Hot Tub Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 There's a few people who have said that their biggest regret is not playing with other people. Not just on the "Regrets" thread, but it's a subject which does come up on here from time to time. I certainly fall into that category. Never done it and don't have the confidence to do it - ESPECIALLY not with an audience! So, my idea is this: Would it be possible to set up groups (I'm thinking facebook here) where us talentless cowards could put in details of what we're looking for, and arrange some sort of jam sessions? For example, this is what would probably do it for me: 25 mile radius of Leamington Spa Trad. rock/blues, 60s/70s/early 80s Would like similar age(s) or older - say, 40 up Ambition and volume more important that talent and ability Only for gig-virgins! If you've warmed up a stadium for U2, I don't want to meet you. Whaddya'll think? Or, does something like this already exist? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bythesea Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Sounds like a good idea, though I don't think you want to restrict it to "gig-virgins" totally. What about those who played in bands in their teens and have come back to it a little later in life? ;p I would also have to find out what this "facebook" is all about as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Tub Posted June 25, 2009 Author Share Posted June 25, 2009 [quote name='bythesea' post='524150' date='Jun 25 2009, 09:51 PM']What about those who played in bands in their teens and have come back to it a little later in life? ;p[/quote] I take your point. But the issue I'm hoping to address is of those who (like myself) have NEVER had the confidence to do it. For whatever reason; whether you don't think you're good enough technically, or the thought of an audience scares you sh!tless, etc. If you've already done it, at any age, then you don't have an issue, and the sort of group I'm envisaging would be of no use to you. In fact, someone with live experience joining such a group would most likely put other people off, and so be totally counterproductive. But thank-you for your feedback! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deaver Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Not your neck of the woods I know but it might be useful for others. Route 36 Rehearsal Studio just outside Salisbury runs a 'Rockschool for Relics' which is at aimed at people like yourself. Might be worth looking around for something similar round your way. I had a 22 year break from gigging - there's less to fear than you might think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerdragon Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Hot tub. can i ask why you think you dont have the confidence to play in front of people. have you ever tried. its not hard believe me. i have seen some right plonkers who thought they were John Entwistle, i dont know all the facts obviously but there are people on here who could give you advice and help aplenty. thats if you want to be in a band. if you like playing bass, next step let other people hear you. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Tub Posted June 25, 2009 Author Share Posted June 25, 2009 [quote name='deaver' post='524169' date='Jun 25 2009, 10:16 PM']Route 36 Rehearsal Studio just outside Salisbury runs a 'Rockschool for Relics'[/quote] Gonna have a look at that - cheers! Maybe there are similar things happening around the country - I don't know...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonybassplayer Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Good idea however I was in my early forties and following three years of playing wanted to play "live" for the first time. The group of guys I was practising with were all in the same boat and we were very unsure ( and quite frankly petrified ) as to how we could do our first gig. Along came a really nice guy on guitar with years of experience who nurtured us and two months later we played at a jam night followed by out first gig the week after. Having just one experienced guy in the band made all the difference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hot Tub Posted June 25, 2009 Author Share Posted June 25, 2009 [quote name='beerdragon' post='524172' date='Jun 25 2009, 10:19 PM']Hot tub. can i ask why you think you dont have the confidence to play in front of people. have you ever tried. its not hard believe me. i have seen some right plonkers who thought they were John Entwistle, i dont know all the facts obviously but there are people on here who could give you advice and help aplenty. thats if you want to be in a band. if you like playing bass, next step let other people hear you.