Badass II - you cannot change the laws of physics - or can you?

[BigRedX]

4 hours ago, tauzero said:

And in that video there's very little difference.

 

While they were differences, I'd have been hard pressed to say which, if any, sounded better, particularly once the bass is in the mix with the rest of the instruments and EQ'd to find it's correct place.

 

Based on personal experience I'd rather have a well-engineered hi-mass bridge simply because it's less likely to shed screws and other parts through the act of playing.

[Stub Mandrel]

5 hours ago, tauzero said:

 

And in that video there's very little difference.

 

There are differences that even I can hear - but the BBOT was consistently brighter to my ear, with more harmonic content. The others sounded like the tone had been rolled back by varying amounts.

[bloke_zero]

I could hear quite a bit of difference. I don't think it would make a huge difference through an amp in a practice room, but you'd hear it if well recorded.

 

The BBOT sounded pretty good overall! Liked the fender hi mass and the baddass - felt like the tonal window was shifted down - got a bit more low mid as well as loosing a little top. The babicz kind of sounded a bit honky - didn't like it as much. Great to hear stuff like that - thanks @Baloney Balderdash

[Baloney Balderdash]

22 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

 

There are differences that even I can hear - but the BBOT was consistently brighter to my ear, with more harmonic content. The others sounded like the tone had been rolled back by varying amounts.

Exactly my observation.

 

The tone sounded richer with the regular bent piece of metal bridge, with more harmonic content preserved, and somewhat muffled with the highmass bridges, with harmonic content subdued (which of course does mean more low end, relatively speaking, and focus on the fundamentals, which again I suppose for some people could translate to a perceived fatter sound). 

 

The Babsicz though, which is aluminum, and not really a high mass bridge at all, just sounded overall awful and tinny to me, as in it even seemed to cut off some low end (or maybe that was just perceived, and what it might really do is to preserve even more harmonic content, not sure, what I do know is that I didn't like how it affected the tone).

 

Edited October 2 by Baloney Balderdash

[tauzero]

You'd hear bugger-all difference down the Dog and Duck on a Saturday night, so just go for the one that looks and feels nicest.

[rwillett]

Cynical & sad but unfortunately true…

[Baloney Balderdash]

1 hour ago, rwillett said:

Cynical & sad but unfortunately true…

6 hours ago, chris_b said:

 

It's all about confidence and feeling happy.

 

If you like the sound of something you'll feel good, which will make you play better. No one else has to hear the "thing" that lifted you, but it happened, so it is a real difference.

 

You are right, psychology comes into it, but also there are real differences created by the way basses are made and the materials used. Tea tastes like tea to me but there are guys out there who know the differences between each type and make a living being able to blend different teas into a single product. Same with coffee, whiskey and wine etc. Likewise, there are differences in musical instruments that people who build them can hear, that accountants, IT managers, post men and gas fitters etc who play them on a part time bases can't. The silly thing is to insist that because some one can't hear those differences, they don't exist.

Also not all of us plays down the Dog and Duck Saturday night.

 

2 hours ago, tauzero said:

You'd hear bugger-all difference down the Dog and Duck on a Saturday night, so just go for the one that looks and feels nicest.

My condolences.   

 

Edited October 1 by Baloney Balderdash

[bloke_zero]

12 hours ago, tauzero said:

You'd hear bugger-all difference down the Dog and Duck on a Saturday night, so just go for the one that looks and feels nicest.

Yeah, but what if you're painstakingly recording something? Some bass tones are irretrievable even with EQ and all the FX in the world. I have a gold sparkle tele bass with a fretless neck (I know right?) - looks like ass, sounds sublime.

[Beedster]

16 hours ago, chris_b said:

 

It's all about confidence and feeling happy.

 

If you like the sound of something you'll feel good, which will make you play better. No one else has to hear the "thing" that lifted you, but it happened, so it is a real difference.

 

You are right, psychology comes into it, but also there are real differences created by the way basses are made and the materials used. Tea tastes like tea to me but there are guys out there who know the differences between each type and make a living being able to blend different teas into a single product. Same with coffee, whiskey and wine etc. Likewise, there are differences in musical instruments that people who build them can hear, that accountants, IT managers, post men and gas fitters etc who play them on a part time bases can't. The silly thing is to insist that because some one can't hear those differences, they don't exist.

