Price difference between new and used

[SimonH]

Don't know if this is interesting, or usual, or maybe I don't buy enough basses (I mean, I've got 17, is that enough?) – but...

Fancied a short scale for some time – I've got a Squier Paranormal Rascal (daft name) & love the scale length – and playability, and sound, and look – but not so keen on its weight (it's basically a full-scale body). So I've been looking at Mustangs – the Squier and the Player II – and also at the used market (which is mostly the original Player series, or US or Japanese stuff out of my league). 

I've noticed on Fleabay, the prices asked for a used original Mustang Player are almost as high as a new Player II (Thomann prices) – and the new one has, I understand, several improvements (rolled edges, better p/ups). Is that normal? Does anyone actually buy gear at those prices? 

Which leads to my main point: if a bass costs, say, £570 new, what's the highest price you'd pay for a used previous (slightly inferior) model? For me, I'd expect to be paying something like £450 tops. Otherwise I might as well soak up the difference and get a new, slightly better, one. 

Is that about right, or what does anyone else think? Just be interested to know people's opinions. 
 

[Count Bassy]

Personally I would say £400 tops in the above situation.

[Ed_S]

Doesn't always work perfectly, but the quick calculation in my head is that I expect the offer when I sell current gear back to a shop to be about half the value of a new one, and that then represents two thirds of what they'll aim to sell it for. So if I'd bought a bass that retailed for £570 and wanted to move it on, I'd expect to be offered about £285 and then see it up for sale at £425-450 in the shop. Buying from a private seller, I'd be looking to split the difference between the shop buy-in and sale prices with them, probably two thirds in their favour, so if we take a mid-point of £435 that works out nicely to a difference of £150; an extra £100 for them, and £50 off for me. £385 would be my offer.

[SimonH]

Blimey, right, I'm going to pitch that a few times & see what happens 😉

[Len_derby]

For a private sale I’d expect 50-60% of the new price, both for selling and buying.

If the bass can no longer be bought new it gets less straightforward, fashion and general desirability come into play. I think one of the reasons the marketplace on Basschat appears turgid is that sellers are asking inflated prices. The Fender JMJ Mustang is a good case in point. 
I’ve never dealt with a shop to sell or buy a used bass, but what @Ed_S says sounds realistic.

[SumOne]

I think sellers sometimes go off RRP and that's possibly it is what they bought it for - but often there are shop reductions a year or so later (when they are also trying to sell second hand).

 

I'm eyeing up a new Ray34 that is £800 from one shop, RRP £1,200. Someone that bought one for £1,200 new would perhaps try to sell for about £800 after a year of owning it and they'd think that's fair enough, it is the average sort of price on eBay and Reverb. For me though, as a buyer it'd have to be quite a bit cheaper (£500 ish) for me to get a second hand one from eBay with all the risks associated and wear and tear etc vs £800 for a discounted brand new one from a shop with Warranty etc. 

 

 

Edited yesterday at 10:07 by SumOne

[Beedster]

People either hope for an impulsive buyer or expect to be haggled down, either way for a seller it always make sense to start high 👍

[itu]

I think (my opinion is purely subjective) that F-logo in the headstock means +20-40 % to the price, no matter how good or bad the instrument is. My choice is another - and qualitywise more even - manufacturer. Those so called vintage basses are already a joke to me: Leo's original idea was to make a very cheap instrument that is easy to assemble in a factory. And I don't like that surf aesthetics that much.

[TorturedSaints]

Bearing in mind that retail prices in a shop or for a business have the dreaded VAT (in the UK) to account for.  This complicates things for the secondhand basses in shops.  And, like new cars, the value of your bass drops by 20% as soon as you drive it off the forecourt, so to speak. My rule of thumb on eBay is 50% of RRP for most things unless there’s a scarcity factor involved. 

[Terry M.]

5 hours ago, itu said:

 Leo's original idea was to make a very cheap instrument that is easy to assemble in a factory. 

This is why I can't understand the prices of old Fenders. I've played a few in shops and it didn't help to clarify things for me at all. Everything definitely isn't for everyone. 

[SimonH]

I'm no expert but over the years I've been watching bass prices there's an enormous fashion/fad component – for some reason a particular style or model becomes popular and the asking price escalates. I've suffered myself, tempted to lump a few hundred quid on a bass on the sketchy basis someone else might think it's 'collectable' (never done it, though). 
 

I remember when you couldn't give a 1980s Ibanez away... now look at them. I mean, they are good – but there was a point in time when, because we all knew the name of the factory and it sounded clever, you sort of got this Matsumoku or Fujigen tax. Still do, I think. 

But anyway, thanks for input. It has to be a Mustang, I think – unless I just get a Sire U series instead. 

[Terry M.]

I'll go as far to suggest that the fascination of old beaten up gear has given rise to the relicing fad we're currently witnessing. A brand new (expensive) bass made to look battered also escapes my understanding. 

[SimonH]

Agreed, the relic thing is a bit mad. In my other passion, motorbikes, can't imagine paying a premium for a rusty chain or a rotting petrol tank. I mean, it'd great if that was the case because hey, don't have to clean it! If a bass has a genuine patina, fair enough. But to fake it... I dunno. Fender got it right with the Highway series – nitro finish so you can do your own real-time relic-ing just by looking at it the wrong way. Mine's beaten up already I've hardly used it live because it bloody weighs so much. 
 