[/quote] You certainly can mate, and I've decided to post on here rather than PM you, in the hope that maybe other people can relate to what I'm saying. There are certainly others on here who have said similar things. I'm 46 years old, and I have always had a dreadful lack of self-confidence. I've never taken part in any group activities. At school I was cajoled into the football team, then the rugby team, and any other team my parents and/or teachers thought I should join. And I got out of these teams just as quickly as I could because I was never comfortable in these "group" situations. I was always the fat kid who never got picked, and ended up getting dumped onto a team who never wanted me there. My interests have always been solitary: I used to enjoy playing golf (alone!); I used to ride a motorbike, mostly on my own as I detested the "pressure" of being in a group of riders (then two bike accidents five years apart gave me two knackered shoulders which ended my golfing ambitions!); I enjoy photography, which I can do alone; astronomy (I have a mahoosive telescope which I use, alone); and playing bass, which I do alone. I work as a crime scene examiner which is mostly solitary. I occasionally have to attend major incidents with other CSEs, and when that happens I'm a gibbering wreck, because I always think they're better than I am. They're not. Performance figures show very clearly that they're not. But I never let the facts get in the way of a good neurosis! Also, I can't give presentations. Even if the subject is something which I know absolutely inside out, I cannot stand in front of even a friendly, receptive audience in case there's someone there who knows more about it than I do, or who might ask a question which I can't answer. Getting back to bass, I bought my first instrument when I was 15 or thereabouts, and since then I think I've only been without a bass for a total of maybe 7 or 8 months. And it always comes back to the same things: I don't think I'm technically competent; an audience scares me stupid; I can't play slap (& if you can't slap, you ain't a bass player). I love bass. I absolutely adore it. Every night I play I get a tingle up my spine, whether it's through headphones or the combo. And I have dreams - NOT nightmares! - about one day playing in a rock covers band in a little pub somewhere to maybe 20 people. I imagine how that might feel. I don't want adoration, I don't want hero worship, I don't even want applause. But I do dream of what it must feel like to be able to do the one thing which I have always been unable to do. Just once. I'm guessing everyone's bored rigid now! "[i]Somebody wake up Hicks[/i]." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bythesea Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 [quote name='Hot Tub' post='524206' date='Jun 25 2009, 10:48 PM']I'm guessing everyone's bored rigid now! [/quote] Not at all Go for it - you would be surprised what a difference it makes having people around you up there. I am a lot like you. always been very solitary. On occasion I tried playing solo at folk clubs - couldn't do it. However, when there are others up there with me (though it has been some time now) I always imagined that everyone was looking at them, and I was still on my own playing to myself. And it was great - and eventually I was able to talk into a mike, and then even sing! Still couldn't do it on my own though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonybassplayer Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 That is a very touching story and I really wish I lived nearer so that I could help. Perhaps there is a fellow basschatter who would to invite you to perhaps stand in for one easy to play song at a very low key gig ?? Trust me it is VERY scary the first time but you will be completely hooked. C'mon guys, we need to help this fellow bassist realise his dreams PS I was also "the fat guy" at school and know what it is like PPS I now play in three bands ( and I can't slap !! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerdragon Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Hot tub, it took we a while to stop laughing there. you have a job that almost every one on here would kill for (yeah that was a delibrate pun). so you are obviously intelligent, and you love playing bass. do you watch other bands, in pubs for instance, i could blah blah for ages to you, but for gods sake someone near Leamington Spa take him under their wing and point him in the right direction. did you not think of going to the bass bash at NAS's place. you are good enough for a band situation. i wish you were nearer me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Why has no one mentioned Weekend Warriors? This is EXACTLY what that program exists for. Look it up, check it out, give it a try. Worked for me ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerdragon Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Yeah but The Weekend Warriors are for relapsed musicians who want to rejoin a band, which is not what Hot tub is on about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarnacleBob Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Wow! We have our very own Gil Grissom! I am Impressed! BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eight Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 [quote name='Hot Tub' post='524206' date='Jun 25 2009, 10:48 PM']I'm guessing everyone's bored rigid now! [/quote] You had me at crime scene examiner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdgrsr400 Posted June 25, 2009 Share Posted June 25, 2009 Check out [url="http://rock-til-you-drop.com/"]http://rock-til-you-drop.com/[/url] - it's for the more 'mature' musician and is definitely worth a look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 I'll address some points in a random order: I went on stage for the first time last year at the age 32. I wish I had done it sooner. I've only done 3 gigs so far in my "career", and I still get so nervous