Price difference between new and used

[casapete]

9 minutes ago, prowla said:

I'd normally look to pay 1/2 to 2/3 of the new price for a used item in good condition.

I've seen some things offered for almost the same as new (eg. used item £325 + postage, new £354 inc VAT & free postage).

I’ve been watching Fender Rumble stuff on sale for a few weeks. Seen a couple of 210 cabs being 

advertised around the £300 mark, yet you can get a brand new one delivered for £339.

For the ‘saving’ of £39 I’d rather have a new unused cab, and more importantly one with a

manufacturer’s warranty, valid for at least a year ( or possibly more ). 
 

[tauzero]

3 hours ago, prowla said:

I'd normally look to pay 1/2 to 2/3 of the new price for a used item in good condition.

I've seen some things offered for almost the same as new (eg. used item £325 + postage, new £354 inc VAT & free postage).

 

And some things for more than new - Zoom MS-60B+, £125 used on Ebay, £109 new from PMT.

[Terry M.]

2 minutes ago, tauzero said:

 

And some things for more than new - Zoom MS-60B+, £125 used on Ebay, £109 new from PMT.

Wow that's crazy 😂

[Terry M.]

19 hours ago, SimonH said:

I'm no expert but over the years I've been watching bass prices there's an enormous fashion/fad component – for some reason a particular style or model becomes popular and the asking price escalates. I've suffered myself, tempted to lump a few hundred quid on a bass on the sketchy basis someone else might think it's 'collectable' (never done it, though). 
 

I remember when you couldn't give a 1980s Ibanez away... now look at them. I mean, they are good – but there was a point in time when, because we all knew the name of the factory and it sounded clever, you sort of got this Matsumoku or Fujigen tax. Still do, I think. 

But anyway, thanks for input. It has to be a Mustang, I think – unless I just get a Sire U series instead. 

I was told that it's collectors rather than actual players that have contributed to the rising prices of old gear. No idea if that's the case or not but it would make a degree of sense if so.

[Burns-bass]

3 hours ago, Terry M. said:

I was told that it's collectors rather than actual players that have contributed to the rising prices of old gear. No idea if that's the case or not but it would make a degree of sense if so.

I’m not sure there’s much of a difference. If you play guitar, you’re a player, etc.

[tauzero]

12 minutes ago, Burns-bass said:

I’m not sure there’s much of a difference. If you play guitar, you’re a player, etc.

 

But are they being bought to hang on the wall? If you play down the Tickled Trout on a Saturday, what's the maximum value of a bass that you'll take to play there? If you buy a £15k Precision, assuming you're in the weekend warrior category, are you likely to play it at the average gig?

[Terry M.]

1 hour ago, Burns-bass said:

I’m not sure there’s much of a difference. If you play guitar, you’re a player, etc.

A lot of "collectors" can't and don't play. It's for investment purposes. I've met individuals personally who don't play yet have quite a collection. How many art collectors can even draw a stick man? Hence why I said "actual" players.

Edited February 22 by Terry M.

[Sean]

Some interesting comments here.

 

50-66% of new price seems about right to me from what I've seen and based on what I'm reading. You lose 20% VAT as soon as you buy a new one.

 

I've been looking at some used examples of a specific model of bass on eBay. A new one is £2600 shipped from your "friends" in Warwick.

 

There are 6 on the list, same model, similar specs, same pups, preamp, varying condition, postage and seller fee included. The price is rounded to the nearest £ shipped to my door, what I need to pay. All sellers have 100% positive feedback except #5 with 96%. #4 has the best listing IMO. #6 is a trader.

 

1. 2018, stock, condition 9/10 @ £1995 (77%)

2. 2012, upgraded (nicely with official parts not aftermarket), condition 9/10 @ £1664 (64%)

3. 2004, stock, condition 7/10 (multiple cracks in the clearcoat) @£1843 (71%)

4. 2005, stock, condition 8.5/10 @ £1333 (51%) **Sold 3/3/25 20:45**

5. 2010, stock, condition 8.5/10 @ £1894 (73%)

6. 2008, stock, condition 9.5/10 @ £2429 (93%)

 

None of them are limited edition, collectable or have a gold brittania in the cavity.  I've deliberately not said what make and model to try to get the focus on the data.  Those that know, will know, YFKI.

 

What do we think of this spread?

Edited Monday at 21:28 by Sean

[Len_derby]

I agree with you @Sean, that 50-66% of new price is a reasonable second-hand  price. I think that sometimes items go up on sale at high prices in the hope of attracting unaware or inexperienced buyer. I know we should say ‘buyer beware’ and expect people do research. But, maybe I’m naive and idealistic, it’s not something I’d like to see on this great forum.

We should, I think, also be aware of the demographic of Basschat. A lot of Boomer males who are selling things not because they need the money, but because they want to buy something else or are de-cluttering.

