Considering a different lightweight route...

[Musicman20]

Hey guys!

I was all set on a new Schroe...2x12. I almost had a deposit on one. But..I thought id test a similar 2x12 setup...so I tested a friends Aggie 2x12, (not lightweight...but). Although there are differences, obviously, and I still like the Aggies, it just didnt seem to be pushing enough air. The volume was there, but no bass....which I probably should have realised. I am competing against un mic'd Marshall half stacks so thats 2 4x12s...one of them being an Orange 4x12....super loud and heavy.

So...as much as the 2x12s do work for some...or even the 1x12 x 2, its not pushing enough for me. Later in life I might change to a smaller cab...but for now I want a bit more oommph! I still want lightweight. Ive been discussing the AE410 with a few members, (Simon) and its seems to perform incredibly.

There is also the Epifani 410UL S2, which has a little more weight now, but cheaper than the Berg by a fair whack.

I almost gassed upto a NV610....I might go down that route for my 'big cab' solution later...but for now I want a solid cab, preferrably a 4x10, that has that feeling and pushes some bass! It has to be lightweight and smallish, otherwise I could spend less or use my normal weight cabs.

Its going to be mainly powered by the LM3, when my order arrives.

Ive been gassing for Berg gear for years now...I feel like I should take the plunge and trust that it will be awesome. Just driving to test it will cost me about £40 and probably a place to stay.

But the Epifani seems also to have great stats on paper.

Ive no idea....at least ive got the right 'size' now.

I would go Schroe 410 front firing, but we are talking 8 weeks wait. Thats a lot of gigs.

Apologies for rambling on about cabs so much. Ive been researching loads...and testing, I just want it to be the right cab.

[Uncle Balsamic]

Want loud? Want light? Get a Big One

One of the coolest designs I've seen and supposedly as loud as a standard 610.

[escholl]

[quote name='Uncle Balsamic' post='503128' date='Jun 1 2009, 06:06 PM']Get a Big One [/quote]

+1

simplest answer.

[johnnylager]

[quote name='escholl' post='503481' date='Jun 2 2009, 01:39 AM']+1

simplest answer.[/quote]
Only answer.

[Merton]

[quote name='johnnylager' post='503510' date='Jun 2 2009, 08:25 AM']Only answer.[/quote]
Yip.

[stevefletch59]

I agree that Alex's cabs are the way to go but if you want to try a Berg 410 I've got one (it's the HS410 tho but I'm told they sound similar) I use it with a MB LMK and live about an hour away from you.

Cheers

Steve

[wateroftyne]

I would do a bit of research on TB before you take the plunge on the AE410. They're not to everyone's taste, I gather.

..but then, what is?

I still think you should give Alex's designs a closer look..

[ezbass]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='503089' date='Jun 1 2009, 05:28 PM']Hey guys!

I was all set on a new Schroe...2x12. I almost had a deposit on one. But..I thought id test a similar 2x12 setup...so I tested a friends Aggie 2x12,[/quote]

Not a similar set up. I A/Bed Schroes and Aggies before buying my 1212L, to my ears the Aggies were very boxy and weak by comparison (in the shop anyway). If you're interested in the Schro 1212, try one, best cab purchase I've ever made. Of course having said that you should also try Alex's cabs too.

[alexclaber]

I have to say that all 2x12"s do not sound the same. Assuming cabs of similar configuration sound similar isn't a good move - nominal diameter tells you essentially nothing about tone, so testing an Aguilar 2x12" to determine if you'll like a Schroeder 2x12" isn't very informative.

However if you do want big bottom the only way to get that at high SPL with the Markbass amp you're getting is with a large enclosure, whatever speakers it contains. There is no substitute for a large cabinet, hence all the recommendations for the Big One!

Alex

[51m0n]

Just so everyone knows, I said the ae410 is my favourite cab of all time, but if I weren't playing the ae410 I'd be playing a BigOne.

I also told him to try the ae410 at bass direct, and if it didnt completely fit the bill then get a BigOne (14 days to figure out if its right for you is enough for anyone!)

