Logic Pro

[PaulThePlug]

Son has a PC with Ableton...

He is going to be doing A Level Music Technology, which looks to favour or be be arranged around Logic Pro but it's Mac only 😞

 

So, any thoughts or advice, what kind of Mac at what sort of budget can i expect? The software looks like £200 but with a 90 Day trial version (that looks like it can be date-reset with code!)

 

Any help, pointers, experience, recommendations and what to avoid?

 

Ta Muchly

Edited July 9 by PaulThePlug

[Dood]

Hi PTP! I’ve done a quick search with what I know about Logic:

 

Minimum System Requirements for the latest version of Logic Pro:

macOS Ventura 13.5 or later

6GB of available storage space for minimum installation or 72GB of storage space for full Sound Library installation

 

The following Macs can run macOS Ventura:

MacBook models from 2017 or later.

MacBook Air models from 2018 or later.

MacBook Pro models from 2017 or later.

Mac mini models from 2018 or later.

iMac models from 2017 or later.

iMac Pro (all models)

Mac Pro models from 2019 or later.

Mac Studio (all models)

 

This would seem to be true as my iMac is a 2017 running Ventura. It’s an old machine but it has no problem running 40 odd tracks with plugins, glitch free. 4.2Ghz I7 Quad Core with 64Gb RAM and quad channel internal 2Tb SSD.

I also have a 2013 MacBook Pro I7 that is running Logic with no issues, but I’m not sure if it’s the latest update, probably not! 

[rwillett]

If your budget can stretch to the newer Macs, I'd suggest one of the new Apple Silicon ones rather than Intel ones. 

 

Apple is pretty good at keeping their old stuff going but eventually they will end of life the older Macs. Hence the newer CPUs might be better. Apple kit also tends to last physically. I still have and still use a 2013 Macbook Pro as it works OK. Bit slow now and on its 3rd battery. 

 

Anyway, I tend to buy apple refurbished. Bit cheaper, dame guarantee and you'll not actually know its refurbished from Apple. 

 

https://www.apple.com/uk/shop/refurbished/mac

 

Any of these will run Logic Pro. 

 

Rob

[skidder652003]

calling @BigRedX

[skidder652003]

My lad graduates from UWE next week with a 2:1 from exactly the same course.

He wanted a macbook pro so we got him a used one for about £300 as I recall.

Pretty sure its only 8GB RAM but it handled most stuff they threw at him.

Its still going (unlike most of his iphones) and got him through his degree running Logic and pro tools including some light video editing for his final diss.

Edited July 9 by skidder652003

[PaulThePlug]

Thanks all... some great info

Gonna check some models in the likes of cash converters and the like with the specs above, and there is a Student Bundle at £200! Yikes!

Wonder if some of the courses are fuelled by apple juice?

[itsmedunc]

I don’t know what version of Logic X Pro has to be used but -

 

If money is a real issue, a 2011 iMac running High Sierra 10.13.6  will run Logic X Pro easily. I picked a 2011 27” 32gb ram, 500gb SSD and a second 1tb hdd for £300 years ago. You could probably get one with a similar spec for much less now if you look around. It still works perfectly well. A 2012 MacBook Pro with Catalina also runs Logic Pro X perfectly well. They’ll take 16gb ram and a 1tb SSD. I own both for Logic X and Waves Plug-in Suite and have never felt the need to spend any more money.

Older systems get the max RAM and SSD size you can afford. Plug-ins like RAM and projects and programs (especially Waves) take up a lot of HDD space.

[songofthewind]

Until recently I had a 2013 iMac i5 that ran Logic just fine. Probably about £200 or so on eBay.

[itsmedunc]

Getting an older version of Logic X Pro from the App Store and onto an older machine isn’t always as straightforward but the solution is easily found via a Google search and YouTube videos.

[PaulThePlug]

Spied an iMac 17 1/i5 6500/32GB Ram/1TB HDD/R9 M380 2GB/27" 5k/B

in CEX for £290...

Something like that is do-able, and i think reasonable £ if it gets him thru the 2 yr course?, gotta 'check the specs'

 

Thanks All for the Real-World advice rather than trying to wade thru the googlenet of magazine review and youtube!

