bubinga5 Posted May 17, 2009 Share Posted May 17, 2009 (edited) Im not technically minded, so hear goes..I played on thursday night at a local night..I was using an Aguilar GS 212 with a aguilar 500sc...After sound check i let the another bands bassist use my amp..As he started playing i noticed the amp was constantly clipping..He was playing a stingray HH and slapping the hell out of it... My Q is why was the amp clipping? Was the (so called) Gain to high? As i said i dont know alot about amps but im trying read up on it... Am i right that ideally you should be using a cab or cabs that are roughly double the wattage of the amp?? I have been thinking about getting a single 12" cab of about 300 watts power handling to add to the 600watts of the GS 212, to give me more head room..( i know this is not the reason for the clipping) Also what is the best cab to add to a 2x12? Edited May 17, 2009 by bubinga5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Fitzmaurice Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 [quote name='bubinga5' post='490940' date='May 17 2009, 05:22 PM']My Q is why was the amp clipping? Was the (so called) Gain to high?[/quote]Yes, especially if his bass was active. [quote]Am i right that ideally you should be using a cab or cabs that are roughly double the wattage of the amp??[/quote] Not really. You use whatever is required to get the volume you need. In most cases an amp can drive to full output a cab that's twice its rating, but that's a very broad generalization. [quote]Also what is the best cab to add to a 2x12?[/quote] Another identical 2x12. If you must go 1x12 make it one from the same manufacturer, loaded with the same driver, with double the impedance of the 2x12. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warwickhunt Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 MM basses are notorious for high/hot output, I'd imagine you'd need to reduce the input gain on the amp to match it to your bass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 [i]Rule number one: don't lend your gear.[/i] I'm in a house band for a local jam and you can be sure of one thing; most the guys that come up and use your gear won't give a damn if they break it or not! There are some considerate players out there but most have their ears painted on and don't care what they do to your speakers! There are some basses out there with high output and, if the gain is turned up, they will clip like mad. I've turned the gain down and told the jammers to use the master if they have any volume problems, but I've now had to gaffer over the gain control to stop them turning it up!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monz Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 [quote name='warwickhunt' post='491076' date='May 18 2009, 07:41 AM']MM basses are notorious for high/hot output, I'd imagine you'd need to reduce the input gain on the amp to match it to your bass.[/quote] +1 HH stingrays signal is as hot as hell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxrossell Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 [quote name='chris_b' post='491112' date='May 18 2009, 09:09 AM'][i]Rule number one: don't lend your gear.[/i] I'm in a house band for a local jam and you can be sure of one thing; most the guys that come up and use your gear won't give a damn if they break it or not! There are some considerate players out there but most have their ears painted on and don't care what they do to your speakers! There are some basses out there with high output and, if the gain is turned up, they will clip like mad. I've turned the gain down and told the jammers to use the master if they have any volume problems, but I've now had to gaffer over the gain control to stop them turning it up!!![/quote] + on this. - When people who know what they're doing with their gear show up to play a gig, they'll have their own gear with them. If that is not the case, they'll have got in touch - in advance - with whoever is lending them gear, to check it out and get some info on what it is they'll be using. Not so they don't break it or anything (although they're usually careful not to), it's just that in order to get a good sound you have to use gear properly. - People who turn up to gigs without a clue what they'll be playing through and expect to just plug into whatever, twiddle for a minute and then go are generally idiots who don't know the first thing about equipment and really don't give two wet sh*ts whether they trash your gear as long as it gets them through their set. They're lazy, basically, too lazy to bring their own gear (usually too lazy to have acquired decent gear of their own in the first place), and too lazy to figure out how to get a good sound out of stuff. And the logical conclusion is that they don't give a damn about the crowd, either, since they obviously think it's okay to turn up and play a sh*t-sounding gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted May 18, 2009 Author Share Posted May 18, 2009 [quote name='gbm' post='491316' date='May 18 2009, 01:08 PM']Surely as we use amplification to make our instruments louder we should have a glimmer of understanding of how it all works. You have an excellent wiki here on basschat that explains it all very clearly so I dont understand what excuse people have for being "not technically minded".