[Beedster]

Just now, SimonH said:

Agreed, the relic thing is a bit mad. In my other passion, motorbikes, can't imagine paying a premium for a rusty chain or a rotting petrol tank. I mean, it'd great if that was the case because hey, don't have to clean it! If a bass has a genuine patina, fair enough. But to fake it... I dunno. Fender got it right with the Highway series – nitro finish so you can do your own real-time relic-ing just by looking at it the wrong way. Mine's beaten up already I've hardly used it live because it bloody weighs so much. 
 

Not just basses, also clothes, furniture, decor, even buildings. Crazy world 🤔

[SimonH]

Yes, it's pre-age everything that isn't functional – as far as I know, there's no market for relic-ed bass amps yet – although maybe flubby cones and scratchy pots will be a 'thing' soon. 

 

[Terry M.]

12 minutes ago, SimonH said:

Yes, it's pre-age everything that isn't functional – as far as I know, there's no market for relic-ed bass amps yet – although maybe flubby cones and scratchy pots will be a 'thing' soon. 

 

Hahaha some of the Ampeg B15s I've seen for sale look ready for the scrap heap. Not all of them to be fair 😂

[Beedster]

8 minutes ago, Terry M. said:

Hahaha some of the Ampeg B15s I've seen for sale look ready for the scrap heap. Not all of them to be fair 😂

That’s real wear though, not deliberate aging from new

[Terry M.]

3 minutes ago, Beedster said:

That’s real wear though, not deliberate aging from new

Absolutely true 👍 

[80Hz]

There's a chap on Gumtree (gonna be careful here, he might be a member? 😉) who has like 20-30 basses listed for sale at any one time, some lovely stuff and all looks to have been well taken care of. I've thought seriously about quite a few of them, but they're all priced too high imo. Reason this came to mind is, like the OP, Mustangs have caught my eye. This guy has a nice player series Mustang which was probably, what, £600 ish new? He's looking for £519, which at that price I'd rather plonk down for a new Player II in that Aquatone blue.

 

For me, as soon as I've decided to sell, it's priced to move. I'd rather make less and see an instrument being used and enjoyed rather than sitting around. And in the current market, it's either got to be special or cheap for me to buy.

[SimonH]

58 minutes ago, 80Hz said:

There's a chap on Gumtree (gonna be careful here, he might be a member? 😉) who has like 20-30 basses listed for sale at any one time, some lovely stuff and all looks to have been well taken care of. I've thought seriously about quite a few of them, but they're all priced too high imo. Reason this came to mind is, like the OP, Mustangs have caught my eye. This guy has a nice player series Mustang which was probably, what, £600 ish new? He's looking for £519, which at that price I'd rather plonk down for a new Player II in that Aquatone blue.

 

For me, as soon as I've decided to sell, it's priced to move. I'd rather make less and see an instrument being used and enjoyed rather than sitting around. And in the current market, it's either got to be special or cheap for me to buy.

Exactly this. Original Players with asking prices about £50 less, if that, than a new Player II. Call it £450 and maybe, right colour, mint, maybe. But asking £550+ for a Player when Thomann have a brand new Player II at £579...  I just wondered if it was me, or is it some sort of weird, gaslit, alt. reality. 

[80Hz]

17 minutes ago, SimonH said:

or is it some sort of weird, gaslit, alt. reality

 

Definitely weird alt reality 😆 and I think that goes for everything.

 

But folks, here we are, ready to rehome your sad unloved <£450 mint condition Player I Mustangs!

[Burns-bass]

9 hours ago, 80Hz said:

There's a chap on Gumtree (gonna be careful here, he might be a member? 😉) who has like 20-30 basses listed for sale at any one time, some lovely stuff and all looks to have been well taken care of. I've thought seriously about quite a few of them, but they're all priced too high imo. Reason this came to mind is, like the OP, Mustangs have caught my eye. This guy has a nice player series Mustang which was probably, what, £600 ish new? He's looking for £519, which at that price I'd rather plonk down for a new Player II in that Aquatone blue.

 

For me, as soon as I've decided to sell, it's priced to move. I'd rather make less and see an instrument being used and enjoyed rather than sitting around. And in the current market, it's either got to be special or cheap for me to buy.

Internet is full of mad chancers like this. I think they consider themselves “dealers” as it legitimises owning a shed load of gear.

[Jackroadkill]

9 hours ago, SimonH said:

weird, gaslit, alt. reality.

 

Isn't that Bjork's comeback album title?

[42Hz]

When I offer something for sale I consider what I would pay for the thing and and then add like 10-20% as most people will offer below the listed price no matter what. The level is 50-75% of new depending on condition and if the thing is going in and out of fashion.

I do see instrument kept up for sale for long period but at high prices - which may be a factor for why they don't sell. To me that seems strange. I am more an either/or person if I decide that I dont want an instrument it will be sold. I'd rather give it away than have it for sale for several years at an unrealistic price.

Edited 8 hours ago by 42Hz

[prowla]

I'd normally look to pay 1/2 to 2/3 of the new price for a used item in good condition.

I've seen some things offered for almost the same as new (eg. used item £325 + postage, new £354 inc VAT & free postage).