[Musicman20]

[quote name='ezbass' post='504467' date='Jun 3 2009, 09:43 AM']Not a similar set up. I A/Bed Schroes and Aggies before buying my 1212L, to my ears the Aggies were very boxy and weak by comparison (in the shop anyway). If you're interested in the Schro 1212, try one, best cab purchase I've ever made. Of course having said that you should also try Alex's cabs too.[/quote]

Thanks for the input. I know where you are coming from, but when its against 2 x guitar half stacks, and they play loud with loads of distortion, I think even a Schroe 1212L will struggle

[quote name='alexclaber' post='504477' date='Jun 3 2009, 09:59 AM']I have to say that all 2x12"s do not sound the same. Assuming cabs of similar configuration sound similar isn't a good move - nominal diameter tells you essentially nothing about tone, so testing an Aguilar 2x12" to determine if you'll like a Schroeder 2x12" isn't very informative.

However if you do want big bottom the only way to get that at high SPL with the Markbass amp you're getting is with a large enclosure, whatever speakers it contains. There is no substitute for a large cabinet, hence all the recommendations for the Big One!

Alex[/quote]

I understand it wont have the same tone, and indeed the Schroe is always going to have that 'fill the room' sound to it, but as above, this is the loudest band Ive ever been in, and we dont often get mic'd up correctly, so even a really efficient 2x12 is going to struggle. I'd love to have a smallish cab for some venues, but Ive got to be realistic with the type of music it is. Im going to do some testing me thinks!

[Finbar]

Depends how long you can wait, but we're coming back through Grimsby in July if you want a closer to listen to my 1212L.

[Musicman20]

Cheers dude! I may indeed wait a while...no rush.

[Finbar]

Actually, by then, chances are I'll have two.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Finbar' post='505008' date='Jun 3 2009, 08:09 PM']Actually, by then, chances are I'll have two.[/quote]

Are you opting for 1212BMF or 1212L?

Ps if you have any soundclips of it let me know

[Finbar]

1212L.

Smaller and same footprint as the cab I already have.

The only soundclip I have at the moment is the 'sneaky peek' track on www.myspace.com/maeslostempire. The others weren't recorded through the Schroeder. However, it is a slightly misleading clip. There is actually a clean DI'd signal blended with the Schroeder pumping out full on distortion. So not the best way to judge it perhaps.

I don't have any clips of it solo'd. The amp head makes more of a difference on the sound of it than the cab itself anyway.

[umph]

[quote name='Finbar' post='505073' date='Jun 3 2009, 09:36 PM']1212L.

Smaller and same footprint as the cab I already have.

The only soundclip I have at the moment is the 'sneaky peek' track on www.myspace.com/maeslostempire. The others weren't recorded through the Schroeder. However, it is a slightly misleading clip. There is actually a clean DI'd signal blended with the Schroeder pumping out full on distortion. So not the best way to judge it perhaps.

I don't have any clips of it solo'd. The amp head makes more of a difference on the sound of it than the cab itself anyway.[/quote]
digging the new tune chris whos doing the backing vocals?

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='504903' date='Jun 3 2009, 06:10 PM']Thanks for the input. I know where you are coming from, but when its against 2 x guitar half stacks, and they play loud with loads of distortion, I think even a Schroe 1212L will struggle [/quote]

How does your big rig do? And what does your big rig consist of? I see you have quite a few cabs but I doubt you use them all at once!

Alex

[Musicman20]

[quote name='alexclaber' post='505570' date='Jun 4 2009, 04:29 PM']How does your big rig do? And what does your big rig consist of? I see you have quite a few cabs but I doubt you use them all at once!

Alex[/quote]

The Orange Stack and/or Ampeg sound great. I just wanted something smaller and more efficient, preferable neo so I can save my back!

For the smaller/mid sized gigs, and also for touring so we have something we can load in and out quick, and that can get in a fairly small van.

Hmmmm

Edited June 4, 2009 by Musicman20

[alexclaber]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='505625' date='Jun 4 2009, 05:40 PM']The Orange Stack and/or Ampeg sound great. I just wanted something smaller and more efficient, preferable neo so I can save my back![/quote]

Well in that case as the Big One can keep up with either of those rigs individually given enough power then it's worth trying. As a bass player you do need to stand your ground about how big your rig needs to be - if anything it should be your guitarists doing the downsizing!

By the way, smaller always equals less efficient from a bass sensitivity standpoint - though I presume you were referring to how much effort it is to move.

Alex

[Finbar]

[quote name='umph' post='505541' date='Jun 4 2009, 03:36 PM']digging the new tune chris whos doing the backing vocals?[/quote]
Ta duck The backing in that bit is Luke, but we're all on the new tracks at one point or another!