that I don't really remember being on stage It's the performing, the playing with other musicians which really makes you raise your game because there are other people involved - your band mates are relying upon you for a musical foundation, and the punters want you to rumble them into at least tapping their feet So think of it as the logical progression in your playing. It will improve you enormously. Playing bass alone can only take you so far, and if you love bass as much as you say then it's where your playing HAS to go. Live your dream! Don't worry too much about the group situation. Assuming you join a band with people you vaguely like, who are all into the music you're playing then you'll all be united in a common purpose and you'll succeed or fail as a group. There's always someone who knows more than you. So what? It's an opportunity to learn. I'm the second best bass player in my band. So what? [b]I'm[/b] the bass player unless he grows 4 arms. It's OK not to know the answer to something. I'd rather you said "I don't know" than waffle a heap of misleading nonsense because you thought you had to. I was bullied at school. I was slightly built, wore glasses, had no interest in sports or playing instruments and got on with my academic work. You talk about regrets, I regret not punching a few people in the face. I try not to let it get to me, but suffice to say I won't be going to any reunions. Is there a part of me when I'm on stage thinking "ha, you never thought I could do this" - a fantasy where a former bully (or maybe a girl I used to fancy at school but was too shy/geeky to even talk to her) comes to one of my gigs and their jaw hits the floor in astonishment? Damn right there is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepurpleblob Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 (edited) Mmmm..... I have a lot of sympathy. I am the same age as you more or less and I can relate to a lot you are saying. I used to be desperately shy and solitary but I've worked hard over the years to combat this. I'm a lot better now but I'm never going to be a slap-on-the-back-team-player type and I accept that. BUT.... you know what the best thing I ever did was? I joined a pub band - a just starting out with only three songs pub band luckily - at age forty. I was bloody terrified. I kid you not. It still doesn't take much to get me into a complete flap but three bands and hundreds of gigs later I'm an altogether better person. It's brilliant therapy. Post in gumtree or somesuch for some like minded musicians who might like to learn a few songs and maybe play some small gigs, possibly in front of a few friends to start and work up. Think about it! EDIT: Forgot to add... can't slap either and it doesn't matter because almost no songs need it. Can't play with pick blah blah. Bass has the advantage that you can wear black, stand at the back and just rumble away on the roots if that's all your nerves will stand. You don't have to be Wooten you just have to follow the roots and have good timing. The rest is just polish! Edited June 26, 2009 by thepurpleblob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Hot Tub' post='524206' date='Jun 25 2009, 10:48 PM'].... one day playing in a rock covers band in a little pub somewhere to maybe 20 people. I imagine how that might feel. I don't want adoration, I don't want hero worship, I don't even want applause.[/quote] Oh that's just normal - as a bass player you certainly won't be troubled by any of those things. If you are very (un)lucky someone may notice you are there... Seriously you should get down to some jam sessions and see the standard of playing and performance. Many people don't know which end to hold but still have a go. Generally the audience is full of people who appreciate how well you are doing because that's why they are there too... Edited June 26, 2009 by OldGit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 (edited) The first time I played live I was about 20 or 21, the stage was planks on top of milk crates, and my knees shook so much the whole stage seemed to wobble I couldnt look at the 'audience' of about 15 bored (deafened - volume over talent is always the answer!) people, as I knew they would all immediately suss that I couldn't play at all. In truth, I couldnt play at all, I picked the instrument up only months before, and know it wasnt confidence or bravado that got me on that stage it was stupidity and not wanting to let the side down. I have never regretted it. I had the same trouble gigging for 4 years, total nervous wreck up to the start of the gig, no confidence during the gig (the fear!) foul mood afterwards (I was so rubbish). Then I got into music college (but how - all the other bassists will be legends compared to me) and discovered that actually I could play, and pretty well, even in front of a room full of musos hanging on every hint of a mistake (this stuff was all marked coursework). That took another 2 years to get my head around. Why am I telling you this? Well I wasnt popular at school, I had/have my fair share of insecurities, but the fact is, if you play every night and have done for years, you are almost certainly perfectly capable of playing a pub gig, and I can only applaud you for making the suggestion you have. It is terrifying, you have [b]every[/b] right to feel terrified, it is completely natural to be