Musicman20 Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I find myself becoming more and more out of touch with my band recently. We are all good friends from way back, and me and the drummer are definitely a good match. Personality-wise and musician-wise. But, its just not clicking like it used to. I told them if this summer was as dull as last summer (eg barely any practicing and no new songs) then I'd be out. I don't want to....but after playing gig after gig for literally £0 i'm getting sick of it. The whole modern DIY punk/hardcore scene is full of fantastically fluent musicians, yet it still seems acceptable to barely cover petrol costs when we all work full time and make a hell of a lot of effort to get from our hometown after work to a gig in Yorkshire on time and with equipment. This happened last week. They didn't even pay our petrol, so it was like a very expensive practice. The PA was actually very professional, but they had barely advertised and were more concerned about their club night afterwards. We went home out of pocket and extremely tired. I don't know what is acceptable nowadays....but Im sick of the effort for not even getting costs covered. Because of the massive rush to setup that occurs at all of our gigs, there is no point in me taking my decent high end equipment anymore. I just stick with a house amp or cab and take my least expensive bass. Cables get stolen and water always gets spilt everywhere. Maybe im too old for the sh*t organisation and dirty venues. Who knows. What do you guys/girls think? I love bass; I will never stop that. But....im losing money in this band to daft little things that should be covered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waynepunkdude Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I know what you mean we have had some really sh*t shows this year but then last night we got a slot as main support for Jaya the Cat and played to loads of people and got paid, kinda makes it all worthwhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4000 Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Yep, this sounds familiar. This is why I nowadays hate playing with other bands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noisyjon Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) Welcome to band life! I presume you're in an originals band? If so, and IME, That just seems to be the way things are and with a 'like it or lump it' attitude thrown in for good measure. I was recently wondering how bands manage to nurture and grow their songwriting style and skill these days and it must be flippin tough to do it. Could bands such as the Stones, Led Zep, The Who, etc have existed today the way things are? Anyway back on track, I'd put a beady eye out and see what else is available in your situation. JTB Edited August 9, 2009 by jonthebass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I view being in a band as an expensive but fun hobby. We rarely get paid, let alone expenses, but as long as we enjoy being onstage playing our original stuff its all worth it IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4000 Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 (edited) I actually view it like a good night out, so as long as it doesnt cost me over £30 I'm doing pretty well. Edited August 9, 2009 by 4000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayman Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I'm just fed up with being in bands full stop. I started back on bass after many years away from it about 10 years ago. The reason I started again was for my own enjoyment, playing along to CDs through headphones at home. I love to do that, and hadn't had a good couple of hours on my own at home for ages as band commitments had taken up most of my time. A few nights ago, I got the Tascam out again and spent a great hour or two grooving along to myself to some Cds, I loved every minute of it, and remembered why I'd picked the bass up in the first place, just for my [i]OWN[/i] pleasure. So, I'm thinking of jacking the band in and just going back to playing with myself again, so to speak . I fancy getting into writing and recording some stuff at home. It's less hassle, less stressful and more enjoyable to me, so why be in a band at all?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Burrito Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I had a break for a few years & it did me the world of good. I enjoy it again but certainly hear you on all moans & gripes. You have to weigh up the pros & cons - if the good outweighs the bad, do it - if not, time for a rethink. Personally I love it again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 I love it...I love live music. But...I am starting to tire of the way we are so disorganised and slack. Its not down to me....I push them all more than I should. I just think a new band is in order. Something a little more challenging to play and melodic. I find myself getting bored of the lack of challenge. I have recently joined a covers band, but thats different. We know we won't play any gigs without proper payment. I think perhaps a new originals band is calling me. After playing in some great bands in Nottingham, selling out the Rescue Rooms on my first gig, etc, this is such a comedown! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Move on and find people with the same levels of aspiration and creativity as yourself.. Otherwise, you get dragged down to their level! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 when i played in an originals band we were offered a gig and it came with a fee. If you play X you will be paid Y. Work it out up front, be proffesional with dealing with promoters and price yourself at what you think you are worth. Be realistic but at a minimum cover your costs. Also the cost kinda in folks mind determines how good you are, eg a £2000 bass is obviously better than a £200 bass even if they are similar. Likewise think about where you price yourself in the market. but then to do that the band has to have the drive to match, and if you dont you probably arnt going to go forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='564282' date='Aug 9 2009, 05:44 PM']Move on and find people with the same levels of aspiration and creativity as yourself.. Otherwise, you get dragged down to their level![/quote] [quote name='LukeFRC' post='564286' date='Aug 9 2009, 05:52 PM']when i played in an originals band we were offered a gig and it came with a fee. If you play X you will be paid Y. Work it out up front, be proffesional with dealing with promoters and price yourself at what you think you are worth. Be realistic but at a minimum cover your costs. Also the cost kinda in folks mind determines how good you are, eg a £2000 bass is obviously better than a £200 bass even if they are similar. Likewise think about where you price yourself in the market. but then to do that the band has to have the drive to match, and if you dont you probably arnt going to go forward.