Edited July 9 by PaulThePlug

[WinterMute]

As noted, the M series mac processors are streets ahead of any of the previous Mac offerings.

 

I'd be looking at a Mac Mini with M1 chip there's tons on eBay, I assume you already have a monitor etc.

 

Logic will run in 8Gb of the new integrated RAM, but you'll always be better off with 16 or 32Gb for bigger audio projects.

 

If he wants a laptop, the M1 MacBook is a good choice.

 

You can pick up an older Mac Pro, but the 2011 models are now legacy and won;t run the latest operating system so won;t run the latest Logic. They do run Logic very well indeed however.

[rwillett]

Just to echo what @WinterMute has said, get as much RAM as you can afford. None of the M series Macs allow you to upgrade RAM as that type memory is part of the main CPU. So the days of slipping in an extra 16GB as you can afford it are long gone.

 

Personally speaking I'd get memory over CPU every time now.

 

Whilst you can run an older version of Logic Pro on the older laptops, I run an older version on my 2013 MacBook Pro, I have a feeling that its quite difficult now to do this as you have to buy the new version on a newer Mac which then allows you use the older version on the older Mac. So you *may* need a newer Mac for a while. I would certainly investigate this further before putting any money down on an older piece of kit just to be safe. The older Macs do work very, very well. though. My 2013 Macbook Pro was used every single day for 8-10 hours for 6-7 years. The keyboard is fine, there are 2-3 dead pixels now on the display, but you don't notice it in use. I only keep and use it really to annoy some of the other people in the teams who have the latest and greatest MacBook Pro which is quite an expensive beast now.

 

If you do want to buy a second hand mac, I would suggest the following:

 

1. Check the battery %. If it is less than 90% after being charged up all day/night, assume you need a new one. Check the number of power cycles. These can be expensive from Apple. They are more expensive from Amazon as the vast majority of the batteries for old Macbooks are made from second hand batteries and are junk. Learnt that lesson the hard way so you end up buying more of them. They aren't that difficult to change, but it needs some care and attention.

 

2. Carefully check every single key on the keyboard. The Mac keyboards are excellent on pre 2015 models and after 2021. The middle years are very iffy as they changed the mechanism.

 

3. Load up a graphics program and make a few solid colour backgrounds or windows. e.g. Red, Green and Blue. Then move that window around the screen to check for dead pixels. Most of the time, you won't see the dead pixel as the screen has different colours but this can find dead pixels quite easily. 2-3 aren;t an issue, 20-30 might be.

 

4. Check the USB and HDMI connections are OK by plugging stuff in.Sometimes crap gets into the sockets and stops them working.

 

5. Check the PSU whilst its working. Is it too hot, people scrimp and save and use an under powered PSU. A 3rd party PSU is not a problem, but make sure its the right rating. Unplug the PSU and watch the battery percentage for a few minutes to see if it goes down a lot. My old Macbook won't last more than 45 minutes without being plugged in as the battery is rubbish now and I can't find a decent replacement.

 

6. See if the lid on the Macbook opens smoothly. Never seen one go wrong, but I have heard of it.

 

If in doubt ask on here. There are loads out there for sale, if you pass on one, don't worry, another one will be along soon.

 

Rob

 

 

[songofthewind]

I mentioned earlier in the thread I had a 2013 iMac. I upgraded the HDD to an SSD and the difference in performance was startling, to say the least. Well worth considering this upgrade if it's possible to carry it out.

[BigRedX]

Late to the thread, but as other have said if money is tight reconditioned or EoL is the way to go. 

 

IMO unless you get a very good deal (under £400 for a Mac with a 1TB SSD and at least 16GB RAM) I wouldn't buy one that doesn't have an M series processor. 

 

I'd also make sure that you buy a Mac that is capable of running the latest version of Logic, because it will probably be needed in order to main compatibility with the systems at the college. Backwards compatibility is a variable. For instance I run Logic 10.4.8 on my MacPro which I use for most of my composition and 10.6.2 on my MacBook Pro which runs Logic for the live backing for my bands. Projects that have been saved on the laptop can be opened on the MacPro, but it complains and keeps telling me to update Logic. Were I to go up to the next version of Logic on the MacBook they would no longer open on the MacPro at all.

