What am I actually trying to achieve and with what?

[NancyJohnson]

I have a few basses (all good), several cabs (all good), some Sansamps (all good) and a Darkglass AO900 head.

 

I've posted previously about how I haven't really bonded with the AO900; it's a tad too aggressive/gnarly for my liking.  I adore the power and that I can jack a stomp into the effects return, but ideally I'd like to be able to have a small/loud one box solution to give me a bit of Geddy Lee style clank and Jean Jacques dirt, so I'm looking for recommendations.  I guess the amp will return £650/700 which I can throw at something else.

 

Help!

[Beedster]

You want JJB tone but your current head is too aggressive/gnarly.....?

[Lozz196]

Tech21 VT500? Would think that would be good for those tones.

[NancyJohnson]

7 hours ago, Beedster said:

You want JJB tone but your current head is too aggressive/gnarly.....?

 

It's an odd one, but a case of wrong type of distortion.  The AO is somewhat middy; the videos where you see these metal guys going nuts with Dingwalls, not once have I ever been able to emulate anything close to that.

 

I was never happier than when I got my first Sansamp BDDI and then migrated to an RBI/Poweramp setup.  I've gone through a lot of kit since then, chasing tone.

 

There has to be something.

[Beedster]

Just now, NancyJohnson said:

 

It's an odd one, but a case of wrong type of distortion.  The AO is somewhat middy; the videos where you see these metal guys going nuts with Dingwalls, not once have I ever been able to emulate anything close to that.

 

I was never happier than when I got my first Sansamp BDDI and then migrated to an RBI/Poweramp setup.  I've gone through a lot of kit since then, chasing tone.

 

There has to be something.

This is why basschat exists, our brains are wired this way. We’re searching but we will never find…. 🤔

[NancyJohnson]

3 minutes ago, Beedster said:

This is why basschat exists, our brains are wired this way. We’re searching but we will never find…. 🤔

 

I posted a while back about simply going the stomp/small (class D) Poweramp route.  I could live with that.  I saw a review of the Boss Katana bass head a few hours ago, but a peak rate of 500w isn't going to be enough.

 

Suppose the thing is - and while I live a few miles from Andertons - actually trying stuff out is nightmarishly difficult.

 

 

[MichaelDean]

I'd suggest trying a Digbeth head. I might be biased as I just got one, but the distortion is tubey in nature and the tilt control is a bit of magic. You can make it light or dark sounding with a twist of the knob, then fine tune with the EQ. 500W RMS too. It's plenty loud enough in a loud band. Seriously good bit of kit. 

[BigRedX]

Weird that you can't get a sound you like out of the Darkglass. The Darkglass pre-amp model on my Helix is fast becoming the most important and versatile part of my signal chain and I am in the process of using it to replace the EQ, distortion and amp modules in my older Presets. So far the only thing I haven't been able to get out of it is a cheap nasty DIY fuzzbox tone.

[Beedster]

1 hour ago, NancyJohnson said:

 

Suppose the thing is - and while I live a few miles from Andertons - actually trying stuff out is nightmarishly difficult.

 

 

 

It's more than that though, you simply will never know whether it's going to do the job in the band if you've only tried it in a shop. That, again, is why we have basschat. Is a Helix as per @BigRedX post the solution perhaps?

[prowla]

10 hours ago, NancyJohnson said:

I have a few basses (all good), several cabs (all good), some Sansamps (all good) and a Darkglass AO900 head.

 

I've posted previously about how I haven't really bonded with the AO900; it's a tad too aggressive/gnarly for my liking.  I adore the power and that I can jack a stomp into the effects return, but ideally I'd like to be able to have a small/loud one box solution to give me a bit of Geddy Lee style clank and Jean Jacques dirt, so I'm looking for recommendations.  I guess the amp will return £650/700 which I can throw at something else.

 

Help!

I'm with you on the Darkglass sound; to me it sounds like a comb and bog roll, but I think it may fit into the mix well.

A real Ampeg is probably the answer (to most bass sound questions), but lugging one of those around is a chore.

My Stomp is good for incidental effects, but I wouldn't use it on all the time; in face I even switch mine out via a looper, as it affects the sound even with everything off.

I've got Ampeg, SWR, Trace, and RBI preamps, but I've not spent much time with them as my Markbass EVO's emulation is really good; I took some to a Bass Bash, but the Markbass sounded good and I never got round to turning them on.

[Beedster]

2 minutes ago, prowla said:

I'm with you on the Darkglass sound; to me it sounds like a comb and bog roll, but I think it may fit into the mix well.

A real Ampeg is probably the answer (to most bass sound questions), but lugging one of those around is a chore.

My Stomp is good for incidental effects, but I wouldn't use it on all the time; in face I even switch mine out via a looper, as it affects the sound even with everything off.