 

This ^

 

But I also go back to my earlier point that while one bass may have a set of characteristics that mean a Badass will make a difference, another may not, while a third may sit somewhere between the two. There's no generic and reliable effect of a Badass, and they certainly can have a negative effect, for example the tone you're after is present with a BBOT but is perhaps more toppy, immediate, or simply more clear than you'd like with the Badass. It's the same arguments as tonewoods, PUPs, passive circuits etc.....

• They can make a difference but certainly not always,
• Any difference they do make isn't always significant,
• And even if it is significant, it isn't always desirable,
• And even if there's a difference, it's significant, and it's desirable, there's a bloody high chance that neither your bandmates, the audience, or sometimes even you, would notice that difference when it matters!

Me? I love a Badass  

[tauzero]

2 hours ago, bloke_zero said:

Yeah, but what if you're painstakingly recording something? Some bass tones are irretrievable even with EQ and all the FX in the world. I have a gold sparkle tele bass with a fretless neck (I know right?) - looks like ass, sounds sublime.

 

Don't change the bridge then.

[Lozz196]

20 hours ago, chris_b said:

 

It's all about confidence and feeling happy.

 

If you like the sound of something you'll feel good, which will make you play better. No one else has to hear the "thing" that lifted you, but it happened, so it is a real difference.

 

You are right, psychology comes into it, but also there are real differences created by the way basses are made and the materials used. Tea tastes like tea to me but there are guys out there who know the differences between each type and make a living being able to blend different teas into a single product. Same with coffee, whiskey and wine etc. Likewise, there are differences in musical instruments that people who build them can hear, that accountants, IT managers, post men and gas fitters etc who play them on a part time bases can't. The silly thing is to insist that because some one can't hear those differences, they don't exist.

Def agree on this Chris, maybe a different bridge affects the action/string tension to where a player prefers, so it coaxes better tones that way. Who knows but as you say if something makes you play better, irrespective if someone else likes it, then that`s all good.

[bloke_zero]

8 minutes ago, tauzero said:

Don't change the bridge then.

It's a BBOT - I have no intention of changing it - I'm just participating in a discussion 🙂

 

I've tried all except the Fender Hi mass bridges on different basses, plus a couple of others. I was very excited about the Babicz and pretty disappointed when I finally heard it in situ.

[prowla]

I've got several Badass bridges and they sound pretty good.

I did have one on a Ric for a while, but it killed the sound.

[Beedster]

25 minutes ago, prowla said:

I've got several Badass bridges and they sound pretty good.

I did have one on a Ric for a while, but it killed the sound.

I had exactly the same on a quite nice but could have been nicer 70’s Precision, tone with BBOT suggested Badass might be a step up, but quite the opposite, to my ear anyway, seemed to compress the tone somewhat…

[Baloney Balderdash]

Single Mono Rail bridge pieces milled from solid brass is the way to go, if one absolutely want to upgrade their bent piece of metal bridge.

 

They are just kind of expensive (though not any more than a "brand" highmass bridge), and rather complicated to install properly too.

 

Edited October 2 by Baloney Balderdash

[Stub Mandrel]

2 hours ago, Baloney Balderdash said:

Single Mono Rail bridge pieces milled from solid brass is the way to go, if one absolutely want to upgrade their bent piece of metal bridge.

 

They are just kind of expensive (though not any more than a "brand" highmass bridge), and rather complicated to install properly too.

 

 

This is the way to go...

 

 

 

[rmorris]

7 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

 

This is the way to go...

 

 

 

 

New Schaller model 🤔

[Doctor J]

That's the way to go to hospital for some tetanus shots.

[prowla]

7 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

 

This is the way to go...

 

 

 

I think this one of mine originally had one like that on it...

 

[NancyJohnson]

In general, I replace hardware if, a) the original part has failed, b) if the original part falls short in adjustability, or in rare occasions c) fails to fulfil a visual aesthetic (ie swapping like for like hardware, chrome to black).

