PMT Online trade in rip off

[edstraker123]

PMT have a seemingly lovely used Spector Euro RST in for £1700 in the Bristol store which I was really interested in. I wanted to trade in a 2 month old Rickenbacker 350V63 Liverpool which is flawless with case etc. which they have for sale on PMT for £3099. I was hoping for a minimum of a straight trade and the assistant said he would speak to the manager and phone me back. They offered £1000 !!!! My LGS had offered £1800 trade in and £1600 cash and they give notoriously bad deals. I'm not sure if the PMT offer was genuine or they just couldn't be bothered even checking a proper value. Anybody tried to do a trade in with them and if so what was your experience ?

 

 

 

 

[Burns-bass]

It’s not great but it’s no surprise.

They would know the value of the bass but they’re not that well known for used items.

 

[Kev]

PMT? Bax? Andertons?  Are there any shops left that haven't hurt you Ed? 

 

General used rate online for the Ric seems to be around the £2k mark, so being offered half its value by a big chain shop, whilst shocking, doesn't sound totally alien to me.  Best just to sell it privately and hopefully pocket a bit of change!

 

Is there a guitar equivalent of the likes of Bassbros?  Will offers really fair prices i've heard, your better bet is trying to sell to someone smaller, and I assume some will buy if its a desirable bit of kit.  But they naturally need to make a decent profit.

[edstraker123]

7 hours ago, Kev said:

PMT? Bax? Andertons?  Are there any shops left that haven't hurt you Ed?

You're not wrong - I need to stop buying stuff I don't need.  I've put the guitar on ebay. I was always under the impression that for a trade in you would get about half the value roughly depending upon desirability and condition . A third is ridiculous for a big name brand as new. The bass listing on the PMT website was a bit rubbish - poor photo and just great condition as a description - maybe in this particular shop they just can't be bothered. I can feel a Trustpilot review coming on....

[binky_bass]

PMT don't have a particularly strong used sales department unlike GuitarGuitar or Andertons. PMT probably don't actually want to take in much used stock and will only do so for a high profit margin or the ability for a quick flip. My advice is not to take offence by low offers, the item is yours to do with as you wish, simply decline their offer and move on. They're under no obligation whatsoever to offer you what you want, it's their business, they can offer you want THEY want to pay and you either accept or decline. 

[Beedster]

54 minutes ago, edstraker123 said:

You're not wrong - I need to stop buying stuff I don't need.  I've put the guitar on ebay. I was always under the impression that for a trade in you would get about half the value roughly depending upon desirability and condition . A third is ridiculous for a big name brand as new. The bass listing on the PMT website was a bit rubbish - poor photo and just great condition as a description - maybe in this particular shop they just can't be bothered. I can feel a Trustpilot review coming on....

 

Bad time of year for business and therefore cashflow, they just don't want money tied up in an instrument that might be hard to sell, the used market is extremely unpredictable at the best of times. There's absolutely no reason for any form of rant on Trustpilot, you asked them the question, they gave you an answer. Let's hope eBay provides a solution 👍

[casapete]

You could also maybe try Rich Tone in Sheffield. They buy guitars and basses, and from

my recent experience offer fair prices. I sent pics of my guitar and they made me an 

offer based on them. 

Edited Wednesday at 10:23 by casapete

[BigRedX]

Music shops have rarely offered anything close to second hand market value (unless it's something very rare AND desirable) for PX instruments and equipment. I was able to buy an Overwater Original bass for £350 in the early 90s from Carlsbro in Nottingham. I dread to think how little they must have given for it in the first place, in order to sell it to me so cheaply.

[Cosmo Valdemar]

Bassbros is the only place that have offered me decent prices, when buying my basses and taking them as trades. I learnt a long time ago that the "big" shops are never going to offer what you hope for. That's not a rip-off and honestly the idea if leaving a Trustpilot review because you took umbrage at a low trade offer is a massive overreaction. 

[lemmywinks]

You can buy that Ric for £3k new (PMT themselves have it at £3.1k), a shop isn't going to give you anything like the used market value as they'd be essentially competing with their own new stock. The manager will look at the profit margins he makes on a new Ric, figure out how much he can sell a used one for and make you an offer accordingly. He'll also have to factor in the possibility of a customer returning it due to a manufacturing fault (it's a Ric after all) and the shop having to take the hit.

 

Nothing sinister, this is just how retail works. Might be different if it was a rare instrument that the shop didn't stock.