 

And pay for Logic. £200 is a complete bargain simply for the number of excellent plug-ins that come with it. 

[dave_bass5]

A bit later still, but that 90 day Logic Pro trial can be extended indefinitely with a small one line script. It also re sets if you download a new version (even Apple mention the so its not a hack as such).

 

For what it's worth I use a 14" MacBook Pro with the M1 Pro chip and 16GB ram. Never had any issues with latency or slowdowns etc. Its an old one by today's standards, but it will last me for years. 

[MoJoKe]

6 hours ago, dave_bass5 said:

A bit later still, but that 90 day Logic Pro trial can be extended indefinitely with a small one line script. It also re sets if you download a new version (even Apple mention the so its not a hack as such).

 

Yeah, it is a hack, and this is still IP theft, so, absolutely no.  As BigRedX says, with all that comes with it, Logic really is good value...  Pay for it like the rest of us.  The Student bundle, which also includes Final Cut and Mainstage is just £199.99

 

On a more, perfectly legal note, I was running my 2012 iMac (32GB ram and upgraded to 2Tb SSD) in my home studio on Catalina, because it wouldn't let me update further as it wasn't "compatible" with newer OS.  This meant that many of my plugins and functionality stopped working as everything else updated...

 

...until I discovered "Opencore Legacy Patcher" (https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/).  It's  was pretty straightforward to patch (backup everything first - and the instructions are decent) and my 2012 iMac is now happily running Ventura (it could run Sonoma happily too, but I've no need for the latest OS), and all my functionality is completely up to date.  The only Logic functionality which isn't working are the new AI tools (Session Players, Stem Splitter and ChromaGlow), which need an M processor, but hey, don't be lazy, write your own backing parts...! 🤪

 

Buy Logic and patch an older Mac and you'll be fine for a good while...

 

Edited August 1 by MoJoKe

[dave_bass5]

1 hour ago, MoJoKe said:

 

Yeah, it is a hack, and this is still IP theft, so, absolutely no.  As BigRedX says, with all that comes with it, Logic really is good value...  Pay for it like the rest of us.  The Student bundle, which also includes Final Cut and Mainstage is just £199.99

 

On a more, perfectly legal note, I was running my 2012 iMac (32GB ram and upgraded to 2Tb SSD) in my home studio on Catalina, because it wouldn't let me update further as it wasn't "compatible" with newer OS.  This meant that many of my plugins and functionality stopped working as everything else updated...

 

...until I discovered "Opencore Legacy Patcher" (https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/).  It's  was pretty straightforward to patch (backup everything first - and the instructions are decent) and my 2012 iMac is now happily running Ventura (it could run Sonoma happily too, but I've no need for the latest OS), and all my functionality is completely up to date.  The only Logic functionality which isn't working are the new AI tools (Session Players, Stem Splitter and ChromaGlow), which need an M processor, but hey, don't be lazy, write your own backing parts...! 🤪

 

Buy Logic and patch an older Mac and you'll be fine for a good while...

 

🥱

If Apple say that downloading the trial again resets the 90 day limit, how on earth is that theft? If they allow it what on earth are you talking about 😏

 

 

Who cares what the student bible costs, im 61 😂. 

 

 

 

[Stub Mandrel]

3 hours ago, MoJoKe said:

 

Yeah, it is a hack, and this is still IP theft, so, absolutely no.  As BigRedX says, with all that comes with it, Logic really is good value...  Pay for it like the rest of us.  The Student bundle, which also includes Final Cut and Mainstage is just £199.99

 

On a more, perfectly legal note, I was running my 2012 iMac (32GB ram and upgraded to 2Tb SSD) in my home studio on Catalina, because it wouldn't let me update further as it wasn't "compatible" with newer OS.  This meant that many of my plugins and functionality stopped working as everything else updated...

