Has any Song Totally Defeated You?

[BigAlonBass]

"Burn" by a 'version' of Deep Purple. I think the annoying, exaggerated Mockney Accents stopped me being able to concentrate fully on the changes, and the stop/start construction of the song. (which seemed to follow NO discernible construct)

I was so chuffed when Arthritis and Raynauds knocked on my door, and I had to retire, knowing I would never have to play it again...

[thodrik]

2 hours ago, SteveXFR said:

 

If you ever get the chance to see them live, do it. They're really entertaining and brilliant performers plus Jeff Matz bass is even better live than on the records

I think I missed them in Glasgow when they first toured the UK but haven't caught them since. They are on the list. I love Jeff Matz in general too and have seen High on Fire probably about 6 times going back to about 2005 which I think was before Matz even joined the band (I dunno, I was about 18 and probably drunk).

[SteveXFR]

34 minutes ago, thodrik said:

I think I missed them in Glasgow when they first toured the UK but haven't caught them since. They are on the list. I love Jeff Matz in general too and have seen High on Fire probably about 6 times going back to about 2005 which I think was before Matz even joined the band (I dunno, I was about 18 and probably drunk).

 

If you're a Jeff Matz fan, it's worth looking up his Facebook page. He offers online bass lessons. I was going to book some for my daughter for her birthday. 

[thodrik]

2 minutes ago, SteveXFR said:

 

If you're a Jeff Matz fan, it's worth looking up his Facebook page. He offers online bass lessons. I was going to book some for my daughter for her birthday. 

My nephew got a lesson with him the other month! He said it was really good fun and worthwhile and that Jeff is a very cool guy. 

[Hobbayne]

I really struggle to get the timing right on the intro to Sex On Fire. I can never come in at the right time. The bassline itself is simple enough, its the timing that throws me off. 

 

[AlexDelores]

6 hours ago, Rodders said:

I Want You Back - Jackson 5, one of my favourites but as hard as I tried, slowing it down bit by bit etc, I could never get it up to the speed of the track..

I was just thinking of this song. I’m fine with 90% of it but my brain goes into meltdown on the Middle8. 
 

I can limp my way through but the alternating triads really make my head hurt trying to keep the feel and remembering the changes.

[NancyJohnson]

While a lot of people may define defeatism as something that John Myung might record, insofar as a body of work goes, there's a post-hardcore/alternative band called Shudder To Think where, despite every song being less than four minutes, there's a ton of stuff going on; bizzaro key changes, timing changes, guitars all over the place with a falsetto vocal capping it off.

 

Because things don't come across as being particularly cohesive, it's difficult to simply noodle along to if you have a bass to hand.

 

 

 

 

 

[JapanAxe]

17 hours ago, Hobbayne said:

I really struggle to get the timing right on the intro to Sex On Fire. I can never come in at the right time. The bassline itself is simple enough, its the timing that throws me off. 

 

You and most cover bands then! When I play it on skinny-string guitar I find the trick is to count the drummer in. The first guitar note is on beat 4 but most people seem to hear it as the back of 4.

 

One of the ways I work on improving my bass playing is to keep a folder of dots for numbers I struggle with. Now and then I have a bash at one of them. It currently contains:

Highway Star

Hysteria

Master Blaster

New Born

Son of a Preacher Man

Edited April 2 by JapanAxe

[LowB_FTW]

Thank you all for not making me feel like a failure!

I may go back to the song that prompted this thread at some point, but not this week.

Thank you all for your input so far.

 

Mark

[fergs40]

On 30/03/2025 at 21:12, Grooverjr said:

Rhythm Stick I can get at 102bpm now but 104 is just that bit too fast. Funny how that small difference is enough to throw me.  Same with Teen Town, but the difference is more like 20bpm. I still enjoy playing it as an exercise. Chemtrails by Beck is the one that just twists me too much. Too much pick work and remembering stuff!

