Music Shop Bashing

[waynepunkdude]

[quote name='BottomEndian' post='542955' date='Jul 17 2009, 09:54 AM']

[b]EIGHT HUNDRED AND FIFTY POUNDS?[/b]

Was it entirely gold-plated? Encrusted with diamonds? Refinished by Banksy? Accompanied by a certificate of authenticity verifying that it had passed through a time warp and been taken on board the Apollo missions? I mean, I love my SUB, but that's silly, silly money.[/quote]


I just bought one in better condition with hardcase for £380, ridiculous

[Pete Academy]

[quote name='cheddatom' post='542957' date='Jul 17 2009, 09:54 AM']+1 We used to go to Academy of sound in Stoke on saturdays and kill an hour playing stuff. We had no idea it was annoying or costly to the business. Kids will never see the bigger picture. You have to spell it out for them.

IMO if you have signs on the guitars saying "please ask before playing" and they still play the guitars, the signs are not good enough. Get them around the strings or something. If a kid takes the sign off, then surely you could kick him out. If the sign's there, it's pretty clear you should not be playing without asking, even to a kid. I would never have done that.[/quote]

Regarding the acoustic guitars, it was getting so bad that we went from a few signs around the area to a sign on each guitar. And some of them still ignored the signs. Whereas there used to be 3 or 4 kids at a time coming in, now it's not unusual to see 10 or 15. On the day I turned the power off there were about 2 pianos with 3 kids on each one at the same time, playing different 'tunes'; 3 electronic kits were being played, with not one kid asking for a pair of headphones, and if they didn't have sticks they would bash them with their hands; most of the synths were being played; someone was bashing on the handsonic-type kit. I tried to tell them but the noise was so bad they couldn't hear me, and those that could completely ignored me.

[Jobiebass]

[quote name='Marcus' post='542886' date='Jul 17 2009, 08:53 AM']Bully !!

Musician make horrible customers - Shops get a raw deal these days with everyone throwing Internet prices in their faces......

I don't mind paying a bit more for good service...... I've built up good relationships with a good number of shops both locally and nationally, they value my custom and I respect their need to make a living ![/quote]

Totaly know what you mean. I buy a great deal of stuff from Electro Music in Doncaster, Im on first name basis with 2 of them too. Id rather give back to a loal shop then buy online, ok if its stupidly priced then ill go online but for instance. I was going to buy a new Ampeg 410hlf, £600 on the internet and I was happy to pay £650 in Electro for it (that was till I saw a 2nd hand 610 they had in instead) Did annoy me a little that he pratted around with the eq getting it "perfect" without telling me what the hell he was doing. Generally very good service in there, always been very helpful.


Ive been in electro around 4ish when the school kids come in and one of the guys came up and asked everyone to be careful with the instuments, but in fairness there were 3 kids around 11-15 picking up expensive Fenders and a new stingray pratting about with them with no intention of buying.

[cheddatom]

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='543010' date='Jul 17 2009, 10:40 AM']Regarding the acoustic guitars, it was getting so bad that we went from a few signs around the area to a sign on each guitar. And some of them still ignored the signs. Whereas there used to be 3 or 4 kids at a time coming in, now it's not unusual to see 10 or 15. On the day I turned the power off there were about 2 pianos with 3 kids on each one at the same time, playing different 'tunes'; 3 electronic kits were being played, with not one kid asking for a pair of headphones, and if they didn't have sticks they would bash them with their hands; most of the synths were being played; someone was bashing on the handsonic-type kit. I tried to tell them but the noise was so bad they couldn't hear me, and those that could completely ignored me.[/quote]

It's a difficult one. You can't really afford to alienate all the kids, but you can't afford to let them scratch the instruments. Bigger signs, or maybe a rediculously loud tannoy system - that could both amuse the kids, and get them to stop when they've gone too far.

[Rich]

Perhaps the answer is to wire the gtrs and basses up so they can't actually be played or even picked up without being unlocked. And keep the kettle leads for the synths etc. behind the counter.