 

...until I discovered "Opencore Legacy Patcher" (https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/).  It's  was pretty straightforward to patch (backup everything first - and the instructions are decent) and my 2012 iMac is now happily running Ventura (it could run Sonoma happily too, but I've no need for the latest OS), and all my functionality is completely up to date.  The only Logic functionality which isn't working are the new AI tools (Session Players, Stem Splitter and ChromaGlow), which need an M processor, but hey, don't be lazy, write your own backing parts...! 🤪

 

Buy Logic and patch an older Mac and you'll be fine for a good while...

 

 

Surely hacking your Mac so it runs a new version of the O/S instead of buying a new one is EXACTLY what Apple don't want you to do, their whole business model is predicated on planned obsolescence.

[BigRedX]

12 hours ago, MoJoKe said:

On a more, perfectly legal note, I was running my 2012 iMac (32GB ram and upgraded to 2Tb SSD) in my home studio on Catalina, because it wouldn't let me update further as it wasn't "compatible" with newer OS.  This meant that many of my plugins and functionality stopped working as everything else updated...

 

Why did you up date anything?

 

If everything is working as it should there is no need to update, and in fact you are better off leaving a functioning system alone, especially when it comes to your DAW and the computer it runs on.

 

I can only run High Sierra on this Mac. However the version of Logic X I run has more than enough functionality for my needs (TBH Logic 4 plus a handful of eMagic and 3rd party plug-ins did everything I could ever want).

 

I hope you didn't make the mistake of buying something with the promise of features you wanted now being added at a later date. I have done that once and got badly let down in the process and won't be doing it again. Everything is now purchased based on the fact that it will do what I want out of the box. If there are upgrades down the line that add additional useful functionality then that is bonus, but I will never again rely on it.

[rwillett]

9 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Surely hacking your Mac so it runs a new version of the O/S instead of buying a new one is EXACTLY what Apple don't want you to do, their whole business model is predicated on planned obsolescence.

Or in other words, "Capitalism"

[sammybee]

On 01/08/2024 at 14:51, dave_bass5 said:

A bit later still, but that 90 day Logic Pro trial can be extended indefinitely with a small one line script. It also re sets if you download a new version (even Apple mention the so its not a hack as such).

 

For what it's worth I use a 14" MacBook Pro with the M1 Pro chip and 16GB ram. Never had any issues with latency or slowdowns etc. Its an old one by today's standards, but it will last me for years. 

 

Warez and not paying for software is a bit uncool these days... it's not the done thing

[PaulThePlug]

BIG shout-out to @rwillett... messaged me and kindly sent me his old '13 Macbook. Flattened and Fresh.

Found a fella on Facebook with links to old versions of Logic 10.? for old versions of MacOS likes of Catalina.

Fingers crossed this should get arpund the New/Old faff!

[rwillett]

Glad its turned up. The password for the administrator is "password". Forgot to tell you that Suggest you change it now

 

Rob

[BigRedX]

You don't need to set up a dummy account if you are passing a used Mac on.

 

All you need to do is Quit and shut down when you get to the point where the re-installed Mac OSX is asking to create a user account. Then when the Mac is next started up it goes straight to starting a new account just like it would if it was a brand new Mac straight out of the box.

[rwillett]

However if your base OS X is something like Snow Leopard as that's what Apple thinks it sold you with, that's what you get when you do a factory network install. Thats a wee bit old these days.

There are also issues getting up to the latest version of OS X from Snow Leopard that used to require you to have an Mac App store account and to logon to get the upgrades. That's not for an application upgrade or application install but to install the upgrades to OS X. I didn't want to to have to put my App store account in, and it was a little tricky to get around that as I'd forgotten. However there are genuine Apple websites that have old OS X images on that don't require you to use the App Store, they're not well known to most non-developers but are legitimate. I got those images installed and by the time you get to the latest version, Apple has removed the requirement to have an App Store account, so it comes and goes depending on the version of OS X. I also have basically free and fast bandwidth at home so it made more sense for me to do it.

 

Also the administrator account isn't a dummy account. You need to have a local account to do all of the upgrades.

 

I wasn't sure how experienced @PaulThePlug was in upgrading Mac OS X and I wanted to make it as easy as possible for him and his son. I did not want to leave him stuck on a very old version of OS X.

 

Thanks

Rob