Music Man? Ernie Ball? Stingray?

[OliverBlackman]

I’d get a US SUB. I made the mistake of thinking a full fat 3EQ US Stingray would be better but while the fit and finish obviously was, it didn’t have the 2EQ growl I’d loved previously.

[drTStingray]

20 hours ago, Jack said:

You're kidding, right? I know there's been a rush on prices for all basses* recently but Stingrays have over doubled in price in the past 3-4 years. 

 

* all things, to be fair 

I don’t know where you get your info from but here are some prices I paid for new EBMM instruments:-

1) Stingray Special 4HH and 5HH - Autumn 2018 - £2250 each.

2) Stingray Tim Commerford passive long scale (one of 50) - Autumn 2021 - £2995

3) Stingray 40th Anniversary Old Smoothie - Autumn 2016 - £2050

4) Sabre Classic Neptune Blue version summer 2014 - £2233

5) Stingray Classic coral red - summer 2010 - £1650

 

Used standard Stingrays were around £750-£800 up to about 2014 (10 yrs ago) - they are now more like £1500 (more if in sought after colours or specs). Stingray Specials vary in price but even the most reduced seem to be £1700 - again the spec makes a difference. 
 

I hope this helps - much of the market for Stingrays and other EBMM isn’t the ‘scratch the Stingray itch’ and then sell on after 6 months as they don’t suit - I’ve also noticed there are people who think in terms of prices in the early 2000s - as an example of 2003, I could have had an immaculate condition Inca silver 77 Ray for £1700 - that would be at least £4k now. A brand new SR5 natural was £1295 at the same time (now worth £1500+). 
 

 

[OliverBlackman]

2 hours ago, drTStingray said:

I don’t know where you get your info from but here are some prices I paid for new EBMM instruments:-

1) Stingray Special 4HH and 5HH - Autumn 2018 - £2250 each.

2) Stingray Tim Commerford passive long scale (one of 50) - Autumn 2021 - £2995

3) Stingray 40th Anniversary Old Smoothie - Autumn 2016 - £2050

4) Sabre Classic Neptune Blue version summer 2014 - £2233

5) Stingray Classic coral red - summer 2010 - £1650

 

Used standard Stingrays were around £750-£800 up to about 2014 (10 yrs ago) - they are now more like £1500 (more if in sought after colours or specs). Stingray Specials vary in price but even the most reduced seem to be £1700 - again the spec makes a difference. 
 

I hope this helps - much of the market for Stingrays and other EBMM isn’t the ‘scratch the Stingray itch’ and then sell on after 6 months as they don’t suit - I’ve also noticed there are people who think in terms of prices in the early 2000s - as an example of 2003, I could have had an immaculate condition Inca silver 77 Ray for £1700 - that would be at least £4k now. A brand new SR5 natural was £1295 at the same time (now worth £1500+). 
 

 

I’m very much guilty of comparing to prices over twenty years ago. I traded mine for a value of £500 in around 2009. But there were quite a few around there at the time. But because Fender, Musicman, Gibson and Warwick all put their prices up around 10 years ago, £2-3k has become the norm for a quality instrument.

[drTStingray]

1 hour ago, OliverBlackman said:

I’m very much guilty of comparing to prices over twenty years ago. I traded mine for a value of £500 in around 2009. But there were quite a few around there at the time. But because Fender, Musicman, Gibson and Warwick all put their prices up around 10 years ago, £2-3k has become the norm for a quality instrument.

Yeah I agree - various factors involved including impact of Covid, global inflation, supply chain issues, distribution issues caused by shipping issues.

 

Id put EBMM instruments on a par with Fender Custom Shop team built in terms of volume of manual input and craftsmanship - in some instances the materials used are actually higher quality - look how much a new Pino signature Precision would cost - even used they’re on a par, price wise, with a new Musicman! 
 

So used prices have also increased. 

[peteb]

5 hours ago, drTStingray said:

Used standard Stingrays were around £750-£800 up to about 2014 (10 yrs ago) - they are now more like £1500

 

I always used to think that at one time secondhand Stingrays were really undervalued, perhaps not so much these days. 

 

I have a strange relationship with Stingrays, in that I like them but never get round to gigging with them, I always seem to pick up a Fender or an active jazz! But whenever I sell one, I always regret it and end up buying another! 

 

[casapete]

10 hours ago, peteb said:

 

I always used to think that at one time secondhand Stingrays were really undervalued, perhaps not so much these days. 

 

I have a strange relationship with Stingrays, in that I like them but never get round to gigging with them, I always seem to pick up a Fender or an active jazz! But whenever I sell one, I always regret it and end up buying another! 