Yes!! I can get up to somewhere between 95 and 100 bpm on Rhythm Stick depending on the day. And I feel like a bass god! I enjoy playing this bass line, I completely appreciate its genius. And then I try to play along with the track, and curse my stupid clay feet…

Edited April 3 by fergs40
Wasn’t clear enough about the comparison I was making

[Si600]

Does having given up because it's not a song I like count as being defeated?  In that case Gold Dust Woman by Fleetwood Mac.  I'm sure I could learn to play it if I absolutely had to, but I found it incredibly meh as a song.

[Stub Mandrel]

Papa Was A Rolling Stone.

 

I hate counting but trying to do it by feel is soooo hard.

[chris_b]

2 minutes ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Papa Was A Rolling Stone.

 

I hate counting but trying to do it by feel is soooo hard.

 

There’s a Temptations version that is over 11 mins. You can't count that. You gotta play by feel.

[Lozz196]

Or go to the bar if there’s a solo in it

[thebrig]

19 hours ago, Stub Mandrel said:

Papa Was A Rolling Stone.

 

I hate counting but trying to do it by feel is soooo hard.

Apparently, when producer Norman Whitfield asked Jamerson to just keep repeating the Bass line, Jamerson got up and walked out of the session

[JapanAxe]

On 04/04/2025 at 00:44, fergs40 said:

Yes!! I can get up to somewhere between 95 and 100 bpm on Rhythm Stick depending on the day. And I feel like a bass god! I enjoy playing this bass line, I completely appreciate its genius. And then I try to play along with the track, and curse my stupid clay feet…

I’ve seen some discussion that Rhythm Stick was originally recorded a semitone lower but the pitch was raised by speeding the tape up. It would be a lot easier if the open E string were available. Not sure whether anyone has asked Norman about it.

[fergs40]

15 hours ago, JapanAxe said:

I’ve seen some discussion that Rhythm Stick was originally recorded a semitone lower but the pitch was raised by speeding the tape up. It would be a lot easier if the open E string were available. Not sure whether anyone has asked Norman about it.

I would love to believe that some studio trickery was employed and that Mr Watt-Roy’s efforts were ‘assisted’. But this video suggests maybe not:

 

 

Back to the metronome…

[Reggaebass]

24 minutes ago, fergs40 said:

I would love to believe that some studio trickery was employed and that Mr Watt-Roy’s efforts were ‘assisted’. But this video suggests maybe not:

 

 

Back to the metronome…

I saw them many years ago in my youth with a friend who was a big fan, from what I can remember he was playing it just as in that video, very fast player 

[Stub Mandrel]

1 hour ago, Reggaebass said:

I saw them many years ago in my youth with a friend who was a big fan, from what I can remember he was playing it just as in that video, very fast player 

 

I dont know if he could sustain that speed now but he's still a fast and articulate player when he unwinds.

[Bilbo]

I think that everything is playable, it's just a question of how long you are prepared to spend on it. Jaco took 9 years to nail Donna Lee. I gave up on HMWYRS because I decided the time would be better spent on other things. 

 

There is a tasty Al Di Meola guitar part on Suite: Golden Dawn from his first solo album. Impossible. It took me 30 years but I got there!! It's a question of how much you are willing to invest to get the thing nailed.

[Bilbo]

Just remembered one I can never quite pull off. Daryl Jones part on the John Schofield tune 'Techno'.

Can't make it sit right.

 

 

[diskwave]

'You To Me Are Everything' by the 'The Real Thing'. A testy little ditty if there ever was one. Remember one summer season.. Full band, horns, B/vox the works and they wanted the bass up high.....Some tunes really make you earn ur money.

[FretsOnFire]

Reading this thread gives me relief that I'm not a useless bass player when I struggle on certain songs 😁

[itu]

MM starts his solo @ 2.50. I didn't make it when my teacher gave it to me 30 years ago.

 

 

[casapete]

On 13/04/2025 at 13:39, diskwave said:

'You To Me Are Everything' by the 'The Real Thing'. A testy little ditty if there ever was one. Remember one summer season.. Full band, horns, B/vox the works and they wanted the bass up high.....Some tunes really make you earn ur money.

Great tune / bassline. Their follow up single ‘Can’t get by without’ had a similar and arguably

better bass part too.