for me to carry on my own easily. Nice single cab solution that I can enjoy as much as my old SWR Goliath 4x10 which definitely did not pass the door frame test.

[BassmanPaul]

I too use the 2x10 format, Acme B2 three way, Stacked verticaly on their ends for a vertical 4x10 they are superb. Truthfully I don't see the point in a larger single cabinet. They are more clumsy to tote around and only save one trip each way.  

 

Are we not men? We are bass players!

 

I hope you find what you are looking for.

[warwickhunt]

4 minutes ago, BassmanPaul said:

I too use the 2x10 format, Acme B2 three way, Stacked verticaly on their ends for a vertical 4x10 they are superb. Truthfully I don't see the point in a larger single cabinet. They are more clumsy to tote around and only save one trip each way.  

 

I think that is the thing I'm trying to achieve, I don't want a single cabinet that is larger than my pair of vertical 210s; I want a vertical narrow cab that just has a bit more welly than a single 2x10.  I suppose it needs to be a narrow 3x10 (i.e. not Epifani or BF as they have staggered drivers which makes a cab wider than I like) or possibly a 2x12 which isn't as heavy as say the TC RS212.  Saving one trip isn't a big deal for many of my gigs but why take 2 cabs to a gig if 1 will do?    

 

Those GR cabs look neat and tidy but defo something that I'd want to try first before parting with cash.  

[pete.young]

How about an Eich 212S?  https://www.eich-amps.com/212s

 

17.4 inches wide. 22Kg.

[warwickhunt]

Not a bad shout!  I actually use a Tech Soundsystems (now Eich) Blackcat amp and I've used their cabs in the past.  Maybe I need to see if I can find one of these modern versions to try out.

[Hellzero]

By the way, there are these 2 GR Bass AeroTech Full Carbon 210V in the ads: 

 

[warwickhunt]

9 hours ago, Hellzero said:

By the way, there are these 2 GR Bass AeroTech Full Carbon 210V in the ads: 

 

 

Sadly couldn't be more further away in the UK from me and I'd really need to try something like the GR cabs before buying.   

[fretmeister]

https://www.eich-amps.com/212s

 

Maybe?

[warwickhunt]

3 minutes ago, fretmeister said:

https://www.eich-amps.com/212s

 

Maybe?

 

@pete.young suggested the same and it is certainly something I'd investigate but I do need to try first unless I could find a used one that was cheap enough to gamble on.  

[LukeFRC]

Has this been discounted? 
 Ashdown CL310DH
 

[LukeFRC]

Here

[Phil Starr]

An interesting problem for you and I'm not sure what you are looking for exists as a commercial product. That in itself is slightly odd as you aren't really looking for anything very extreme or technically impossible.

 

Just to summarise:

 

you find your 2x10 is an ideal speaker in terms of form but they aren't quite 'enough' for the gigs you are playing so not a single cab solution.

You have tried a TC112 but that isn't 'enough' either.

You like a coloured cab with a bit of mid scoop. You aren't keen on the 'Barefaced' sound.

You are finding the majority of 2x12's too bulky and an awkward carry.

 

So technically you can get better efficiency and a louder sound for the same speaker excursion by increasing the cone area of your cabs or by having long throw drivers and increased power handling. Interestingly to me at least is the high tech long throw drivers aren't reall available in a 2x10 format at the moment. The TC's you are using at the moment are really pretty unexceptional designs but neither are many/any of the rest. You've rejected a 2x12 as too bulky so far and most of them are 500mm+ width.  There are some like the Darkglass that are narrower. Of course carrying anything is a mix of physical dimensions/weight and things like the handle position and balance.

 

If you go for more speaker then you are left with a couple of 3x10's or you can draw up your own shorlist of 'portable' 2x12's. I simply don't believe a 2x10 is out there that you would be happy with for volume.

 

I think it might be worth having another look at the 'hi-tech' 12's as there are a feew available. because they use a dedicated bass driver (essentially their own sub) they can be driven much harder and louder. The top end then has to be driven by a horn and they tend to be FRFR but some siple tone shaping by a decent pre amp can soon restore your favourite tone. Because the horns give better dispersion than a large cone you will get to hear more of your own sound. The best of these cabs will go louder than a drummer with the right amp. I don't now why anyone would want to go louder than that as it implies the drummer would be miked up to match you and you therefore have a PA that will also cope with bass. It might be worth asking @stevie if he still has a demo model of his Monaco you can try so you could try it for portability and volume. For me it is my one cab solution and i've sold my second cab as I've never needed one. It's genuinely as loud as any drummer.

 

The only other solution I can suggest is the original Mk1 Barefaced Super Compact with the 15" Eminence driver in it. It is more properly old school sounding than the tweetered cabs which you don't like and a properly lightweight and portable single cab solution.

 

[warwickhunt]

29 minutes ago, Phil Starr said:

An interesting problem for you and I'm not sure what you are looking for exists as a commercial product. That in itself is slightly odd as you aren't really looking for anything very extreme or technically impossible.

 

Just to summarise:

 

you find your 2x10 is an ideal speaker in terms of form but they aren't quite 'enough' for the gigs you are playing so not a single cab solution.