I've got Ampeg, SWR, Trace, and RBI preamps, but I've not spent much time with them as my Markbass EVO's emulation is really good; I took some to a Bass Bash, but the Markbass sounded good and I never got round to turning them on.

If it wasn't for the need for 'small' I'd have said SVT also, if you can't get Geddy/JJB out of that just give up

[MichaelDean]

I'm just listening to The Stranglers (not sure I've given them a listen before, but as an '87 model, they were a bit before my time...) and I'm doubling down on my Digbeth recommendation. I think you'll be able to get right where you want to be with it as a one box solution. No, it isn't the smallest head out there, but it's not massive either.

[fretmeister]

8 hours ago, BigRedX said:

Weird that you can't get a sound you like out of the Darkglass. The Darkglass pre-amp model on my Helix is fast becoming the most important and versatile part of my signal chain and I am in the process of using it to replace the EQ, distortion and amp modules in my older Presets. So far the only thing I haven't been able to get out of it is a cheap nasty DIY fuzzbox tone.

 

 

The AO drive sound is very different from the B7K / B3K Darkglass sound.

 

If I was the OP, I'd swap the amp for the MT900 v2 instead to get that B3K and Vintage Microtube tone options.

[BigRedX]

1 minute ago, fretmeister said:

The AO drive sound is very different from the B7K / B3K Darkglass sound.

 

Fair enough.

 

I just looked at the specs for the B7K and the AO and from a cursory glance the AO amp seemed have more options, so I expected that it would cover all the B7K sounds.

[thodrik]

I own the V1 AO pedal and I would agree that I find it harder to drive in a tone I really like just using it alone. I nearly always have to blend it with something else (usually a Sansamp BDDI and a B3K). So essentially I use it as 'Salt and Pepper' on top of my established tone.

I don't actually like the tone of the pedal or drive circuit by itself. I find the mids to be very very hairy and congested, compared to the B*K circuit which has more of a clean mid scoop and high end drive/fizz. On the AO pedal I frankly find the three band EQ isn't particularly great (It needs more than a three band EQ to shape effectively) and I don't particularly like to low and high 'growl' and 'bite' switches. As a result I have...been using the pedal constantly for the last 5 years.

If I was choosing between the Darkglass amps I would definitely pick the one with the B*K/VMT circuit. A B3K has been on my board since 2016 and while not perfect (a bit mid-scoopy on all settings) it does just 'work' in a live setting.

 

 

 

[NancyJohnson]

2 hours ago, fretmeister said:

The AO drive sound is very different from the B7K / B3K Darkglass sound.

 

If I was the OP, I'd swap the amp for the MT900 v2 instead to get that B3K and Vintage Microtube tone options.

 

I'm not so familiar with the DG pedals; the backbone of my tone was Sansamp BDDI for years.  When the AO was announced I ordered thinking it was going to be a one box solution to satisfy my needs.  I remember @Wolverinebass saying that the Alpha suited me more than the Omega, which is largely correct.

 

Anyhow, I've decided to relist the AO900 and will do so this weekend.  Replacement, well, I just don't know.  

[fretmeister]

The Joyo Double Thruster is very close in tone to the B3K. It's a very good clone. Certainly close enough to try for cheap to see if that is in the right direction.

 

Amazon have them, and their returns are dead easy.

[Wolverinebass]

1 hour ago, NancyJohnson said:

 

I'm not so familiar with the DG pedals; the backbone of my tone was Sansamp BDDI for years.  When the AO was announced I ordered thinking it was going to be a one box solution to satisfy my needs.  I remember @Wolverinebass saying that the Alpha suited me more than the Omega, which is largely correct.

 

Anyhow, I've decided to relist the AO900 and will do so this weekend.  Replacement, well, I just don't know.  

Distortion is a personal thing and I'm of the John Entwistle school of playing, so Tech 21 is always going to be a better choice in that regard. 

 

I have the ultra versions of the AO and X7. I don't use them and they're generally for people I record in the studio. I generally find that Darkglass distortion doesn't work for me.

 

Amp wise, I went with the GK Fusion 1200. Clean tone is good and the dirt can be quite radically sculpted. As it's a tube it's a touch warmer than the Legacy version.

 

Probably the EQ points of the amp work better too than most, but it's all personal preference. 

 

If one is used to a sound and the other major flavours don't work, then that's what I'd go to.

 

You're welcome to pop over and try the GK if you want.

[la bam]

On 12/09/2024 at 22:05, NancyJohnson said:

I have a few basses (all good), several cabs (all good), some Sansamps (all good) and a Darkglass AO900 head.