[cheddatom]

[quote name='Rich' post='543047' date='Jul 17 2009, 11:13 AM']Perhaps the answer is to wire the gtrs and basses up so they can't actually be played or even picked up without being unlocked. And keep the kettle leads for the synths etc. behind the counter.[/quote]

yeh like in technology shops

[Stylon Pilson]

[quote name='Rich' post='543047' date='Jul 17 2009, 10:13 AM']Perhaps the answer is to wire the gtrs and basses up so they can't actually be played or even picked up without being unlocked. And keep the kettle leads for the synths etc. behind the counter.[/quote]

Certainly it might be worth doing this at the weekends until the kids get the picture.

S.P.

[sdgrsr400]

Or require "Customers aged 18 or under must be accompanied by a responsible adult. Proof of age may be required."

[bythesea]

[quote name='sdgrsr400' post='543082' date='Jul 17 2009, 11:54 AM']Or require "Customers aged 18 or under must be accompanied by a [b]responsible adult[/b]. Proof of age may be required."[/quote]
You might have some problems there, particularly if the adult is a musician...

[neepheid]

+1 to wiring them up - I'm sure I've seen systems which basically comprise sections of connected wire threaded through the strings to an alarm of some sort. You have to ask to try an instrument where a member of staff will switch off the alarm, break the wire at a convenient connector, unthread the wire from the instrument then reconnect the wire and switch back on the alarm. You try and disengage it yourself and you'll get a surprise (and presumably a ticking off/escorted off the premises depending on the circumstances).

[xilddx]

[quote name='neepheid' post='543106' date='Jul 17 2009, 12:12 PM']+1 to wiring them up - I'm sure I've seen systems which basically comprise sections of connected wire threaded through the strings to an alarm of some sort. You have to ask to try an instrument where a member of staff will switch off the alarm, break the wire at a convenient connector, unthread the wire from the instrument then reconnect the wire and switch back on the alarm. You try and disengage it yourself and you'll get a surprise (and presumably a ticking off/escorted off the premises depending on the circumstances).[/quote]

I detest those things. I want to go to a music shop not bloody prison. I lose interest in being there as soon as I see them.

Didn't Hendrix used to hang out in Manny's when he was young and play guitar for ages until Manny told him to shut up or buy something.

I used to hang out a bit in Project Music in Hounslow, they were really cool and I ended up buying a lot of kit from them. Every time I have been to the Gallery they've given me time, patience, help and loads of kit to play, they've got me as a customer for life now. I want to feel as though I'm valued as a customer, not a pain in the arse wearing out their gear.

I totally understand the predicament of the OP with kids treating the shop as a recreation ground, but they could be your customers of the future. If you try building a relationship with them, be firm but helpful, you might develop some mutual respect. I know it doesn't work all the time but surely even getting 10% of them on your side means they'll influence their friends positively.

Difficult problem to solve, I agree.

[fatgoogle]

BUt surely there has to be an element of trying and not considering buying yet, how will we ever know if we like an instrument, if i cant go in sit down switch on an amp and play a Couple of bass's through, or course while asking to play. Im not going to buy something i dont like, why should i. So i think shops have to understand thats ts the one place were musicians young and old can actually come and play instruments. I dont like playing in music shops now or even buying in them because of the treatment ive had from you adults. Were youve been rudd, snobbish and annoying. Also other people playing their have put me off. Some music shops have refused to let me play through amps or try bass's, because of my age.

Ive always asked to play, alot of time becuase ill need a cable to play, and also that they might need to plug in the amp, or there is a sign saying please ask,(im too honest for my own good). And because its good practise.

I dont know any of you people on this site or what your like etc, so i dont know your experiences but you all seem a bit too hard on this subject.

Does it make a difference that im 16 and have been going and playing instruments in music shops since i was 13-14.