[/quote] Both excellent things to think about...thanks... I do feel dragged down. The drummer is incredible...but....sometimes you just have to move on. Either that or I take control and sort out all money situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Pet hate..venues who think they can exploit people seemingly desperate to play.... Ask the club owner for free drinks and see how far this gets you. so now you know the answer to free gigs..IMV. Sounds like that unit has got to the end of its shelf-life anyway....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Sounds like you have decided. I was going to suggest doing the money thing with a covers band but you are doing that. So try this.. Take an organised 6 months off from the band - ie the whole band and not just a lack of gigs. Set a date to get back together in March or so and stick to it. Have fun with your covers band and then review things with the originals band then. If they have missed it they may be more inclined to be organised and focused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 [quote name='OldGit' post='564478' date='Aug 9 2009, 09:24 PM']Sounds like you have decided. I was going to suggest doing the money thing with a covers band but you are doing that. So try this.. Take an organised 6 months off from the band - ie the whole band and not just a lack of gigs. Set a date to get back together in March or so and stick to it. Have fun with your covers band and then review things with the originals band then. If they have missed it they may be more inclined to be organised and focused.[/quote] A very wise piece of advice...thanks. That actually quite a good idea. The covers band has always been on my mind, and now 2 great guitarists have come along, with a fantastic female vocalist and an old friend drumming, Im pretty happy. The originals band does need a break I think. We have no gigs until October after this week....which is down to the rest of them being lazy and not following up leads. We also owe a fair whack for our cd production.....which I doubt will materialise for a long time. So....either I give it a break or I let them know my frustration I think. Cheers everyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 [quote name='Musicman20' post='564533' date='Aug 9 2009, 10:22 PM']So....either I give it a break or I let them know my frustration I think.[/quote] Both, I'd say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 We played a hell of a lot of sh*t gigs and got seriously tired of it, not to mention broke. In my new band, we're stricly only doing gigs where we know for a fact we will play to more than 20 odd people, where we know we'll get paid (even just for petrol) and where we know we can have a good night (IE stay over or leave the gear over night or basically not have to drive). It's going well so far, but we're going to do some London gigs soon and I sense it may be the return of the toilet gig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 [quote name='cheddatom' post='564776' date='Aug 10 2009, 10:59 AM']...we're stricly only doing gigs where we know for a fact we will play to more than 20 odd people, where we know we'll get paid (even just for petrol) and where we know we can have a good night (IE stay over or leave the gear over night or basically not have to drive)[/quote] Crikey! We could all do with some of those. Any chance of a list? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike257 Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 I think to have a satisfying experience as an originals band, everybody involved needs to have more or less the same aspirations and work ethic. My last originals band wasn't exactly a profit machine, but we took the business end of things very seriously, and always at least broke even. We worked our nuts off to build a committed fan base in our local area, and bypassed promoters by hiring the venues ourselves. We used to make a comfortable few hundred quid doing a local headline show every other month, and that covered our expenses travelling further afield to places where we didn't yet have the pulling power to attract a decent fee. Between that, and merch sales, we got all around the country, staying in Travelodges every time (no roughing it in the van!) and covered all our expenses, and it never cost us a penny of our own money. The thing is, it takes up countless hours of everybody's time, probably more time than you spend practicing, to do all the promoting and haggling and whatever else, and if you're the only guy in your band taking it that seriously, there's a real problem. Just realised this is turning into an essay, so I'll shut up now. I'd be wondering, If the rest of your band aren't pulling their weight, maybe they just haven't got the same ambitions for it that you have! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 [quote name='skankdelvar' post='564971' date='Aug 10 2009, 01:52 PM']Crikey! We could all do with some of those. Any chance of a list?