[iamapirate]

sorry, I've just seen this thread and can't be a**'d to read it all!

I've got a relatively heavy (ok, very heavy) ashdown 300watt combo with 4x10 speakers, and whenever I'm playing in my band (with the guitarist going through his amp into a 2x12 marshall cab) I always find that my tone is getting swallowed up - just as you do. But when I played a gig last saturday with the guitaist going through a 4x12 marshall cab (same head) I end up cutting right through. Really strange....

But one thing that does help is a) setting the guitarists's bass on his EQ on the amp to zero, then pulling off the knob or (if you've got an ashdown) press the 'deep' button (or if you havn't got an ashdown, whack up the bass.... all the way) and you should find a quite boomy tone. However, if, lke me, you prefer tone over bass, then go for option a). :D:D

[Delberthot]

If you can't cut through with a Schroeder 1212L then you are playing far, far too loud as a band. Its the only cab I own whether for use as a monitor or to provide my out front sound when there's no PA

I can understand the lack of bass from a smaller cab and from my own experience of owning one for 2 years, once the speakers settle in you do get more but you have to have a large cab to get any more bottom end.

If you have to get something that'll go louder then I'd seriously advise getting ear plugs as you will definitely be doing yourself irrecoverable damage to your ears.

Then again, I've never tried an Aguilar cab - they could be pish for all I know but definitely don't try and compare different cabs according to the size of the speakers.

Incidentally, my 1212L replaced 2 Ashdown ABM115 cabs. Its clearer and far more punchy than the woolly behemoth. If you get the opportunity, try one at gig levels. Mine is unflappable against my guitarist who plays a Les Paul through a 120 watt Peavey 5150 combo.


By the way I'm not trying to have a go at you, just that you'll be deaf as a post if you need something louder than this and don't protect your ears. Your audience will also be deaf after a while at those kinds of levels and you'll end up driving people away from your gigs.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Delberthot' post='506739' date='Jun 6 2009, 12:11 AM']If you can't cut through with a Schroeder 1212L then you are playing far, far too loud as a band. Its the only cab I own whether for use as a monitor or to provide my out front sound when there's no PA

I can understand the lack of bass from a smaller cab and from my own experience of owning one for 2 years, once the speakers settle in you do get more but you have to have a large cab to get any more bottom end.

If you have to get something that'll go louder then I'd seriously advise getting ear plugs as you will definitely be doing yourself irrecoverable damage to your ears.

Then again, I've never tried an Aguilar cab - they could be pish for all I know but definitely don't try and compare different cabs according to the size of the speakers.

Incidentally, my 1212L replaced 2 Ashdown ABM115 cabs. Its clearer and far more punchy than the woolly behemoth. If you get the opportunity, try one at gig levels. Mine is unflappable against my guitarist who plays a Les Paul through a 120 watt Peavey 5150 combo.


By the way I'm not trying to have a go at you, just that you'll be deaf as a post if you need something louder than this and don't protect your ears. Your audience will also be deaf after a while at those kinds of levels and you'll end up driving people away from your gigs.[/quote]


I completely agree! My drummer always states its too loud. We both wear a lot of ear protection. I never even practice without it. Im very 'sensible' when it comes to the rest of the band, and like most of you on here, I am very careful with how loud we go.

The problem is our guitarists! When isnt it?! One of them has definitely has messed his ears up. He plays in a tiny practice room with his Marshall 60W TSL through an Orange 4x12 at nearly FULL VOLUME. Well not mine, I use ear protection. We often play WITHOUT PA support, so just the vox go through it (sounds like sh*t...I hate it) but then again we are becoming much better at getting decent gigs with decent PAs/Promoters.

Im starting to think its not my problem. I dont want another big cab....when I started to look at small cabs and lightweight cabs, I conciously wanted to get something small and easy to carry, for small tours and small venues. The Schroes arent massively expensive and get the job done. I think Ive changed my mind....again! But I suppose it was best to look at every option. I think getting another 'mid size cab' like a 4x10 is overkill for what I want to do.

Thanks for the advice. Now I dont know whether to look at the 1212L or go for a 1212BMF!

Edited June 6, 2009 by Musicman20

[Musicman20]

Not only that, but if Finbar is managing to use one in a slightly similar vein of music, then the Schroe should work for me dammit!