You have tried a TC112 but that isn't 'enough' either.

You like a coloured cab with a bit of mid scoop. You aren't keen on the 'Barefaced' sound.

You are finding the majority of 2x12's too bulky and an awkward carry.

 

So technically you can get better efficiency and a louder sound for the same speaker excursion by increasing the cone area of your cabs or by having long throw drivers and increased power handling. Interestingly to me at least is the high tech long throw drivers aren't reall available in a 2x10 format at the moment. The TC's you are using at the moment are really pretty unexceptional designs but neither are many/any of the rest. You've rejected a 2x12 as too bulky so far and most of them are 500mm+ width.  There are some like the Darkglass that are narrower. Of course carrying anything is a mix of physical dimensions/weight and things like the handle position and balance.

 

If you go for more speaker then you are left with a couple of 3x10's or you can draw up your own shorlist of 'portable' 2x12's. I simply don't believe a 2x10 is out there that you would be happy with for volume.

 

I think it might be worth having another look at the 'hi-tech' 12's as there are a feew available. because they use a dedicated bass driver (essentially their own sub) they can be driven much harder and louder. The top end then has to be driven by a horn and they tend to be FRFR but some siple tone shaping by a decent pre amp can soon restore your favourite tone. Because the horns give better dispersion than a large cone you will get to hear more of your own sound. The best of these cabs will go louder than a drummer with the right amp. I don't now why anyone would want to go louder than that as it implies the drummer would be miked up to match you and you therefore have a PA that will also cope with bass. It might be worth asking @stevie if he still has a demo model of his Monaco you can try so you could try it for portability and volume. For me it is my one cab solution and i've sold my second cab as I've never needed one. It's genuinely as loud as any drummer.

 

The only other solution I can suggest is the original Mk1 Barefaced Super Compact with the 15" Eminence driver in it. It is more properly old school sounding than the tweetered cabs which you don't like and a properly lightweight and portable single cab solution.

 

 

Well summarised but to clarify a couple of things (and expansion on the last point).  In terms of 12" driver derived cabs, I have owned (I might have owned other 12's years ago):

 

TC RS112 (x2) - compact to the extreme but boxy sounding

Aguilar DB112s - tone I like, manoeuvrability awful

Berg 212 - handles everything but not the tone I'm looking for and I used to blame that on Neo drivers but I realise it is essentially down to design... + it was a little too wide

TKS 112 (x2) - very light easily manoeuvred but they had that tone which I attributed to 'neo' or lack of cab colouration

Tech Soundsystem and Schroder 212 - essentially the same design which had excellent dispersal but in certain rooms almost honky/nasal + handles on the side made it awkward

Genz Benz 212 NeoX - a loud upfront cab which seemed to be less sterile but not quite right and even after I fitted spring loaded side handles it was awful to manoeuvre.  

 

Of these cabs I've owned I've established the larger heavier cabs tend to have a baked in tone which I like and I've yet to be able to EQ an amp (of which I've owned some very good ones) to get the same tone from featherweight cabs.  NOW... that does lead itself to the point that if I'm going through the PA then the tone of the cab that I am hearing is not the same as punters BUT I am wanting the tone I hear to be pleasing to 'me' which is probably why I don't get on with IEM... does that make sense?  

 

The drummer is a firm/hard hitter and his kick is invariably mic'd even in small venues. 

 

The TC RS210 cabs have a form I like (weight is about as much as I'd like but I could take a kilo or 2 more), they sound right for me BUT I have that issue of 1 isn't quite enough in some venues when we have downsized PA (to QSC K10s) but 2 cabs seems almost too much.  Don't get me wrong, I'm only talking about me maybe walking a few hundred extra meters, up/down some stairs 'occasionally' but I'd like to establish if there is a single cab solution right for me.  As you say it isn't a big ask and Ashdown's 310 isn't such a bad idea as a solo cab. 

 

The final point re. BF 1x15 - I do also own a TKS 115H (under the Aguilars in the pic) which is a very small, light 15" that can be carried 1 handed (14kg top mount handle) and I actually like the sound of it.  I rarely gig it on its own due to 'my perception' that it can't cut it as a solo cab as opposed to the pair of TC 210 cabs (a single TC210 at certain gigs tends to not project and I have tried to elevate it or position to get the most from the room positioning).  However, that is my perception and I've not tested it in anger so to speak... but I am going to this weekend.  I've asked the lads in the band and someone coming along to the gig to see us (who I trust as a musician) to give me an honest appraisal about it's ability to project the bass without PA support (small venue).  Their views on the tone aren't my primary concern (so long as it doesn't sound awful) as I'll judge that for myself.  It could be that I already own the answer to my problem but I've avoided it as I can't imagine a single 15" being able to do more than the 2x10" and almost as much as the pair of 210s.

 

This was me trying to test a few scenario out recently (I took each rig out to different gigs)... certain cabs are now gone as I eliminated them after trialling in different settings.

