Who Needs A Bass Amp?

[Chienmortbb]

This may end up a bit of a ramble but I have three bass amps and I set them all flat, getting my "sound" either from one of my Zoom pedals or  just using the bass itself. Last night we played at a venue that had one of those "wonderful" systems that monitors your sound level and cuts the power if you get too loud. Thankfully these are becoming few and far between. Last night only myself and the lead guitarist were plugged in to this system in ignorance. In an attempt to find the problem, I went straight form the bass into the amp. Set  flat it was more than passable.

 

Anyway it got me thinking about just having a small form power amp fed from the Zoom(s).  Is anyone using this type of setup, rather than a PA cab or a tradition bass amp/cab/combo?

[PaulThePlug]

There was a thread about pedal board power amps...

Harley Benton, EHX and a few others...

[PinkMohawk]

Sure, whole lot of people moving in this direction, using amp modellers either direct to the PA or power amp into cabs. I'd look at getting an amp that you like the sound of, and that also has an effects loop. That way, you can plug into the return of the loop with your Zoom, and should the Zoom ever fail on a gig, you can still plug into the front of the amp and it's not a show-stopper. 

[Jack]

My first step towards what's now called frfr was a pedal board preamp into a power amp and then a hifi ish 3 way Dr bass cabinet. Worked great, and I left the rig at home when a good pa was provided. 

Edited August 18 by Jack

[Geek99]

I do it, either zoom into PA or zoom into TC bH250 into Pa

[DGBass]

I've tried modelling pedals and just never liked sounding like someone else's preset or my own modded version of one. I see their worth, but I use very little in the way of effects nowadays. Last few gigs in particular have been Bass -> LMB3 -> Amp. And thats it. One thing i've leaned towards is using smaller amps to mitigate gig monitoring systems and probably more for the benefit of my hearing than anything else. For the most part its really just my bass and the amp, and I kind of like the raw sound of my bass direct into a small amp set clean. By small amp I mean anything less that 150 solid state watts as that seems more than enough for pub gigs. I've also tried a dedicated power amp ( A Behringer 200w per channel/400W bridged type ) into one cab. One channel was sufficent for small gigs and bridged was even more flexible. However, I needed more front end EQ/signal to drive the power amp which just complicated things more at the very front end. The Bass -> LMB3 -> Amp( up to 150watts ) really has been a godsend of simplicity. As mentioned already, most amps have the flexibility of useable EQ, and still have a send/return to just use as a power amp if needed. And, if your modeller fails, you can still plug straight into the amp and probably hear what your bass  actually sounds like as the Gods of Analogue/True Bypass intended🙂

[skidder652003]

I haven't used an amp for a couple of years now.

Bass into pedal board including zoom B1Four and Laney Digbeth preamp, straight into desk/PA

In ear monitoring for the guitars and vocals and the best bit, a Porter and Davies KT platform for bass and drums.

My Ampeg head and stack sits quietly in the garage these days 

Must get round to selling it..

Edited August 19 by skidder652003

[Geek99]

I’ll give you £10 and I’ll even collect. 

[BigRedX]

20 hours ago, Chienmortbb said:

Anyway it got me thinking about just having a small form power amp fed from the Zoom(s).  Is anyone using this type of setup, rather than a PA cab or a tradition bass amp/cab/combo?

 

What cab(s) would be be using with this?

[Chienmortbb]

14 minutes ago, BigRedX said:

What cab(s) would be be using with this?

I was not thinking about any particular cab although the 8" cab being done bu @Phil Starr would work. I suppose I was partly also thinking about my LFSys Monza.

 

My initial thought was a small amp in the Elf/Gnome type amp using an ICEPower module but when I looked at the costs, as usual, I realised that DIY would be MME (much more expensive). So I started thinking about exactly what I needed.  I leave my amps flat, no EQ at all. I know they are flat as I have measured the response of the preamp section.

 

 

 

[stewblack]

I enjoy playing around with different gear. My latest idea is to actually utilise the many preamp options I have at my disposal. 

I too considered a small power amp, but in the end I found there's no real savings to be had and tiny powerful bass amps abound. As long as it has an effects loop I can bypass the preamp and off I go.