[/quote] Its not an excuse..!, i have concentrated more on my playing than how much impedance my cab has...I have posted this to learn more about this subject...This is why Bill's post was very helpfull and your's was not worth posting!! The facts of Impedence between Amps and Cab's are not that easy to understand, maybe you could enlighten us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted May 18, 2009 Author Share Posted May 18, 2009 Great Analogy that CK posted in the sticky.... A useful analogy for the understanding of impedance is that of a water pipe and pump. The pipe diameter represents the impedance of your loudspeaker; the water flowing through it is power and the water pump is the amplifier (or receiver) itself. The pump pumps water through the pipe. A large diameter pipe allows a large amount of water to flow. This is a low impedance situation: the large pipe does not impede the large flow of water. A small diameter pipe allows less water to flow. This is a high impedance situation: the small pipe impedes the flow of water, keeping it small. Low impedance, large flow of power; high impedance, smaller flow of power. I'm trying to keep it simple, folks. Stick with me. Ultimately, this will help you better choose your electronics for optimum performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted May 18, 2009 Share Posted May 18, 2009 [quote name='gbm' post='491316' date='May 18 2009, 01:08 PM']....Surely as we use amplification to make our instruments louder we should have a glimmer of understanding of how it all works....[/quote] You'd think so wouldn't you? I don't know how a lot of things I use work, a telephone, car, lift and a lot of other stuff but I don't break them! Some of the guys I deal with are the equivalent of someone trying to drive a car at 60 mph and not changing out of second gear! Generally it's the oldies who ask what they can change and say thanks afterwards, but very few of the younger guys do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kongo Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 [quote name='gbm' post='492323' date='May 19 2009, 01:30 PM']I don't know why you were taking such a good rig to a jam night, even if you did know how to use it.[/quote] Maybe cause he wanted to sound good? LOL surely you'd always want to use your best rig...or make it your own? But that's IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubinga5 Posted May 19, 2009 Author Share Posted May 19, 2009 [quote name='gbm' post='492323' date='May 19 2009, 01:30 PM']I dont need to - others have done a far better job in the wiki. All you have to do is read it. And I see you have been reading. The thing is, unless you are taking the combined wisdom of basschat to all your gigs, you are always going to be after the event. If you knew about clipping you could have told the guy thrashing your amp to turn down. I don't know why you were taking such a good rig to a jam night, even if you did know how to use it.[/quote] I didnt say it was a jam night?....But yeah your right GBM, i could have...I guess i should know these things...Well i do now, so the Learning starts here..And its actually got me more interested in how my instrument is amplified.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kongo Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 (edited) [quote name='bubinga5' post='492797' date='May 19 2009, 10:47 PM']I didnt say it was a jam night?....But yeah your right GBM, i could have...I guess i should know these things...Well i do now, so the Learning starts here..And its actually got me more interested in how my instrument is amplified..[/quote] Well then, some books and the internet to get your head stuck in. It;s a great world of knowledge...I find myself facinated by it almost as much as playing. If you know how your instrument / amp works it's like knowing how you work. Should something happen at rehearsal or worse, a gig, you'll know exactly what to do...in theory. Edited May 19, 2009 by Kongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcc Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 [quote name='Kongo' post='492831' date='May 19 2009, 11:47 PM']If you know how your instrument / amp works it's like knowing how you work. Should something happen at rehearsal or worse, a gig, you'll know exactly what to do...in theory.[/quote] yeah.... if your amp burns out at soundcheck, go and get another one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kongo Posted May 19, 2009 Share Posted May 19, 2009 [quote name='mcc' post='492840' date='May 20 2009, 12:02 AM']yeah.... if your amp burns out at soundcheck, go and get another one [/quote] LOL! And if it sets on fire...get an exstinguisher! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flatwound Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 [quote name='gbm' post='491316' date='May 18 2009, 10:08 PM']Surely as we use amplification to make our instruments louder we should have a glimmer of understanding of how it all works. You have an excellent wiki here on basschat that explains it all very clearly so I dont understand what excuse people have for being "not technically minded".[/quote] The guy said he was trying to learn. Try answering his question, ya cant can ya ? (sorry,...couldn't help myself) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mildmanofrock Posted May 20, 2009 Share Posted May 20, 2009 [quote name='gbm' post='491316' date='May 18 2009, 01:08 PM']Surely as we use amplification to make our instruments louder we should have a glimmer of understanding of how it all works. You have an excellent wiki here on basschat that explains it all very clearly so I dont understand what excuse people have for being "not technically minded".[/quote] Bloody hell, lighten up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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