[EdwardHimself]

[quote name='Rich' post='543047' date='Jul 17 2009, 10:13 AM']Perhaps the answer is to wire the gtrs and basses up so they can't actually be played or even picked up without being unlocked. And keep the kettle leads for the synths etc. behind the counter.[/quote]

It's funny you should say that actually because at the big music shop in hull this is what they do with all their guitars and basses. You have to ask them then they'll get a key and disactivate the alarm systeme, and take off whatever guitar you might want a go on. I've always found them very helpful.

[xilddx]

[quote name='fatgoogle' post='543250' date='Jul 17 2009, 02:34 PM']BUt surely there has to be an element of trying and not considering buying yet, how will we ever know if we like an instrument, if i cant go in sit down switch on an amp and play a Couple of bass's through, or course while asking to play. Im not going to buy something i dont like, why should i. So i think shops have to understand thats ts the one place were musicians young and old can actually come and play instruments. I dont like playing in music shops now or even buying in them because of the treatment ive had from you adults. Were youve been rudd, snobbish and annoying. Also other people playing their have put me off. Some music shops have refused to let me play through amps or try bass's, because of my age.

Ive always asked to play, alot of time becuase ill need a cable to play, and also that they might need to plug in the amp, or there is a sign saying please ask,(im too honest for my own good). And because its good practise.

I dont know any of you people on this site or what your like etc, so i dont know your experiences but you all seem a bit too hard on this subject.

Does it make a difference that im 16 and have been going and playing instruments in music shops since i was 13-14.[/quote]

Don't worry, us adults get just as much sh*t in most music shops. I actually saw two young teenagers in the Bass Gallery about two weeks ago, trying electro-acoustic basses. they got the same excellent level of service as I was getting. So don't take it too personally, the owner probably just believes all the crap he reads about "yoof" in the Daily Heil.

Edited July 17, 2009 by silddx

[skankdelvar]

[quote name='fatgoogle' post='543250' date='Jul 17 2009, 02:34 PM']So i think shops have to understand thats ts the one place were musicians young and old can actually come and play instruments.[/quote]

Rehearsal space, own bedroom, wherever. That's where one goes to play. A shop is there to sell things. If one has the intention of trying before buying, fine. If not, don't finger the goods. Same in any shop where the items on display are sale items, not demo items. Why should a music shop be any different?

[quote name='fatgoogle' post='543250' date='Jul 17 2009, 02:34 PM']I dont like playing in music shops now or even buying in them because of the treatment ive had from you adults. Were youve been rudd, snobbish and annoying. Also other people playing their have put me off. Some music shops have refused to let me play through amps or try bass's, because of my age.[/quote]

Age thing alone is unfair to you. But they're not doing it randomly or because they don't like you personally. Its based on their previous experience and you're getting caught in the blowback.

[quote name='fatgoogle' post='543250' date='Jul 17 2009, 02:34 PM']I dont know any of you people on this site or what your like etc, so i dont know your experiences but you all seem a bit too hard on this subject.[/quote]

My experience is that I generally give certain music shops a hard time for their incompetence and bad attitude. OTOH asking someone not to handle the merchandise if they just want to use it for 'a practise' seems entirely reasonable. If someone wants to practise, they should get their bass and go sit in the bedroom. That's what the rest of us do.

[quote name='fatgoogle' post='543250' date='Jul 17 2009, 02:34 PM']Does it make a difference that im 16 and have been going and playing instruments in music shops since i was 13-14.[/quote]

No - I'd extend the prohibition to anyone who clearly and visibly has no serious intentions to buy now or in the future, irrespective of age. How I'd enforce that is another question!

To be fair, neither the prohibition, nor this post, is aimed at you personally - I thought exactly the same thing when I was the same age. Sorry, but it's just tough sh*t and you have to get over it, like all the other nasty things in life.

Y'see, it's just a simple fact of commerce. If you let gear get damaged or 'shop-soiled' you lose money and go out of business. In principle, age should be irrelevant. In practice, the OP's identified a particular group who happen to be young people.