 

Sure, I've swapped out BBoT bridges in the past (to both BA2 and Hipshot KickAss units), but purely down to necessity; one project bass had missing bridge parts and another bridge used to cut my wrist.  I prefer the feel of a bigger bridge under my wrist so naturally either of these units fulfill that remit, but I'd also say that adjustability of the Bad/KickAss units is probably on par with the BBoT units they've replaced.

 

On the subject of the marketing claims, I'd take these with a generous pinch of salt.  Do these bridges make any differences to sustain or wood transfer (whaaaat?), it's all nonsense.  Ask yourself, how long do we hit a note and let it sustain for?  A second?  Five seconds?  Ten?  Sustain as an argument is ridiculous.  Of wood transfer, what?  Also rubbish.  Reckon if you did a blind test on two identical (as feasibly possible) basses one with a BA2 and another with a BBoT, I doubt anyone would be able to differentiate the tonal nuances between the instruments.

 

 

[Maude]

I have invented a plate to be used to in the conjunction with high mass bridges called a 'tone mirror'. It screws onto the rear of your bass directly in line with the bridge and reflects vibrations back to the bridge, returning 100% of energy back into the string, creating an infinite energy loop so effective that I have to use an Ebow to tame it...

 

 

 

...honest. 

[3below]

28 minutes ago, Maude said:

I have invented a plate to be used to in the conjunction with high mass bridges called a 'tone mirror'. It screws onto the rear of your bass directly in line with the bridge and reflects vibrations back to the bridge, returning 100% of energy back into the string, creating an infinite energy loop so effective that I have to use an Ebow to tame it...

 

 

 

...honest. 

You want tone and sustain, our Supreme High Impact Technology refector will give you that brown note. The high focus multi-modal beam reflector plate (TM, PAF) removes the need and expense of a high mass bridge when you want a tone mirror plate.  Through the use of AI designed sound wave guides the  HFBRP  concentrates and beam aligns the sound waves into an optimised diffraction pattern that maximises the energy incidence at the bbot  antinodes, maximising the in phase resonances.  The high tech reflectance results in much greater transmission efficiency compared to regular tone mirror plates, it is the Total Bass Sustain system.  Optimal operation may require  an 18V supply on your Ebow or using the recyclable graduated multi-layer paper damping system.  

Edited October 8 by 3below

[Maude]

15 minutes ago, 3below said:

You want tone and sustain, our Supreme High Impact Technology bridge will give you that brown note. The high focus beam reflector plate (TM, PAF) removes the need and expense of a high mass bridge when you want a tone mirror plate.  Through the use of AI designed sound wave guides the  HFBRP  concentrates and beam aligns the sound waves into an optimised diffraction pattern that maximises the energy incidence at the bbot  antinodes, maximising the in phase resonances.  The high tech reflectance results in much greater transmission efficiency compared to regular tone mirror plates. Optimal operation may require  an 18V supply on your Ebow or using the recyclable graduated multi-layer paper damping system.

 

Where do I pay? WHERE DO I PAY!? 

[prowla]

1 hour ago, 3below said:

You want tone and sustain, our Supreme High Impact Technology refector will give you that brown note. The high focus multi-modal beam reflector plate (TM, PAF) removes the need and expense of a high mass bridge when you want a tone mirror plate.  Through the use of AI designed sound wave guides the  HFBRP  concentrates and beam aligns the sound waves into an optimised diffraction pattern that maximises the energy incidence at the bbot  antinodes, maximising the in phase resonances.  The high tech reflectance results in much greater transmission efficiency compared to regular tone mirror plates, it is the Total Bass Sustain system.  Optimal operation may require  an 18V supply on your Ebow or using the recyclable graduated multi-layer paper damping system.  

I’m not sure I want a brown note. 

[Jo.gwillim]

16 hours ago, Maude said:

I have invented a plate to be used to in the conjunction with high mass bridges called a 'tone mirror'. It screws onto the rear of your bass directly in line with the bridge and reflects vibrations back to the bridge, returning 100% of energy back into the string, creating an infinite energy loop so effective that I have to use an Ebow to tame it...

 

 

 

...honest. 

This sounds like the break through we've been waiting for.  Pictures please!?