 

I've posted previously about how I haven't really bonded with the AO900; it's a tad too aggressive/gnarly for my liking.  I adore the power and that I can jack a stomp into the effects return, but ideally I'd like to be able to have a small/loud one box solution to give me a bit of Geddy Lee style clank and Jean Jacques dirt, so I'm looking for recommendations.  I guess the amp will return £650/700 which I can throw at something else.

 

Help!

 

Boss katana 210 combo. 

 

Absolutely fantastic amp. 

 

Class A/B. Heft. 

 

Easy to use on the fly. 

 

Pretty much all the boss pedals you'll ever need inside it. 

 

PC options for sound creation and storage of sounds. 

 

6 presets on its own. Unlimited when attached to a tablet or pc. 

 

It takes a while and a bit of luck but once you get the sounds and work it out, you really can't beat it. And it's loud. Proper loud. I play in loud bands and haven't had it above half way yet. 

 

I'm astounded these haven't caught on more. There was an as new one on here a it back for around £250!!! 

[prowla]

@NancyJohnson As mentioned, I have these.

 

 

You're welcome to try them out for a couple of weeks, or I can bring them to the next Bass Bash.

(The "AvecAmp" is the same size; it's just in a shorter case, so it's further from the camera!)

The power amp is a cheaper model, but I wanted a 1U unit.

 

I've also got this Fx setup which covers a wide range of sounds.

 

 

The Microbass 3 is my "must-have" pedal; there's one for sale in the BC classifieds.

My only gripe with it is I wish both channels were the same (like the Stanley Clarke acoustic bass model).

 

[Skybone]

On 12/09/2024 at 23:54, Lozz196 said:

Tech21 VT500? Would think that would be good for those tones.

 

On 13/09/2024 at 06:15, NancyJohnson said:

I was never happier than when I got my first Sansamp BDDI and then migrated to an RBI/Poweramp setup.  I've gone through a lot of kit since then, chasing tone.

 

There has to be something.

 

On 12/09/2024 at 23:54, Lozz196 said:

Tech21 VT500? Would think that would be good for those tones.

 

Edited September 15 by Skybone

[fretmeister]

On 14/09/2024 at 08:52, la bam said:

 

Boss katana 210 combo. 

 

Absolutely fantastic amp. 

 

Class A/B. Heft. 

 

Easy to use on the fly. 

 

Pretty much all the boss pedals you'll ever need inside it. 

 

PC options for sound creation and storage of sounds. 

 

6 presets on its own. Unlimited when attached to a tablet or pc. 

 

It takes a while and a bit of luck but once you get the sounds and work it out, you really can't beat it. And it's loud. Proper loud. I play in loud bands and haven't had it above half way yet. 

 

I'm astounded these haven't caught on more. There was an as new one on here a it back for around £250!!! 

 

 

After trying one a couple of weeks ago (and really enjoying it) and then talking to a chap at a large music shop chain - they are absolutely sure that the Katana Bass combos would sell massively, maybe become the highest selling product in that category if they weren't so much heavier than the competition. He told me that he gets plenty of people into the demo room, they plug in and play and love the tones, and then try and lift it and are no longer interested. As he put it - it's too heavy for kids and older people to carry, and the people in the middle are happy to spend more on something lighter.

 

They sound great and the only reason they are not selling is the weight.

 

 

 

 

[NancyJohnson]

3 hours ago, Skybone said:

 

3 hours ago, Skybone said:

 

 

 

 

 

I had a VTBass rack unit AND a VTBASS DI.

 

Didn't mind them, but the BDDI/RBI was superior, or more to the point, it suited me better.  If @Tech21NYC had made a head with the RBI then it would be my #1 choice.

 

 

[la bam]

3 hours ago, fretmeister said:

 

 

After trying one a couple of weeks ago (and really enjoying it) and then talking to a chap at a large music shop chain - they are absolutely sure that the Katana Bass combos would sell massively, maybe become the highest selling product in that category if they weren't so much heavier than the competition. He told me that he gets plenty of people into the demo room, they plug in and play and love the tones, and then try and lift it and are no longer interested. As he put it - it's too heavy for kids and older people to carry, and the people in the middle are happy to spend more on something lighter.

 

They sound great and the only reason they are not selling is the weight.

 

 

 

 

 

Its just the fact people have got used to class d and lightweight cabs. They'd be better thinking of it as heavier - but only one trip and one plug. Buy a little folding truck for £20 if needed. It's not so much the weight, more the awkward lift. The handle on top means it's a dead lift with one hand and it's against the side of your leg type of lift. 

 

 

[fretmeister]

Markbass announced their new 2x10 combo today. No doubt it will be about a grand, but it’s also 6.5kg lighter.

 

I bet Boss gets feedback from the shops and are working on a V2. They’re mad if they don’t.