[Pete Academy]

The point I'm making is how much young people have changed in attitude over the years. Personally I don't care if you're nine or ninrty - if you come up to me and ask politely if you can try an instrument, I will oblige. I've seen adults go over to a line of £1600+ Les Pauls and ignore the signs, pulling them off the hangers and bashing them about. I've seen adults go up to two grand Taylors and strum the strings while it's hanging on the wall (what IS that about?!), thus knocking the guitar against the wall.

I too have been that annoying kid in the late 70s asking to try out basses in shops. But I did always ask first. I agree you can't tell who or who isn't going to be your future customer who will go on to spend thousands when he or she gets older. But the same lack of respect that's prevalent everywhere - on the bus, in the classroom, on the street, where youngsters are untouchable - has undoubtedly crept into music stores.

The previous young poster who's bleating about rude staff etc reminds me of Kevin the teenager, and how hard done he is in the shop. How would you like it if I came to your house uninvited and started playing your bass?

All I say is show the staff some respect, do your practise and jam with your mates at home or rehearsal, and you might just get better treatment.

[thepurpleblob]

On the odd occasion I've bought a new bass in a shop (e.g. yesterday - sigh!), I can't help thinking that it's been hanging there being played by greasy fingered teenagers for the last year. It's effectively second hand! I can actually understand why the shop might want to limit access to instruments to those who might actually buy something. It's a balance though.

It's not just music shops - I had a similar experience recently buying a car. My wife was looking for a Jeepy thing that would fit the dogs in the back. We went to the local Vauxhall dealer to have a look at the 4x4 they now do. They only had one brand new one. I told the salesman that there was no chance we would buy the new one but give us a blast around the block and if we liked it we would hang on for a used one. "no problem, just come in and we'll get some details that we need for insurance". So, all our life details typed into the computer and he disappears, comes back, "sorry - my manager won't let you drive it. We've determined you can't afford it. In any case a new model will drive completely differently to a used one, so there's no point you driving it". Wot!! You snotty bunch of scumbags!! So... we went round the corner to the BMW dealer who could not have been nicer and bought an X3 (an extremely good deal BTW). Peter Vardy - hope you're listening

Sorry... this is about bass guitars isn't it... my point is that there are a lot of complete idiots working in sales jobs. Just take a deep breath and go somewhere else. There are still good shops out there. Give them your money - they deserve it!!

[Stylon Pilson]

[quote name='thepurpleblob' post='543334' date='Jul 17 2009, 04:10 PM']It's not just music shops - I had a similar experience recently buying a car. My wife was looking for a Jeepy thing that would fit the dogs in the back. We went to the local Vauxhall dealer to have a look at the 4x4 they now do. They only had one brand new one. I told the salesman that there was no chance we would buy the new one but give us a blast around the block and if we liked it we would hang on for a used one. "no problem, just come in and we'll get some details that we need for insurance". So, all our life details typed into the computer and he disappears, comes back, "sorry - my manager won't let you drive it. We've determined you can't afford it. In any case a new model will drive completely differently to a used one, so there's no point you driving it". Wot!! You snotty bunch of scumbags!! So... we went round the corner to the BMW dealer who could not have been nicer and bought an X3 (an extremely good deal BTW). Peter Vardy - hope you're listening [/quote]

Ah, it's just like Pretty Woman.

S.P.

[thepurpleblob]

[quote name='Stylon Pilson' post='543336' date='Jul 17 2009, 04:12 PM']Ah, it's just like Pretty Woman.

