Distortion that keeps the 'thump'?

[SumOne]

I'm looking for a medium-gain sort of distortion that still keeps the punchy 'thump' of a clean Bass when played through an Amp/Cab.

 

I'm pretty sure I already know the answer is 'pedal with clean blend' and 'use an LS-2'.  Problem with that is I find it sounds like two things playing at the same time.

 

Any suggestions? 

 

I'm almost at the point of giving up on it. The band has 2x guitarists guitarist and it feels that when we go to more heavy/distorted parts of songs it'd be good for the Bass to switch up to to a distorted sound as the guitarists do. Problem is, I've tried dozens of distortion pedals and they sound fine at home/headphones etc but with a band I think just the nature of distortion means the punchy sort of thump gets mushy and distorted (I guess the clue is in the name!)  - in isolation that sounds all good and heavy, but with a band all going for it it actually loses some impact. Perhaps just stick to the punchy thump of bass and leave it to guit@ri$ts to the distortion stuff?

 

 

[Stofferson]

Few ones I've used which in my opinion do as you have described sir

 

https://www.moosetwentythree.com/shop/dobsky - not necessarily a distortion but with the tonal options can certainly do it and more

https://ashdownmusic.com/products/pro-fx-double-shot - with separate eq and gain for bass and treble can get a nice deep low end and a grindy top end.

https://joespedals.com/collections/pedals/products/mbd-mosfet-bass-distortion - great array of tones plus solid low end.

https://www.ehx.com/products/bass-soul-food/ - can be quite light, all important clean blend.

https://lusithanddevices.com/product/ground-pound-mkii/ - had the first one, mild 2:1 comp on the clean really solidifies the low end, and distortion can go from mild to full bstard, cant comment on the latest model though.

if you can find a COG knightfall of TKx, again, sweet clean blend and varying levels of drive

 

I'm currently using an origin DCX bass, no clean blend but eq is huge, and keep a huge low end and can get a really nice saturation to help those loud moments.

 

[tayste_2000]

27 minutes ago, SumOne said:

I'm looking for a medium-gain sort of distortion that still keeps the punchy 'thump' of a clean Bass when played through an Amp/Cab.

 

I'm pretty sure I already know the answer is 'pedal with clean blend' and 'use an LS-2'.  Problem with that is I find it sounds like two things playing at the same time.

 

Any suggestions? 

 

I'm almost at the point of giving up on it. The band has 2x guitarists guitarist and it feels that when we go to more heavy/distorted parts of songs it'd be good for the Bass to switch up to to a distorted sound as the guitarists do. Problem is, I've tried dozens of distortion pedals and they sound fine at home/headphones etc but with a band I think just the nature of distortion means the punchy sort of thump gets mushy and distorted (I guess the clue is in the name!)  - in isolation that sounds all good and heavy, but with a band all going for it it actually loses some impact. Perhaps just stick to the punchy thump of bass and leave it to guit@ri$ts to the distortion stuff?

 

 

 

Can relate to you massively on this. I found my solution to be an IR loader (obviously still need the distortion pedal and really you do still want the blend on it), or at least for picking my sound for live use.

 

So I recently got a Darkglass Element and it’s been an absolute revelation. I spent a while finding an IR and eq that gave me the sound I try and get out of preamp (which is just me rolling quite a lot of highs) and I’ve ended up with 2-3 settings where the “clean” sounds pretty much the same across all of them but any distortion is wildly different depending on how much high the cab is allow.

 

So this would be my first recommendation, I think the Element is incredible, I now own two and it’s my di, IEM mixer, IR loader, eq, practice headphone rig, etc etc, so using something like that to dial in the sound at home through headphones. Then I would look at something like the Kasleder Albatross, Lusithand Ground and Pound or Backburner Big Booty Judy

 

https://kaslederfx.com/albatross/

https://bassbros.co.uk/product/lusithand-alma-comp-mkii/ - Though you may want the newer model

https://backburnernoise.com/products/big-booty-judy

 

The latter two are both rat clones, which I’ve really started to appreciate in the mix with my JHS Punchline, but it has to have the clean blend and it has to run into some sort of cab simulation for me to dial it in.

[SumOne]

18 minutes ago, Stofferson said:

 

 

I'm currently using an origin DCX bass, no clean blend but eq is huge, and keep a huge low end and can get a really nice saturation to help those loud moments.

 

 

Yeah, I recently got one and it is really good for that. My only issue is I use it as 'always on' for the lower-gain EQ mode and I need to stomp somethign on for a few more distorted parts. Another DCX would do nicely...don't think I can justify that extravagance though! 