Edited Wednesday at 09:30 by lemmywinks

[warwickhunt]

2 hours ago, edstraker123 said:

I was always under the impression that for a trade in you would get about half the value roughly depending upon desirability and condition . A third is ridiculous for a big name brand as new. 

 

No disrespect but your guitar isn't worth £3000... it is 'used' (it might be immaculate/unplayed but still not 'new') and by your own admission worth about £2000; so realistically they have in fact offered you your expected value of 50% of £2000 = £1000.  

 

It has always been the case that a High St retail store will offer the absolute lowest value for a trade in.  They have overheads, tax, paperwork, come-back concerns and ultimately have to make a profit never mind just breaking even.  I'll concede that your expectation of the Ric for a used Spector @ £1700 isn't totally out of the question.

 

As has been suggested, BassBros or similar might give you a better trade price but I'm 99% sure that if you sold on BC and had the readies in your hand you'd get the best deal buying the bass you are after... possibly even cheaper on BC.      

[Ed_S]

I only sell or trade to shops because I work on the basis that dealing with somebody who is absolutely upfront about their sole intent being to profit from my loss, and will even tell me the minimum margin that they're willing to make, is actually a lot less annoying than any of the possible negative private sale experiences that people report on here. That's just what works best for me, and I know that many will think differently - it's absolutely fine.

 

Anyway, my list says I've moved on about 80 items (basses, amps, pedals, parts etc.) that way since I started to clear house in 2022, and I work on a reasonable offer from a shop being two-thirds of the average eBay or Reverb price for the same thing in the same condition. I'm usually able to get that, though recently I've noticed one or two shops that I could previously rely on for reasonable (sometimes even good) offers have started to offer much less - about half of the lowest price they can find, irrespective of condition. I'm fairly lucky that Rich Tone is my local and still makes reasonable offers for most things, taking the condition into account.

 

If I were a betting man, I reckon they'd go to the Reverb price guide, take the £1900 recommendation and offer you £1250... so that local £1600 cash offer might be quite generous, and the PMT offer maybe isn't that scandalous.

Edited Wednesday at 10:01 by Ed_S
Correction

[edstraker123]

47 minutes ago, Cosmo Valdemar said:

That's not a rip-off and honestly the idea if leaving a Trustpilot review because you took umbrage at a low trade offer is a massive overreaction. 

I do have a bit of tendency to do that - I normally calm down after a nice cuppa and a malted milk 😀

Edited Wednesday at 10:10 by edstraker123

[BigRedX]

On the other hand, in the pre-internet days when retailers only had manufacturers' price lists to go on my synth band were to do a straight swap with our very expensive, but also very crap Yamaha CS15D synthesiser for a second hand Korg MS20, simply because the list retail price of the Yamaha was about double that of the Korg in 1983 and the shop knew next to nothing about synths and their relative features. The Yamaha synth was still sitting unsold in the shop at the beginning of the 90s.

[Lozz196]

Many moons ago I was looking at a bass in one of the big names. I had a bass to trade so phoned them up as it was a fair distance to drive. The person that answered was so evasive as to offering any indication of trade in value.

 

In the end I got a little (more than a little) exasperated and said look, I know the resale value of my bass is xx pounds. If I bring it all the way to your shop and I’m offered half that I will hit the person over the head with it. Now, in possession of that knowledge would you advise I get in my car or stay at home. I was advised to stay at home.

 

I’ve nothing against being offered a low amount, and am perfectly aware that the final offer is dependent on condition, but it was the evasiveness and refusal to give any indication of a value that got me. To be honest if they’d come straight out with a sum that was half the resale value I’d probably have taken it, as it’s the evasiveness cost the a sale and a future profit on my trade in.

[casapete]

5 hours ago, Lozz196 said:

Many moons ago I was looking at a bass in one of the big names. I had a bass to trade so phoned them up as it was a fair distance to drive. The person that answered was so evasive as to offering any indication of trade in value.

 

In the end I got a little (more than a little) exasperated and said look, I know the resale value of my bass is xx pounds. If I bring it all the way to your shop and I’m offered half that I will hit the person over the head with it. Now, in possession of that knowledge would you advise I get in my car or stay at home. I was advised to stay at home.

 

I’ve nothing against being offered a low amount, and am perfectly aware that the final offer is dependent on condition, but it was the evasiveness and refusal to give any indication of a value that got me. To be honest if they’d come straight out with a sum that was half the resale value I’d probably have taken it, as it’s the evasiveness cost the a sale and a future profit on my trade in.