 

Apologies for the long winded reply @Phil Starr but I'm putting stuff down as I analyse it in my head on the hoof.  LOL

 

  

 

 

[JPJ]

I’d be surprised if a single 15 can’t cut it for you. In my other band (the other one to the one you saw on Saturday night 😎) I’m gigging a 1x15 Neo equipped Ashdown combo rated at 400w so probably putting around 200w through the combo speaker and its more than enough, and drummer Alan is no shrinking violet when it comes to clattering his drums. I bought and then sold a 1x15 Ashdown Neo cab to pair with this as I found the combo on its own was more than enough for that band. Mind, I do trickle a bit of bass through the PA too. 

[warwickhunt]

7 minutes ago, JPJ said:

I’d be surprised if a single 15 can’t cut it for you. In my other band (the other one to the one you saw on Saturday night 😎) I’m gigging a 1x15 Neo equipped Ashdown combo rated at 400w so probably putting around 200w through the combo speaker and its more than enough, and drummer Alan is no shrinking violet when it comes to clattering his drums. I bought and then sold a 1x15 Ashdown Neo cab to pair with this as I found the combo on its own was more than enough for that band. Mind, I do trickle a bit of bass through the PA too. 

 

I don't know enough of the science but I'd have thought a single 2x10 (tall) such as the TC would be able to carry in a small venue (such as the Bebby you played on Sat) without PA support; we'll see how it pans out though.    

 

re. putting a trickle through the PA - what size PA are you putting a trickle through?  I'm not sure there'd be any benefit trying to put it through the QSC K10 speakers with no sub.  

[JPJ]

3 minutes ago, warwickhunt said:

 

re. putting a trickle through the PA - what size PA are you putting a trickle through?  I'm not sure there'd be any benefit trying to put it through the QSC K10 speakers with no sub.  

Same PA I was using on Saturday 2 x EV ZLX15P tops (nominally 500w 128dB) + 2 x Peavey Messenger Pro 15P bins (nominally 400w unknown spl). 

[Phil Starr]

1 hour ago, warwickhunt said:

Apologies for the long winded reply @Phil Starr but I'm putting stuff down as I analyse it in my head on the hoof.  LOL

You've tried a lot of options then

 

I think whether a 15 will cut it for you depends upon the quality of the midrange, It's hard to believe that sitting on the floor the bass efficiency won't be sufficient. I quite liked the tonal balance of the Eminence Kappalite that Barefaced started off with. As you can try your own cab without spending and you already know you are happy with the tone you don't have a lot to lose by trying it.

 

It sounds like you are in a good place really. You know exactly what you want to achieve and are in no rush as your 2x10's  will go on doing a job for you for the foreseeable future. It looks like tone is the most significant thing for you so take your time and audition the cabs thoroughly. Good luck with the search

[warwickhunt]

6 minutes ago, JPJ said:

Same PA I was using on Saturday 2 x EV ZLX15P tops (nominally 500w 128dB) + 2 x Peavey Messenger Pro 15P bins (nominally 400w unknown spl). 

 

Ah so you certainly have the option of putting bass through to support your 1x15.  Oddly the doubling up on my TC210s is less of an issue on gigs where we take a PA with bigger tops and a bass bin (or 2) because the backline then is solely for me (and the drummer) to hear; PA does the heavy lifting and other band members have IE options.  This scenario is really only relevant when my backline is carrying to FOH punters without PA support.

[Bolo]

Considered a cabsim with one of the louder cabs?

[Hellzero]

There are also the Alusonic 212 cabinets, narrow for sure and quite lightweight.

 

https://www.alusonic.com/aluminium-cabinetsxl.php

 

Ask @Happy Jack for an idea of the tone as he owned one or maybe two.

[Bolo]

12 hours ago, Hellzero said:

There are also the Alusonic 212 cabinets, narrow for sure and quite lightweight.

 

https://www.alusonic.com/aluminium-cabinetsxl.php

 

Ask @Happy Jack for an idea of the tone as he owned one or maybe two.

And maybe of the price? 

When you have to inquire via encrypted microdot by the duckpond in an unpopular park I get Rolls Royce vibes "if you have to ask you can't afford it"

[DaleASmith]

Ashdown ABM Compact series. Both 500w versions. 

[warwickhunt]

"Would anyone know of a commercially available standalone cab that is less wide than your bog standard 19"?" 

 

The ABM210 compact is either 21" or 24" depending on how you stack or carry it and isn't likely to be any better as a stand alone cab than my present TC RS210!  

[DaleASmith]

4 hours ago, warwickhunt said:

"Would anyone know of a commercially available standalone cab that is less wide than your bog standard 19"?" 

 

The ABM210 compact is either 21" or 24" depending on how you stack or carry it and isn't likely to be any better as a stand alone cab than my present TC RS210!  

Head in the picture is 18.5” and I’m sure the cabs are the same, looking at the photo. 
The cab dimensions you’re looking at include the rubber feet which I’ve relocated to the bottom.  

[Owen]

I used to gig a Berg IP310. I cannot possibly imagine needing more. I often wondered about commissioning a build which put the speakers in a verical 3×10 + horn box with tiltback wheels - but the same internal volume. If I still owned it, I would have done it by now. 

 

An Epiphany 3x10 rehoused in a box to suit you needs but with the same internal vol? They are lush cabs.