lemmywinks Posted November 3 Share Posted November 3 35 minutes ago, AndyTravis said: Jump on this https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1K34hJeyBe/? Just spotted this and came here to post it, Andy got in first! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 (edited) 12 hours ago, nick said: Not wanting to debate this, but I recently had to replace a dead MB-1 pickup in one of my 'Batwing' SB-700's with an Armstrong reproduction as Rautia are no longer producing them. I honestly couldn't hear any discernible difference in tone when A/B'ing it against an identical SB-700 with it's original MB-1. The Armstrong sounded great IMHO. I had it and the other original in the same bass, an SB R-80, and regardless of which pickup was in which position, they sounded badly mismatched. The Armstrong was a lot darker, sounded nothing like the pickup it was bought to replace. The Armstrong had two full length coils, not a Precision design under the cover, for a start. In the end, I traded the working original MB for another Armstrong (I knew a guy who had a SB-1000 with a dead coil), just so I could have two pickups which sounded somewhat related to each other and make the bass usable again. Edited November 4 by Doctor J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowla Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 (edited) 9 hours ago, AndyTravis said: Jump on this https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1K34hJeyBe/? Me three - I was just going to post that. Edited November 4 by prowla Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 2 hours ago, Doctor J said: I had it and the other original in the same bass, an SB R-80, and regardless of which pickup was in which position, they sounded badly mismatched. The Armstrong was a lot darker, sounded nothing like the pickup it was bought to replace. The Armstrong had two full length coils, not a Precision design under the cover, for a start. In the end, I traded the working original MB for another Armstrong (I knew a guy who had a SB-1000 with a dead coil), just so I could have two pickups which sounded somewhat related to each other and make the bass usable again. Yes, the Armstrong reproduction is two jazz like coils parallel to each other within the casing. However the original Aria MB1/1E's are the same construction. This is the dead Aria MB1 taken from my SB700 which shows that: I believe your SB R-80 would have had MBII pickups which were constructed as per P-Bass configuration. So, unsurprisingly the Armstrong would sound quite different & possibly mismatched with the existing MBII in your SB R-80. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tauzero Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 On 30/10/2024 at 19:07, thegummy said: Thanks a lot guys. Had no idea it was such a complicated bass. Just been listening to Marillion a lot lately, loved the bass tone so much and looked up what it was. Thought it might be the pickup type/placement that was giving it, hadn't counted on there being unique gadgetry. Appreciate the help. Pete Trewavas plays a load of different basses - Warwick Thumb is what I primarily associate with him, but also Ibanez soundgear (don't know which) and a Cort GB4 Custom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misdee Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 (edited) 2 hours ago, tauzero said: Pete Trewavas plays a load of different basses - Warwick Thumb is what I primarily associate with him, but also Ibanez soundgear (don't know which) and a Cort GB4 Custom. Pete played an Aria around the time of the Fugazi album(1984), and did indeed get a great sound with it. Whether he played it on that all or any of the tracks on that album I really don't know. A lot of it sounds like it could be a Rickenbacker, but equally it could be the SB1000 with a strident EQ setting. Anyhow, I would assume that is the era the O.P was referring to. Edited November 4 by Misdee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmo Valdemar Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 19 minutes ago, Misdee said: Pete played an Aria around the time of the Fugazi album(1984), and did indeed get a great sound with it. Whether he played it on that all or any of the tracks on that album I really don't know. A lot of it sounds like it could be a Rickenbacker, but equally it could be the SB1000 with a strident EQ setting. Anyhow, I would assume that is the era the O.P was referring to. I adore the Fugazi bass tone but haven't come close to it with any Rickenbacker or Aria. I've always assumed it was the Aria but frustratingly I just can't get anywhere near it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misdee Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 (edited) 1 hour ago, Cosmo Valdemar said: I adore the Fugazi bass tone but haven't come close to it with any Rickenbacker or Aria. I've always assumed it was the Aria but frustratingly I just can't get anywhere near it. I know what you mean. It sounds like new Rotosound strings played with a pick and a bit of overdrive on the top end. And compression. Pete's a terrific player within his chosen idiom though, it must be said, and that always helps. Like so many accomplished musicians, it's probably more the attitude with which he plays rather than the minutiae of the gear he's using. Edited November 4 by Misdee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tauzero Posted November 4 Share Posted November 4 He does use a pick so that would affect things. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted November 5 Share Posted November 5 Hey all. Apologies for being late to the game, and hey over there @Norris, @Hellzero, etc! Yes, I am still selling upgrade preamps for SB-1000s both on eBay and Reverb however it is cheaper to deal direct since that way I am not forced to have to use an expensive tracked shipping option. Reissues. Well, there are multiple issues with those. First and foremost, the hardware is not the same. The Gotoh bridge is way more adjustable and sane than the original, but isn't the same sort of "the mass of brass" by comparison. The fingerboard is now Ebony, whereas originally they were Jacaranda....which is a vague name for many woods, and without trying or wanting to stir controversy....I've heard Braz Rosewood called that multiple times before today. The pickups are not the same, but are more or less similar. My big issue comes with the electronics. When whoever owns the IP took the design back to manufacture, they started using a big open PCB-based preamp with a Mitsubishi alarm SIL IC for the battery blinker. What they did not do is maintain any of the quality of the parts. The resistors and caps are literally the cheapest ceramics and carbon comps, and inexplicably they retained the JRC4558 op-amp which is just insane. It's literally an iteration of the uA741 which was 60s grade tech. Current hungry, noisy and just not an efficient design. They also made it incompatible with the originals without significant rewiring and decisions needing to be made on how the LED works. So yes, as far as calling it a "re-issue" is concerned, that's stretching it. Talking of Armstrong and stretching things, Kent Armstrong in the US makes some very well-regarded repros. Aaron Armstrong in the UK apparently, not so much. It's been a good ten plus years since I've known anybody order one from Aaron, but that disappointment and poor experience stuck in my mind. Several people I know to be credible rate Kent's copies. Interesting that somebody else is making them here in the EU. I'll have to check out bassculture. @Jack The six-way varitone is an active LPF with a different decade characteristic to a passive LPF like a tone control. It also has a distinctive mid-bump which provides the character of each position. It's a very to-taste filter, but is another part of why the SB-1000 was a definingly 80s-sounding bass. It picks its way through a mix with that "honk", especially in the positions around the fifth fret. This is another area where they cheaped out on the re-issues, because they bought in the cheapest open-frame rotary switch and banged on the cheapest components for the RC array around it. For a nice demo on the woody honky tonality of the SB-1000, check out my good friend Zuma's channel. His recent re-do of Duran Duran's "New Moon On Monday" showcases wonderfully just how this bass pushes through a mix in a very specific way.... 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prostheta Posted November 5 Share Posted November 5 I'd also add the obvious....reissues do not use the same quality and grade of woods that were available in the 70s/80s. Back then, Matsumoku were pretty unique in that they spent at least a year longer in seasoning their wood stock before use. As a builder and industrial woodworker, I can tell you flat out that this makes a significant difference even though it doesn't make sense that the same wood doesn't seem to achieve that "as an instrument"! I'd use the analogy of whisky aging in a barrel where it doesn't continue to do so in the bottle, but that's just faulty. Anyway, they used super good wood and really discriminated between excellent and "okay" with the SB-1000 and other laminated neck flagships. Originals in good nick are worth hunting down for care and resto. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmo Valdemar Posted November 5 Share Posted November 5 1 hour ago, Prostheta said: Hey all. Apologies for being late to the game, and hey over there @Norris, @Hellzero, etc! Yes, I am still selling upgrade preamps for SB-1000s both on eBay and Reverb however it is cheaper to deal direct since that way I am not forced to have to use an expensive tracked shipping option. Mad thought - would it be possible to install the preamps into a pedal, thereby giving us humble SB700 players a chance to get those tones? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norris Posted November 6 Share Posted November 6 13 hours ago, Prostheta said: Hey all Great to hear from you and thanks for your insights. I know that you know a lot more about these basses than your average owner (i.e. me) does 😂 Hope everything is OK with you and that you're well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowla Posted November 6 Share Posted November 6 I've got an SB-600 which I happened across when I wandered into a shop. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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