[/quote] Our bassist is a 6th form teacher, so when we're in Stoke, we guarantee at least 20 mental kids moshing up front. Also, when we play in Stoke we generally know the venues etc. If you want to come play in Stoke we can guarantee you a crowd but not a bed as our house tends to get crowded after gigs. Our bassist also reckons he can pack the London gigs, but the proof will be in the pudding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGit Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 [quote name='mike257' post='565125' date='Aug 10 2009, 04:23 PM']I think to have a satisfying experience as an originals band, everybody involved needs to have more or less the same aspirations and work ethic. My last originals band wasn't exactly a profit machine, but we took the business end of things very seriously, and always at least broke even. We worked our nuts off to build a committed fan base in our local area, and bypassed promoters by hiring the venues ourselves. We used to make a comfortable few hundred quid doing a local headline show every other month, and that covered our expenses travelling further afield to places where we didn't yet have the pulling power to attract a decent fee. Between that, and merch sales, we got all around the country, staying in Travelodges every time (no roughing it in the van!) and covered all our expenses, and it never cost us a penny of our own money. The thing is, it takes up countless hours of everybody's time, probably more time than you spend practicing, to do all the promoting and haggling and whatever else, and if you're the only guy in your band taking it that seriously, there's a real problem. Just realised this is turning into an essay, so I'll shut up now. I'd be wondering, If the rest of your band aren't pulling their weight, maybe they just haven't got the same ambitions for it that you have![/quote] +1 I've been doing band promotion for my bands for years and in some cases I've been the only one. It really is a case of sharing it out. I find that some people are great self-starters and basically get on with it by themselves. Others need a bit of a steer. You have to give them a job and make sure they know what to do . I used to have poster putter-uppers in one band they had a "section" of town where I'd give them a list of 30 or so places each and send them 50 posters. Then they got on with it cos they had a "job" and they were contributing to the band overall goodness. That was all theyt did though, in a few cases. If you expect people to know what to do and do it themselves they quite often won't do anything cos they have no idea about it. Also if you are mug enough to do it all they will let you. I've played in bands where some people brought 100 people to some gigs where otehers never even brought their best mate along ... It takes a bit of managing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted August 10, 2009 Author Share Posted August 10, 2009 (edited) [quote name='mike257' post='565125' date='Aug 10 2009, 04:23 PM']I think to have a satisfying experience as an originals band, everybody involved needs to have more or less the same aspirations and work ethic. My last originals band wasn't exactly a profit machine, but we took the business end of things very seriously, and always at least broke even. We worked our nuts off to build a committed fan base in our local area, and bypassed promoters by hiring the venues ourselves. We used to make a comfortable few hundred quid doing a local headline show every other month, and that covered our expenses travelling further afield to places where we didn't yet have the pulling power to attract a decent fee. Between that, and merch sales, we got all around the country, staying in Travelodges every time (no roughing it in the van!) and covered all our expenses, and it never cost us a penny of our own money. The thing is, it takes up countless hours of everybody's time, probably more time than you spend practicing, to do all the promoting and haggling and whatever else, and if you're the only guy in your band taking it that seriously, there's a real problem. Just realised this is turning into an essay, so I'll shut up now. I'd be wondering, If the rest of your band aren't pulling their weight, maybe they just haven't got the same ambitions for it that you have![/quote] [quote name='OldGit' post='565184' date='Aug 10 2009, 05:25 PM']+1 I've been doing band promotion for my bands for years and in some cases I've been the only one. It really is a case of sharing it out. I find that some people are great self-starters and basically get on with it by themselves. Others need a bit of a steer. You have to give them a job and make sure they know what to do . I used to have poster putter-uppers in one band they had a "section" of town where I'd give them a list of 30 or so places each and send them 50 posters. Then they got on with it cos they had a "job" and they were contributing to the band overall goodness. That was all theyt did though, in a few cases. If you expect people to know what to do and do it themselves they quite often won't do anything cos they have no idea about it. Also if you are mug enough to do it all they will let you. I've played in bands where some people brought 100 people to some gigs where otehers never even brought their best mate along ... It takes a bit of managing...[/quote] Both of these comments are helpful. Indeed...it almost takes a business mind. At first the main guitarist did most the stuff....I joined and started helping. I also worked AND did a post grad in Legal Practice Course which was not easy...finally thats done! So...I juggled a lot at once. The main guitarist has now slacked off due to ex-girlfriend problems (he is 30 so he should really sort himself out and get a grip). Me and the drummer took everything on...but now Im sick of it. There are two people left out of the five I havent discussed, one of them who does NOTHING....is on the dole and all he does is turn up, do some vocals, then leave the band to clear up. The other has no people skills. The guy on the dole basically never puts in money, and went mad at me for stating we HAVE to start covering our costs....otherwise its a dead end. I felt like I was being unethical saying we needed our petrol covered, and lets face it, that is just being sensible! Someone is going home with money, and its not us, its the promoter. Edited August 10, 2009 by Musicman20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MythSte Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 In three years of gigging i have to say, Its been VERY rare that ive not had at least petrol covered. Who's talking to the promotors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.