 

I know what you mean, I’ve done the same thing. 

Had many Rays over the years, from a pre EB to a recent 3eq job, and loved them all. Possibly

my favourite was a USA Sub, which only needed a proper scratchplate and was good to go. 
I can’t think of any other manufacturer who has maintained such a high level of quality and 

consistency - as others have said, it’s really hard to find a bad one. What finished my using

them was the old BC thing - weight. Most were on the cusp of being too heavy for my damaged

shoulder, being in the 9lbs zone. Seen a Sub advertised recently that was 10.5lbs! A mate of

mine has a fairly recent Ray that comes in at 8.3lbs but from my experience that is a rarity.

I did try the US Sterling - had a couple but didn’t seem any weight difference despite the

smaller body. Narrower neck was nice though, more jazz like. 

 

The other thing that may take some getting used to is the position of the pickup if you play

like me and rest your thumb on it - I’m used to a Precision so the change wasn’t an easy one.

Still, wonderful basses and still wish I could find one light enough, would definitely have another. 

[gjones]

I've owned two USA SUBS, a standard USA Stingray and a Sterling Stingray4 ( £230 B stock from Gear4music).

 

Playability wise, I like the Jazz neck of the Sterling better than the chunkier necks of the other Stingrays. The Sterling sounds exactly like a 2 EQ Stingray.

 

These days a new Stingray costs about £3,000 which is pretty ridiculous, so buy used if you can, and try before you buy.

Edited October 23 by gjones

[martthebass]

44 minutes ago, casapete said:

I know what you mean, I’ve done the same thing. 

Had many Rays over the years, from a pre EB to a recent 3eq job, and loved them all. Possibly

my favourite was a USA Sub, which only needed a proper scratchplate and was good to go. 
I can’t think of any other manufacturer who has maintained such a high level of quality and 

consistency - as others have said, it’s really hard to find a bad one. What finished my using

them was the old BC thing - weight. Most were on the cusp of being too heavy for my damaged

shoulder, being in the 9lbs zone. Seen a Sub advertised recently that was 10.5lbs! A mate of

mine has a fairly recent Ray that comes in at 8.3lbs but from my experience that is a rarity.

I did try the US Sterling - had a couple but didn’t seem any weight difference despite the

smaller body. Narrower neck was nice though, more jazz like. 

 

The other thing that may take some getting used to is the position of the pickup if you play

like me and rest your thumb on it - I’m used to a Precision so the change wasn’t an easy one.

Still, wonderful basses and still wish I could find one light enough, would definitely have another. 

In my recent purchase, I made sure I dealt with suppliers who could demonstrate the weight of their stock. In the end I was looking at Specials/Darkrays in the 7.5 - 10lb. By choice I went for one at 8lb5oz as I’m comfortable at that weight and was pretty sure it would be free of neck dive.

Andertons and Bass Direct do give weights and I noticed their recent stock of specials is at the lower end weight wise.

[peteb]

1 hour ago, casapete said:

I know what you mean, I’ve done the same thing. 

Had many Rays over the years, from a pre EB to a recent 3eq job, and loved them all. Possibly

my favourite was a USA Sub, which only needed a proper scratchplate and was good to go. 
I can’t think of any other manufacturer who has maintained such a high level of quality and 

consistency - as others have said, it’s really hard to find a bad one. What finished my using

them was the old BC thing - weight. Most were on the cusp of being too heavy for my damaged

shoulder, being in the 9lbs zone. Seen a Sub advertised recently that was 10.5lbs! A mate of

mine has a fairly recent Ray that comes in at 8.3lbs but from my experience that is a rarity.

I did try the US Sterling - had a couple but didn’t seem any weight difference despite the

smaller body. Narrower neck was nice though, more jazz like. 

 

The other thing that may take some getting used to is the position of the pickup if you play

like me and rest your thumb on it - I’m used to a Precision so the change wasn’t an easy one.

Still, wonderful basses and still wish I could find one light enough, would definitely have another. 

 

I've currently got a 91 3eq Stingray, but have previously had two 3eq models (another 91 and a 95), two 00s SR5s (sounded great, but I could never get on with the string spacing and the 'g' string) and a US Sterling (that I didn't like as much as the Stingrays). I did briefly consider selling the current ray as I'm not gigging it and I knew that I could get more than twice what I paid for it, but what's the point if I'm only going to start looking for another one! 

 

You're right about the pickup position - I found it a bit uncomfortable trying to anchor my thumb on the pickup. I've now got a 'ThumbRocker' thumb rest installed just in front of the pickup, which solves any issues in that respect. 