[tayste_2000]

Just now, SumOne said:

 

Yeah, I recently got one and it is really good for that. My only issue is I use it as 'always on' for the lower-gain EQ mode and I need to stomp somethign on for a few more distorted parts. Another DCX would do nicely...don't think I can justify that extravagance though! 

 

Sure you can 😇

[fretmeister]

The blend thing sounds like 2 because of different decay rates of each side. The drive part is being compressed a lot, and the clean isn't.

 

Before clean blends on pedals were a thing I used the LS-2 and always had a compressor on the clean side and fiddled with the settings to get the decay of both sides to be the same. That being said, if you have a super clean low and really driven top then it will always sound like 2 sounds. They need to be closer in tonality really.

 

I don't use a lot of drive these days, but I often found that the punch would stay with quite a nasal, almost farty drive with tons of mids. This sort of sound is horrible at home or on its own, but works great with other instruments. The Catalinbread SFT does it very nicely, (I should not have sold mine), and currently I have a £35 clone of the Fairfield Barbershop (mk2) that adds a similar thing.

 

Generally I'm not a fan of turning bass drive on and off during a song as with a bass it always seems to need pretty big EQ changes at the same time, so I prefer to leave it on for the whole song of it needs it.

[Al Krow]

GT1000 Core

Parallel path

Job done (again 😅)

[dudewheresmybass]

I use the EHX bass soul food most of the time, which does exactly this. 

I don't go overboard on the gain, but the blend helps it 'sing' in context and I feel that this is a key ingredient of my "3d" sound

[Rollin Thunder]

Anything by jam pedals for bass all good, all have blend control and extra gain stage. I have a Lucy daydreamer get all the sounds you want out of that. Also love my littler surfing bear bass drive, no blend but keeps all the low end up to really high gain, and then it doesn’t lose much low end.

 

 

 

[SumOne]

2 hours ago, Al Krow said:

GT1000 Core

Parallel path

Job done (again 😅)

I can't get one a third time!

 

 

 

......or can I?! 🤨

[MrDinsdale]

If you end up getting an MBD and don't like it ill probably take it off you 🤣

[tempo]

I have a Laney Blackheath that can do that. I have recently acquired a Boss GT core (which is great), but have the Blackheath in one of the loops as it's that good for that clean/dirty sound without the "darkglass" separated type effect.

[Al Krow]

22 hours ago, SumOne said:

I can't get one a third time!

 

 

 

......or can I?! 🤨

 

I've tried soooo many dirt / drive pedals over the years (like many other BC'ers!) and currently have a collection of 6 or 7.

Within a couple of weeks of starting to get to grips with the GT Core, I found a couple of dirt/clean blend tones that was a ton better than anything I had got on my much loved Zoom B1-4 and, for my own tastes, better than my current dirt pedal collection which I need to get around to moving on at some point!

An unexpected / welcome surprise! The Core's not the bees knees at pitch shift though!

 

Edited Saturday at 16:19 by Al Krow

[krispn]

I’ve found that my comp pedal added the thump. I’m using a Basswitch comp but the cheapie GLx Boss clone for £40 on amazon or the Boss LMB has a knack of doing something with the lows or low mids (don’t like the enhance knob) which takes a drive and can add in some really nice oomph/thump.
 

Rodney McGee (I think) on YouTube had a video about adding comp to drive to get more out of it and while not my inspiration it’s certainly something I’ve found to be useful and doesn’t have to be an expensive addition to a board. 

[SumOne]

1 hour ago, krispn said:

I’ve found that my comp pedal added the thump. I’m using a Basswitch comp but the cheapie GLx Boss clone for £40 on amazon or the Boss LMB has a knack of doing something with the lows or low mids (don’t like the enhance knob) which takes a drive and can add in some really nice oomph/thump.
 

Rodney McGee (I think) on YouTube had a video about adding comp to drive to get more out of it and while not my inspiration it’s certainly something I’ve found to be useful and doesn’t have to be an expensive addition to a board. 

I think compression and where it is in the chain might be a good call.

 

I currently have an idiotbox blower box and there is no problem with the amount of bass it can produce - it's more that the defined 'thump' is lost and that seems to happen with almost all distortion I've tried.

 

So yeah, perhaps it is something that the right compression after distortion can sort out, or a blend and changing the clean compression.  I've tried so many distortions and it seems the same thing always once playing through Amp/cab and with a band, so I'm starting to think it isn't actually the distortion pedal as such - it's down to something else.