Slightly OT so forgive me but sort of relevant - a couple of years ago my daughter was swapping her car and

needed to trade her Honda Civic in. After not getting much joy she contacted a couple of the car buying firms

regularly advertised everywhere.  One was a better quote, so we made an appointment, which the rep from the

firm was late for. Looked around it for ages, took it for a few miles drive and then offered her some £500 less

than his original offer ( despite the car being mint ). When asked why he just said that’s what his boss had 

decided / change in market prices ( in 2 days!) and thus wasted a lot of time for all of us.

We then went to ‘ We buy any car’ who were then exact opposite - their price was adhered to, quick decision

and payment within a few days. 
Moral being - shop around, don’t accept a reduced offer and if you can be arsed first try a private sale! 

[12stringbassist]

Their offer isn't a rip-off, it's just too low.

My local PMT have advised me in the past not to trade in with them, as they are forced to make lowball offers and have said I'd do better on Ebay or FB marketplace.

[Terry M.]

As has been said before,they offer you a price you don't like,move on and don't go to Trustpilot just for that. To answer your question,yes I've had a similar experience with PMT and I simply took my bass back into the car and drove home. They don't really want to deal with 2nd items in my experience based on the lowballing I've witnessed personally. They currently have a used Squier Vintage Modified Jazz Bass V on their website advertised as a Classic Vibe 70s and I'd expect them to know the difference based on their size and history. Also they're selling a used Gibson EB5 bass for £1,800 which has confused me seeing as they were sub £1k basses when new and not massively sought after even then.

[Supernaut]

Talk about throwing your toys out the pram!

 

Sell it on here, buy the Spector, use the left over cash to go on a marketing course. 

[SteveXFR]

It's not a rip off. They offered a price that makes the deal worthwhile to them. You weren't happy with the price so you decided not to take their offer.

No harm is done. No one got ripped off. Its all fine. 

[Dan Dare]

11 hours ago, Cosmo Valdemar said:

The "big" shops are never going to offer what you hope for. That's not a rip-off and honestly the idea if leaving a Trustpilot review because you took umbrage at a low trade offer is a massive overreaction. 

 

42 minutes ago, SteveXFR said:

It's not a rip off. They offered a price that makes the deal worthwhile to them. You weren't happy with the price so you decided not to take their offer.

No harm is done. No one got ripped off. Its all fine. 

 

The above. Shops are businesses. They need to pay the staff. keep the lights on, etc. They have to offer a guarantee on anything they sell. They are up against the online discounters. Everyone moans that shops are disappearing, but nobody wants to support them.

 

Nobody is forcing you to accept their offer. A low offer is usually a sign they don't really want something and hope you'll dispose of it elsewhere. If you want the convenience of not having to advertise it, show it to potential buyers and so on, you're going to have to pay for the privilege.

 

Think about it. It's about the worst time of year to sell musical instruments and luxury goods. Few people are spending in January. They're too busy trying to pay off the Christmas credit card bills. so the shop knows it's going to hang about and not do anything for their cash flow quickly.

 

Throwing a tantrum is a bit pathetic.

[prowla]

There's a saying: You make your money when you buy.

You might be able to get a shop to sell it on commission

[SteveXFR]

2 minutes ago, prowla said:

There's a saying: You make your money when you buy.

You might be able to get a shop to sell it on commission

 

Good advice. I did this with a difficult to sell car (massive V8, not American or German) and got several thousand pounds more than dealers offered for trade in.

[Mottlefeeder]

36 minutes ago, prowla said:

...You might be able to get a shop to sell it on commission...

My understanding, from the comments of an independent retailer, is that having stock you don't own on display improves your sales, and then you also get commission when you sell the stock that hasn't cost you anything.

 

If you are selling into a niche market, go to a specialist in that market and accept they will take a cut.

 

David

 

[Misdee]

  I think the O.P has been a bit naive, rather than petulant or unreasonable.

 

Anytime you ask a shop for part-ex, expect a derisory offer. As many others have expressed, shops are in business to make a profit, not to offer folks an easy and  convenient way of getting rid of unwanted equipment. They only want your castoffs for silly money, otherwise it's just not worth their while. 

 

I wouldn't even contemplate a p/x deal with a shop. If you've got decent quality items to offer a private sale is the only way to g, otherwise you'll be left sucking lemons.

 

The good news is there will always be a market for a legacy brand like Rickenbacker.  Be patient and sell it yourself for market value. It's so much easier nowadays with the internet ect than when you had to put a small ad in a magazine or local paper. Count your blessings and move on.

Edited Thursday at 10:33 by Misdee