 

[drTStingray]

On 23/10/2024 at 11:15, martthebass said:

In my recent purchase, I made sure I dealt with suppliers who could demonstrate the weight of their stock. In the end I was looking at Specials/Darkrays in the 7.5 - 10lb. By choice I went for one at 8lb5oz as I’m comfortable at that weight and was pretty sure it would be free of neck dive.

Andertons and Bass Direct do give weights and I noticed their recent stock of specials is at the lower end weight wise.

All of my most recent MM basses have been at or under 8 lbs - including an SR5HH Special and a Bongo 5HH.

 

There are MM basses around from all eras of production (back to the 70s/80s) which are very light (7.5-8.5 lbs) if you’re willing to search for a long time. 
 

All that said, one of my favourite basses is an SR5 (2003 model thus with ceramic pick up) with natural finish and a maple fretboard - at the time of my purchase of it, it was my homage to Bernard Edwards - but I wanted 5 strings particularly for Stevie Wonder songs. It is somewhere between 10 and 11 lbs but balances perfectly on a strap and is not a pain on a gig. However I think it’s the most resonant bass I’ve ever played and has a fabulous tone. 

[martthebass]

44 minutes ago, drTStingray said:

All of my most recent MM basses have been at or under 8 lbs - including an SR5HH Special and a Bongo 5HH.

 

There are MM basses around from all eras of production (back to the 70s/80s) which are very light (7.5-8.5 lbs) if you’re willing to search for a long time. 
 

All that said, one of my favourite basses is an SR5 (2003 model thus with ceramic pick up) with natural finish and a maple fretboard - at the time of my purchase of it, it was my homage to Bernard Edwards - but I wanted 5 strings particularly for Stevie Wonder songs. It is somewhere between 10 and 11 lbs but balances perfectly on a strap and is not a pain on a gig. However I think it’s the most resonant bass I’ve ever played and has a fabulous tone. 

To be honest I don’t like the feel of a larger bass if it’s too lightweight. Can’t explain why. My shorty Sandberg Lionel is 7.5lb and feels ok but I had a Sandberg TT4 longscale at 7.5lb and for some reason it made it feel cheap to me. 
I don’t disagree that some heavy basses have great tone but anything much over 9lb gives my shoulder hassle after about an hour no matter how wide the strap.

[Mokl]

My Special comes in at ~8.8lbs, whilst my '89 is about 1lb heavier. I feel like a good chunk of that difference in my 2 basses is in the hardware. I'm fortunate that weight doesn't bother me (yet),within reason...

[diskwave]

For what its worth I played a 77 black maple all thru the 80's and it was a very poor instrument. Heavy and weedy sounding. Not all vintage that glistens is gold.

[Misdee]

I remember going to The Bass Centre at Wapping back in the 1980's and they  invariably had a a selection of used pre-EBMM Stingrays. They were always £495, and if you went back to the shop a fortnight later they were all sold and different ones had replaced them. I've no idea where they all came from.

 

Back in those days I had a sunburst/maple 1983 Stingray that was very lightweight. What I remember clearly about that bass was that it sounded distinctly different to the new EBMM basses that were in the shops at the time. It was much more "scooped" than the newer bass, lots of bass and slicing treble with not much in-between. I actually thought the EBMM basses were much better. I preferred the tone and they were much better made.

 

Nowadays I've got a Stingray Special and it's a great bass in it's own right, but it's definitely an evolution of the Stingray sound. It's unmistakably a Stingray tone, but with a new twist. A subtle but tangible difference, and it seems like they've nailed perceived weakness on the G string with the new neodymium pickup. The ergonomics are so much better than before.

 

The only thing I miss from the older  Stingray basses is the big bridge with mutes. I never used the mutes, but it looked great and was a characteristic feature of those basses.

Edited October 28 by Misdee

[Hellzero]

1 hour ago, diskwave said:

For what its worth I played a 77 black maple all thru the 80's and it was a very poor instrument. Heavy and weedy sounding. Not all vintage that glistens is gold.

I had the same experience with loads of pre CBS, and even worst, CBS Fender's : planks badly made and poorly when not totally dull sounding, that's certainly why I'm playing luthier's basses since so many many many years.

 

That said I owned a terrific sounding defretted 1964 Fender Precision Bass and also a fretted 1966 Fender Precision Bass as reliced as Rory Gallagher's Stratocaster.

 

A 1968 Fender Jazz Bass I owned was excellent too, but it was also defretted one, but that's all.

 

And I owned loads of them...

[Cliff Edge]

My 2006 3 eq 4 HH bought 12 months ago off FB Marketplace for £1200, including a quality generic hard case, weighs 4.6kgs. Marginally more than my 1976 Jazz. Reasonably priced options are still out there.