[Stofferson]

One thing that absolutely makes all my fuzzes/distortions is sansamp at the end of the chain, that analogue cab sim just makes everything sound like it should as opposed to a bag of wasps etc 🤣

[BEADist]

For me 'blending' only works if the clean path has a LPF and the filthy path has a HPF in front. In stompbox-domain that's a lot of pedals for a distortion sound (... so yeah, Boss GT Core : )

 

By the way, to me the X-Bass distortion on there is quite good. I played in a loud sludge band and from the distortions I tried (several blended options and also Darkglass pedals) this X-Bass was absolutely the easiest to fit into a mix and without loosing 'thumb' (if by that you mean the low frequency portion of the attack, the part that differentiates loud bass and loud guitar). On it's own it sounds a bit boring, not spectacular at all. Because of this it took me a long time to actually try this one.

 

Good luck with your endless search, do not give up, do not leave the distortion to the guit@ri$ts !!! 😃

(certainly in recordings there will be distortion on the bass to get a huge sound ?!)

 

 

[uncle psychosis]

I've still to find a bass overdrive I like as much as the zvex basstortion.

 

It's really rather good.

[SumOne]

I came to the conclusion of distortion not really adding the extra oomph that I want on a gig this Saturday and ended up not using it.

 

Playing at loud volume through an Amp/Cab and along with drums, 2x distorted guitars and the rest the main thing the bass needs in this band at those rowdy points is a clear pulse/thump/definition of notes within that I guess <400Hz sort of range. The rowdy parts of songs have the guitars going distorted, if I also click on distortion it just makes the fundamental thump of the bass get more mushy and distorted and actually loses impact, it adds mid/high distorted noise - but they are lost in with the guitars. Can turn up the bass but that doesn't bring back the 'tump'. In isolation it sounds big and heavy, but I think almost by definition it looses that when distorted.

 

So yeah, I think it might well be more of an issue of where the compression is, what is going on with my Amp/Cab and the mix with the rest of the band rather than needing new distortion pedals.

 

 

[bassbora]

I have been using Jam Pedals for this very task.  I am not a fan of distorted or overdriven bass sounds and in isolation (at home) I just dont like it.  But as you describe I have found myself lost in the mix in certain scenarios when playing live (not sure what it sounds like with a sound man in a mix when I have played in those type of venues).  I started trying out couple of pedals for this and I was just happy with Lucydreamer and Rattler.  I use them in three different bands (two different pedal boards) gain is quite low, tone more open and I use the mix a bit.  It has helped greatly to cut through.  I would not have the gain high I think that would just add to the overall mush as you describe.  I dont really spend much time buying and selling gear so I just settled on these without looking further.  This is of course personal to my playing style, the other gear I play and the overall sound of the bands.

 

I guess you could probably achieve similar results with EQ pedal or a compressor.

[Bolo]

Try very clean, hifi-like bass when the guitars go distorted and a bit of overdrive on the others bits. This helps give the rowdy parts extra dynamics and sits the bass better in the mix for the rest of the songs. 

 

Sounds counterintuitive but works a treat!

 

 

Edited Monday at 17:06 by Bolo
too many dynamics

[SimonK]

I know it's cheap and cheerful but the "normal" setting on an EHX bass big muff works for me - used it over the weekend and was very happy that both dirt was added and the bottom end presence was still there (albeit I only use it on a couple of songs so wouldn't call myself a connoisseur of driven bass sounds).

 

Simon

 

[Rodders]

I'd recommend the Rodenberg LDP or LDP Deluxe, it has a "Deep" switch which is useful, I bring it in and out dependent on the song and or band line up.

[tayste_2000]

Gonna throw out an alternative here.
 

Use a light overdrive with a slight volume dip for the main sound and then turn it off for the parts you’re thinking would suit the distortion. The jump in volume and fullness of signal might cut quite nicely 🤷🏻‍♂️ 

 

Might be what you need is a phat clean in those moments and you can get away with quite a lot of saturation the rest of the time smoothing out that sound.

[SumOne]

Cheers all. As I've been through dozens of distortion pedals and always come to the same sort of conclusion I think before buying anything new I'm going to try some of the suggestions like using clean for the rowdier bits, perhaps moving about where I have compression,  and possibly it is something to do with my Amp/Cab (or at least the EQ I have on the Amp) as they have remained constant while I keep swopping distortion pedals - they sound good clean, but perhaps need something different going on when it's distortion time (e.g. distortion in the fx loop).

 

There is probably an element of the fact I'm stood right in front of the cab when playing live with the band - so what I'm hearing in those rowdy parts is a mix of that and the stage monitors, the audience might actually hear something quite different (I only have crappy phone recordings of that so can't really tell).

 

I do think it is something other than 'use pedal XYZ' or 'use a clean blend'.

Edited Tuesday at 10:03 by SumOne