terrified. I think very very few people can say they have never been terrified (my eldest son can say this, he's been performing music on stage since he was so small he didnt know it was supposed to be scary - I'm very proud of this!) or at least enjoying all the benefits of the 'fight or flight' reflex . Get it together and do it. you will love it, you will have achieved a life long dream and conquered a life long fear. It will be worth it. Whats the worst that can happen? You stand there, look at the peculiar utterly alien device in you hands, forget which end to blow through due to fear and stand stock still for the entire set before writing I am a fish 400 times, saluting the audience of 15 bored patrons, who dont even realise you didnt play, and collapsing..... ....that is the way to real fame! EDIT: I can slap, what the hell has that got to do with it, as far as I know James Jamerson never slapped a note, and by all accounts he was nearly as good as me Edited June 26, 2009 by 51m0n Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarnacleBob Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 [quote name='thepurpleblob' post='524636' date='Jun 26 2009, 09:54 AM']BUT.... you know what the best thing I ever did was? I joined a pub band - a just starting out with only three songs pub band luckily - at age forty. I was bloody terrified. I kid you not. It still doesn't take much to get me into a complete flap but three bands and hundreds of gigs later I'm an altogether better person. It's brilliant therapy. Post in gumtree or somesuch for some like minded musicians who might like to learn a few songs and maybe play some small gigs, possibly in front of a few friends to start and work up. Think about it![/quote] +1 for this. It's that very first step thats the real hurdle if u have a chronic lack of confidence. I have done thousands of gigs - pubs, functions, TV, stadiums even, luckily water off a ducks back (well not quite ) But stick me in a room at a party or a meeting and i am terrified and just want to run away - only me bass gives me real confidence and if u can get over the initial jump u'll be fine BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheButler Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 I've tried Jam sessions, quite a few of them. The standard of playing was very high indeed, but it came from the most unsuspecting people. I don't know if i'll ever do one again, at least not until i'm a bit older and get the due respect with that. Gig-wise, i do a lot of them and every time i put out a good performance. I'm a confident person, always have been, but as soon as i have to gig i get the most terrible exaggerated response to nerves/excitement which really does take it's toll on my playing I've yet to conquer that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golchen Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 Hey hot tub - I can really relate to this thread! There's a lot of me in your description about yourself. I'm going to definitely probably consider perhaps doing something about my situation ............ that is unless I procrastinate too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 [quote name='beerdragon' post='524276' date='Jun 25 2009, 11:25 PM']Yeah but The Weekend Warriors are for relapsed musicians who want to rejoin a band, which is not what Hot tub is on about.[/quote] That was their original intention when the program started, but it's way more flexible than that. I'd never been in a band before when I tried WW last year, and I wasn't the only complete newbie in the set-up. Three months after joining, I played a proper gig in front of a proper audience (The Luminaire in Kilburn High Road). That was 29th May 2008 and I was 51. Since then I've played a number of pub & party gigs and the band I'm in now (see my sig) sees itself as a proper, gigging pub band and that's how we're marketing ourselves to the local landlords. As a result of doing WW, I'm no longer a Gig Virgin. I just still have trouble with bra straps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted June 26, 2009 Share Posted June 26, 2009 (edited) [quote name='TheButler' post='524655' date='Jun 26 2009, 10:05 AM']I've tried Jam sessions, quite a few of them. The standard of playing was very high indeed, but it came from the most unsuspecting people. I don't know if i'll ever do one again, at least not until i'm a bit older and get the due respect with that. Gig-wise, i do a lot of them and every time i put out a good performance. I'm a confident person, always have been, but as soon as i have to gig i get the most terrible exaggerated response to nerves/excitement which really does take it's toll on my playing I've yet to conquer that.[/quote] Jam sessions vary considerably. Near me there are some that just seem like normalg ggs with highly skilled players who know each other and know the tunes and the versions. They are one type. Then on a different night there's one where total beginners are welcomed and gaffs are frequent. Both have their character. Don't be put off, just get around a few and sus them out. Meanwhile here's the Weekend Warriors location list: [url="http://www.mia.org.uk/ww_locations/"]http://www.mia.org.uk/ww_locations/[/url] Edited June 26, 2009 by OldGit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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