Bang for buck nothing seems to beat the Harley Benton Block. 800 watts, under 300 quid. 

I've been waiting for them to return to stock at Thomann, they're now predicted at 1 to 2 weeks. 

[lemmywinks]

4 hours ago, stewblack said:

I enjoy playing around with different gear. My latest idea is to actually utilise the many preamp options I have at my disposal. 

I too considered a small power amp, but in the end I found there's no real savings to be had and tiny powerful bass amps abound. As long as it has an effects loop I can bypass the preamp and off I go.

Bang for buck nothing seems to beat the Harley Benton Block. 800 watts, under 300 quid. 

I've been waiting for them to return to stock at Thomann, they're now predicted at 1 to 2 weeks. 

 

I read elsewhere (grain of salt, may just have been random forum gossip) but the effects in on the HB Block clone is pretty much flat response so it would make for an ideal tiny power amp that costs peanuts.

[SuperSeagull]

On 10/09/2024 at 10:48, stewblack said:

I enjoy playing around with different gear. My latest idea is to actually utilise the many preamp options I have at my disposal. 

I too considered a small power amp, but in the end I found there's no real savings to be had and tiny powerful bass amps abound. As long as it has an effects loop I can bypass the preamp and off I go.

Bang for buck nothing seems to beat the Harley Benton Block. 800 watts, under 300 quid. 

I've been waiting for them to return to stock at Thomann, they're now predicted at 1 to 2 weeks. 

How have you got on with this? Having the same thought process as you.

[stewblack]

2 hours ago, SuperSeagull said:

How have you got on with this? Having the same thought process as you.

I'm enjoying it thoroughly. I haven't the cash to go mad buying up preamps at present. However, I am scouring the second hand market and there's an Eden I have my eye on. Next week I should take delivery of an Aguilar clone made by Demon FX , but so far the surprise package has been the Behringer Sansamp clone!

[SuperSeagull]

2 hours ago, stewblack said:

I'm enjoying it thoroughly. I haven't the cash to go mad buying up preamps at present. However, I am scouring the second hand market and there's an Eden I have my eye on. Next week I should take delivery of an Aguilar clone made by Demon FX , but so far the surprise package has been the Behringer Sansamp clone!

Did you get the HB Bass Block and if so what impressions?

[stewblack]

10 hours ago, SuperSeagull said:

Did you get the HB Bass Block and if so what impressions?

Fantastic amp at a crazy price.

That's my review in a nutshell.

I bought it to use with my narrow 2x8 cabs as it wouldn't overhang. The idea being to simply employ the power amp with various different preamps. Obviously I was always going to try it without a preamp and the results were just excellent. 

It's easy to transport, the onboard compressor is good enough to save a space on my pedal board, the tone controls provide plenty of flexibility and it is as loud as you could want it to be.

Put it this way I will be selling my Orange Little Bass Thing now. That should tell you how good it is.

[SuperSeagull]

1 hour ago, stewblack said:

Fantastic amp at a crazy price.

That's my review in a nutshell.

I bought it to use with my narrow 2x8 cabs as it wouldn't overhang. The idea being to simply employ the power amp with various different preamps. Obviously I was always going to try it without a preamp and the results were just excellent. 

It's easy to transport, the onboard compressor is good enough to save a space on my pedal board, the tone controls provide plenty of flexibility and it is as loud as you could want it to be.

Put it this way I will be selling my Orange Little Bass Thing now. That should tell you how good it is.

Perfect. Thanks. Just ordered a B Stock one. 

[mrtcat]

On 18/08/2024 at 12:47, Chienmortbb said:

Last night we played at a venue that had one of those "wonderful" systems that monitors your sound level and cuts the power if you get too loud. Thankfully these are becoming few and far between.

Depends what type of gigs you play but in general we are seeing more and more of these. We do circa 100 weddings a year and there are noise restrictions in one form or another at probably 80% of these. A lot of venues are moving towards in house sound systems that have built in limiters that completely squash the life out of anything other than a whisper. The same venues usually have strict "no backline" policies.

Any band doing what we do really needs to be onboard with working with a silent stage these days. When we get bigger venues with no restrictions we happily use amps though as its nice to cut loose a bit more from time to time. 