[Sean]

3 minutes ago, Len_derby said:

I agree with you @Sean, that 50-66% of new price is a reasonable second-hand  price. I think that sometimes items go up on sale at high prices in the hope of attracting unaware or inexperienced buyer. I know we should say ‘buyer beware’ and expect people do research. But, maybe I’m naive and idealistic, it’s not something I’d like to see on this great forum.

We should, I think, also be aware of the demographic of Basschat. A lot of Boomer males who are selling things not because they need the money, but because they want to buy something else or are de-cluttering.

Do you think that the boomers selling drive the market price up or down? Obviously,  they have no worries about slow moving stock, so are they pushing the prices up because they are more flexible or driving them down because they want a quick deal?

 

[Len_derby]

5 minutes ago, Sean said:

Do you think that the boomers selling drive the market price up or down? Obviously,  they have no worries about slow moving stock, so are they pushing the prices up because they are more flexible or driving them down because they want a quick deal?

 

I’m not sure, it’ll be interesting to get other opinions. Whatever, the for sale threads on here are very sluggish.

[Sean]

17 minutes ago, Len_derby said:

I’m not sure, it’ll be interesting to get other opinions. Whatever, the for sale threads on here are very sluggish.

100% agreed. My '21 G&L Tribute JB1 has been hanging around at 40ish% of a new one for over 2 months. I've got studio speakers for peanuts, no one wants them.  I've never seen it so slow.

[Mykesbass]

41 minutes ago, Sean said:

100% agreed. My '21 G&L Tribute JB1 has been hanging around at 40ish% of a new one for over 2 months. I've got studio speakers for peanuts, no one wants them.  I've never seen it so slow.

G&L is an interesting case. Always been a bit of a niche brand, and a couple of years back there was a massive retail sell off of Tribute models, which has probably had an effect on their perceived value. Glad I'm hanging on to mine.

[Sean]

24 minutes ago, Mykesbass said:

G&L is an interesting case. Always been a bit of a niche brand, and a couple of years back there was a massive retail sell off of Tribute models, which has probably had an effect on their perceived value. Glad I'm hanging on to mine.

I missed out on that sell-off. Mine is a classic case of clearing out and creating space. Sire has emerged as ultra competitive, roasted necks are now standard on lower mid-price basses, things are changing.

[Sean]

On 22/02/2025 at 17:05, tauzero said:

 

But are they being bought to hang on the wall? If you play down the Tickled Trout on a Saturday, what's the maximum value of a bass that you'll take to play there? If you buy a £15k Precision, assuming you're in the weekend warrior category, are you likely to play it at the average gig?

Have you got the contact details of the landlord at that Tickled Trout? We're desperate for a booking at the moment? 😉

[80Hz]

Interesting data. It's a little difficult to generalise from, but it does show neatly how most of listings are above the consensus on where used prices "should" be, and shocker, the one which did has sold.

 

Date of build doesn't seem to make much difference, condition seems to be more important. Sounds logical enough.

 

Your point on listing quality is a good one. Anything with an AI auto-generated description is a pass for me - it screams low effort.

 

So price, condition, and listing quality may have to align for a successful sale, unless it's something unique.

[HeadlessBassist]

I think inflation probably catches us all out with time passing. I remember looking at new American Deluxe Fenders in 2010 that cost around £1200. I recently gave a similar amount for a pristine 2004 American Deluxe. At the end of the day, I think it's really down to whether you love the sound of any particular bass and how it feels in your hands. If it plays like a dream and sounds fantastic to your ears, it's worth the asking price if you can afford it. Used prices are always rising to match the rise in new prices anyway, so it's all relative.

[Terry M.]

11 hours ago, Sean said:

100% agreed. My '21 G&L Tribute JB1 has been hanging around at 40ish% of a new one for over 2 months. I've got studio speakers for peanuts, no one wants them.  I've never seen it so slow.

It's like a very pronounced stand-off between sellers and buyers but someone has to give in eventually. I think the lower end of the market is experiencing a golden age with regards to pound for pound performance which might not be helping matters. 

[knirirr]

On 21/02/2025 at 00:18, Ed_S said:

Doesn't always work perfectly, but the quick calculation in my head is that I expect the offer when I sell current gear back to a shop to be about half the value of a new one, and that then represents two thirds of what they'll aim to sell it for. So if I'd bought a bass that retailed for £570 and wanted to move it on, I'd expect to be offered about £285 and then see it up for sale at £425-450 in the shop. Buying from a private seller, I'd be looking to split the difference between the shop buy-in and sale prices with them, probably two thirds in their favour, so if we take a mid-point of £435 that works out nicely to a difference of £150; an extra £100 for them, and £50 off for me. £385 would be my offer.

 

Thanks, this is useful.
Something I wondered about - would you take into account any work done on the instrument? For example , if you'd bought that £570 bass and then had to spend £100 getting the frets properly filed down. I'd guess that this is simply a hit the original purchaser would be expected to absorb, though.