S.P.[/quote]

Ah... you've met my wife then

[Rich]

[quote name='thepurpleblob' post='543334' date='Jul 17 2009, 04:10 PM']It's not just music shops - I had a similar experience recently buying a car. My wife was looking for a Jeepy thing that would fit the dogs in the back. We went to the local Vauxhall dealer to have a look at the 4x4 they now do. They only had one brand new one. I told the salesman that there was no chance we would buy the new one but give us a blast around the block and if we liked it we would hang on for a used one. "no problem, just come in and we'll get some details that we need for insurance". So, all our life details typed into the computer and he disappears, comes back, "sorry - my manager won't let you drive it. We've determined you can't afford it. In any case a new model will drive completely differently to a used one, so there's no point you driving it". Wot!! You snotty bunch of scumbags!! So... we went round the corner to the BMW dealer who could not have been nicer and bought an X3 (an extremely good deal BTW). Peter Vardy - hope you're listening [/quote]
That is utterly shocking. I hope you went back round to the Vauxhall dealer, waved the Beemer receipt at them and told them just how much free bad publicity they'll be getting. I reckon you should definitely complain to their head office, at the very least.

[thepurpleblob]

[quote name='Rich' post='543343' date='Jul 17 2009, 04:16 PM']That is utterly shocking. I hope you went back round to the Vauxhall dealer, waved the Beemer receipt at them and told them just how much free bad publicity they'll be getting. I reckon you should definitely complain to their head office, at the very least.[/quote]

No point.... they wouldn't care and it wouldn't make any difference. If they gave a sh*t I wouldn't have been in that situation in the first place. We almost certainly ended up with a better deal too.

[Pete Academy]

I couldn't agree more, Mr Blob. Bad service = no sale.

That goes for you at PC World who told me the modem I wanted to connect the missus's laptop to the internet was probably too difficult for me to use, so he recommended I pay ninety quid for them to come and do it. A mate did it for nothing.

That's you at the Orange phone shop who told me she couldn't help with anything because my contract doesn't run out until September. That's me going with Vodafone, then.

That's you at the Halifax who was trying to upgrade my current account and could have given me the facts in 5 minutes, but blabbed on with small talk so the appointment lasted the full half hour she was allocated.

I could go on.

[cheddatom]

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='543349' date='Jul 17 2009, 04:21 PM']I couldn't agree more, Mr Blob. Bad service = no sale.

That goes for you at PC World who told me the modem I wanted to connect the missus's laptop to the internet was probably too difficult for me to use, so he recommended I pay ninety quid for them to come and do it. A mate did it for nothing.

That's you at the Orange phone shop who told me she couldn't help with anything because my contract doesn't run out until September. That's me going with Vodafone, then.

That's you at the Halifax who was trying to upgrade my current account and could have given me the facts in 5 minutes, but blabbed on with small talk so the appointment lasted the full half hour she was allocated.

I could go on.[/quote]

That's you who I asked to re-string my bass but when I came back you tried to charge me for a full set up and fret re-dress and wouldn't let me have my bass back until I went to the cash point to draw out the extra £30!!


Only kidding, that was 10 years ago, so probably a different bass guy at AOS Stoke then.

[fatgoogle]

[quote name='skankdelvar' post='543294' date='Jul 17 2009, 03:19 PM']Rehearsal space, own bedroom, wherever. That's where one goes to play. A shop is there to sell things. If one has the intention of trying before buying, fine. If not, don't finger the goods. Same in any shop where the items on display are sale items, not demo items. Why should a music shop be any different?[/quote]

Oh sorry on that point i meant more trying instruments to see if you like it and in the future when i have the money could go back and buy it.

But i also found the first bass i boughht along with a cheap little amp, they couldnt be more helpful because they knew they could sell me just about anything, and i wouldnt know if it was good bad. I got a good first bass though. Going and trying to find a new bass a couple of years couldnt be more difficult though. Ill also add that non of these shops have much to do with bass, so that could be a bad factor for me and my experiences.

[Pete Academy]

[quote name='cheddatom' post='543353' date='Jul 17 2009, 04:25 PM']That's you who I asked to re-string my bass but when I came back you tried to charge me for a full set up and fret re-dress and wouldn't let me have my bass back until I went to the cash point to draw out the extra £30!!


Only kidding, that was 10 years ago, so probably a different bass guy at AOS Stoke then.[/quote]

Ooh that's bad. Defo wasn't me...I couldn't sleep for the guilt.

I once heard of a guy charging someone eight quid for changing the top E string on a guitar.