[Gank Bass]

On 18/08/2024 at 12:47, Chienmortbb said:

This may end up a bit of a ramble but I have three bass amps and I set them all flat, getting my "sound" either from one of my Zoom pedals or  just using the bass itself. Last night we played at a venue that had one of those "wonderful" systems that monitors your sound level and cuts the power if you get too loud. Thankfully these are becoming few and far between. Last night only myself and the lead guitarist were plugged in to this system in ignorance. In an attempt to find the problem, I went straight form the bass into the amp. Set  flat it was more than passable.

 

Anyway it got me thinking about just having a small form power amp fed from the Zoom(s).  Is anyone using this type of setup, rather than a PA cab or a tradition bass amp/cab/combo?

 

 

These systems are the bane of my life when playing wedding venues. Using DI outs helps, I got a little eden 2*8 just to give myself and the drummer some vibration to work with but i can't help feel that customers are being ripped off by venues who allow bands but don't disclose this information! Once people start singing and dancing it can quickly trigger a db limiter/cut out 🤦‍♂️

 

My favourite example of this was the wedding planner asking us during the interval to "tell the crowd to dance a bit quieter"... I wish this was a joke

[pete.young]

1 hour ago, Gank Bass said:

 

 

These systems are the bane of my life when playing wedding venues. Using DI outs helps, I got a little eden 2*8 just to give myself and the drummer some vibration to work with but i can't help feel that customers are being ripped off by venues who allow bands but don't disclose this information! Once people start singing and dancing it can quickly trigger a db limiter/cut out 🤦‍♂️

 

 

 

When I played with a band that did a lot of wedding gigs, we ended up with everything on UPS that would power everything long enough for it to reset. At the time we had a keyboard which took 2 minutes and 45 seconds to reboot itself.

[Gank Bass]

9 minutes ago, pete.young said:

 

When I played with a band that did a lot of wedding gigs, we ended up with everything on UPS that would power everything long enough for it to reset. At the time we had a keyboard which took 2 minutes and 45 seconds to reboot itself.

That is actually genius thank you!!

[mrtcat]

1 hour ago, Gank Bass said:

 

 

These systems are the bane of my life when playing wedding venues. Using DI outs helps, I got a little eden 2*8 just to give myself and the drummer some vibration to work with but i can't help feel that customers are being ripped off by venues who allow bands but don't disclose this information! Once people start singing and dancing it can quickly trigger a db limiter/cut out 🤦‍♂️

 

My favourite example of this was the wedding planner asking us during the interval to "tell the crowd to dance a bit quieter"... I wish this was a joke

This is exactly our experience too. Venues tell clients that "bands love it here and never struggle - it always sounds amazing" and then try to point the finger at the band when the limiter set to 89db trips just from the crowd clapping. We have clauses in our contract that squarely tell the client that we cannot be held responsible for poor sound in venues with these systems. Clients are definitely being ripped by venues that really should be clear that they're not suitable for bands before they take the customer's money off them.

[mrtcat]

4 minutes ago, Gank Bass said:

That is actually genius thank you!!

A lot of venues are aware of this and will have a contract with the client forbidding bands to use them. One of the bands I dep with got caught out and the venue asked them to pack up and leave. They had to comp the clients their full fee so just be careful.

[Gank Bass]

2 minutes ago, mrtcat said:

A lot of venues are aware of this and will have a contract with the client forbidding bands to use them. One of the bands I dep with got caught out and the venue asked them to pack up and leave. They had to comp the clients their full fee so just be careful.

Oh right thanks for the heads up!

[pete.young]

17 hours ago, mrtcat said:

A lot of venues are aware of this and will have a contract with the client forbidding bands to use them. One of the bands I dep with got caught out and the venue asked them to pack up and leave. They had to comp the clients their full fee so just be careful.

 

We never came across this scenario. I think if we were ever made aware by a client of the clause we would have declined the booking. In general, I think it's pretty unusual for the client to even read the contract, never mind make the bands aware of any relevant clause.  If the client doesn't make the band aware of the clause, what then? I guess to cover yourself, it would have to be in the contract between band and client.

 

All in in all I'm glad I don't do weddings any more!