[prowla]

3 minutes ago, knirirr said:

 

Thanks, this is useful.
Something I wondered about - would you take into account any work done on the instrument? For example , if you'd bought that £570 bass and then had to spend £100 getting the frets properly filed down. I'd guess that this is simply a hit the original purchaser would be expected to absorb, though.

The old "it owes me..." assertion.

[knirirr]

1 hour ago, prowla said:

The old "it owes me..." assertion.

 

What's that? It's not something I'd heard of.

[Sean]

59 minutes ago, knirirr said:

 

Thanks, this is useful.
Something I wondered about - would you take into account any work done on the instrument? For example , if you'd bought that £570 bass and then had to spend £100 getting the frets properly filed down. I'd guess that this is simply a hit the original purchaser would be expected to absorb, though.

It depends!

 

My JB1 has had some work on it, fret job, set up, copper-lined cavity, upgraded electrics. IMO, no, that doesn't command a higher price. It might give me some edge over another seller.

 

One of the 6 on the analysis list I made had some lovely upgrades done with OEM parts but IMO, it was no longer original and £300 of upgrades probably translated to £100 uplift in price.

 

I have an Ibanez SRMS805 (former BC bike) with US Barts, US Bart preamp, reconfigured switching. These upgrades (~£550-600 with parts and luthier labour) transform it into a "pro" level piece of kit but I paid maybe £50 more than a stock one on the used market.

 

The G&L L2000 I recently sold had an East preamp MMSR, fret level, crown, set up at Shuker and all new wiring. It sold for peanuts. I took the Xtender off for the sale as I knew that wouldn't add value and I could sell it here as an accessory.

 

So, in a nutshell, mods tend to either benefit the buyer or in the case where they are irreversible, can drive the value down.

 

If I found a lovely Spector Euro that someone had put US Barts in and a Bart or Aguilar pre, then it would have to be an absolute steal as I'd have to convert it back to EMGs. If that bass had been routed to accommodate, say an MM-style pickup, to me it's now either firewood or a trip to Jon Shuker for major surgery and the price should reflect that.

[Sean]

26 minutes ago, knirirr said:

 

What's that? It's not something I'd heard of.

It's kind of like Sunk Cost Fallacy.

 

Take my SRMS mentioned just earlier. £1000 retail + £600 mods/upgrades.

 

Seller calculates used price based on £1k + £600 = £1600 (what he paid) then used price calculated @ 65% = £1k. Because "it owes me £600" or £400 depreciated.

 

Realistically, it's a £600-700 bass on the used market. £500 trade-in.

 

 

Edited Tuesday at 10:27 by Sean

[Sean]

My general rule of thumb is, get the aftermarket hardware out and the original stuff back in before you sell it.

 

Obviously, if you've sold the original bits, then you can't, or in the case of preamps, rewiring, upgraded pots, copper cavity, fret work, where either it can't be undone or the cost/time of undoing would be prohibitive, then you just do your best to make them work in your favour and try to convince the buyer that they add real value.

 

There's also brand-specific expectation. It's reasonable to expect a Fender or Squier to have had upgrades and I believe many of these either bump the price up a little, like a Lindy Fralin P pickup or they give you differentiation against other sellers and something to negotiate with.

 

With say a US or Euro Spector, I want stock, please.  I'll ask a seller for a photo of inside the cavity as part of my due diligence. It's a big ticket item, I'm looking under the bonnet first.  I did it yesterday when doing the price analysis. A completely unmolested, functioning set of electrics, as they left the factory, on a 20 year old high-end instrument adds more value for me than a DIY installation of an expensive Darkglass or Aguilar unit.

 

 

[Ed_S]

41 minutes ago, knirirr said:

 

Thanks, this is useful.
Something I wondered about - would you take into account any work done on the instrument? For example , if you'd bought that £570 bass and then had to spend £100 getting the frets properly filed down. I'd guess that this is simply a hit the original purchaser would be expected to absorb, though.

 

If it's still possible to go out and get a new one that you'd expect to be perfect and not need the work, or if it's no longer available new but you'd expect the vast majority of second hand ones never to have needed the work, then no, I'd say that's on the seller for electing to keep and fix a b-stock, rather than swap out for a different one.

 

Nothing against anyone who does that, btw.. as long as they realise that it's rarely an investment. I've done it myself - for example keeping an unusually light example of a bass with really attractive wood grain patterns but a knackered preamp because a swap could easily turn up as a boring-looking boat-anchor of an instrument, but with a functional preamp. I knew the money for a new preamp was never going to be recouped, and I was fine with that.

 

I broadly agree with the 'what it owes me' comments, though I do use the phrase when talking generally about what a project has cost in total. If I ever use it when it's time to sell, I switch to a different version which involves completely writing-off the initial purchase price of anything I buy as a modding platform or fixer-upper, and then not spending any more on parts than I'm confident I can sell the whole thing for once completed, unless I'm willing to lose the additional outlay. That's perhaps just a me-thing, though!