Do I Need A Teacher?

[Muriel]

I've been playing bass for a year and a half. I've self taught the basics and have worked and worked on them till my fingers bleed. I still don't think I any good but I want to progress to the next level.

There are several reasons for not wanting a bass teacher, one being I don't have any spare cash for lessons and the other is I love working things out for myself and doing thing my way. But now I feel I can't progress without proper guidance. Is there any alternatives or is having a proper teacher the only way?

[doctor_of_the_bass]

[quote name='Muriel' post='596849' date='Sep 12 2009, 09:42 PM']I've been playing bass for a year and a half. I've self taught the basics and have worked and worked on them till my fingers bleed. I still don't think I any good but I want to progress to the next level.

There are several reasons for not wanting a bass teacher, one being I don't have any spare cash for lessons and the other is I love working things out for myself and doing thing my way. But now I feel I can't progress without proper guidance. Is there any alternatives or is having a proper teacher the only way?[/quote]


Being a teacher myself I would normally say yes, get a good teacher but there is of course, gratification in being a self-taught player (which is how I did it) - however, as a teenager back in the '80s, I would have progressed much further and would have spent much less time messing about working stuff out and spending way too much time wanting to be a clone of a certain Mr King if I'd had had lessons from a decent player and they would have hopefully inspired me to become a more versatile player (turned out that I was something of a bass whizkid round 'ere but when it came to reading etc, I could only follow chord charts at that age!). You are the best judge of what you need to do. A good teacher will be able to help you; not necessarily change the way you play but be able to perhaps, through experience, show you easier or more efficient ways to do things etc etc.

[iamapirate]

Short:
[quote name='Muriel' post='596849' date='Sep 12 2009, 09:42 PM']Do I need a teacher?[/quote]
Yes

Long:
[quote name='Muriel' post='596849' date='Sep 12 2009, 09:42 PM']I've been playing bass for a year and a half. I've self taught the basics and have worked and worked on them till my fingers bleed. I still don't think I any good but I want to progress to the next level.

There are several reasons for not wanting a bass teacher, one being I don't have any spare cash for lessons and the other is I love working things out for myself and doing thing my way. But now I feel I can't progress without proper guidance. Is there any alternatives or is having a proper teacher the only way?[/quote]
I self taught myself for 6 months, and then realized that I go to a church with a world class bassist. I asked him for lessons, and, to my surprise he doesn't offer them, but made an exception for me. It benefited me so much. The main thing that i got from these bi-weekly sessions was just wanting to play bass more as he showed me songs and how to play them (so, on my second lesson i was playing Sir Duke!). I was in a very similar situation to you, and after these lessons, i'd go home and just play for hours and it really kept me going. And the great thing was that it felt like I was totally independent, even though he was giving me these songs, etc.
He kept saying that he wasn't a great teacher (and technically, OK maybe he wasn't the best teacher), but he did what most teachers don't do enough (like my former cello teacher), he made me want to play bass!

I think that it's not really a question of 'if' you should get a teacher, but 'who' you should get as your teacher. Don't be afraid to say no to one because you don't actually like him! I basically got taught by one of my best mates, and it kept me going. It's more vital that you have the spark and the want to play, than what you're actually playing... otherwise you might end up as some poor sod in an orchestra (too far?)

[bobbass4k]

To be honest I never got along with teachers, like you, I kind of hit a plateau after a couple of years, so I went to a very well regarded bass teacher, I quit after one lesson, he made me play his way, he made me wear my bass at a certain height, rest my thumb in a paticular place, attack the strings in a certain way, I may be biased, but there was nothing wrong with my technique before that, i never had any physical problems because of my technique, never couldn't play anything beacuse of my technique, but he insisted his was the only way, I quit and never looked back, to me self taught is the only way to go, but everyones different

[doctor_of_the_bass]

[quote name='bobbass4k' post='596875' date='Sep 12 2009, 10:13 PM']To be honest I never got along with teachers, like you, I kind of hit a plateau after a couple of years, so I went to a very well regarded bass teacher, I quit after one lesson, he made me play his way, he made me wear my bass at a certain height, rest my thumb in a paticular place, attack the strings in a certain way, I may be biased, but there was nothing wrong with my technique before that, i never had any physical problems because of my technique, never couldn't play anything beacuse of my technique, but he insisted his was the only way, I quit and never looked back, to me self taught is the only way to go, but everyones different[/quote]

He might have been well regarded as a teacher but to me, to insist there's only one way to play is a completely blinkered approach! What he should have asked you was `where do you want to go playing wise to leave the plateau and what needs building upon'! Its all common sense really! I've just started teaching someone who had one lesson from another `highly revered' local teacher - his approach to someone just starting out (first ever lesson!) was to tab out the blues scale!!!! Twot!

[bobbass4k]

[quote name='doctor_of_the_bass' post='596883' date='Sep 12 2009, 10:22 PM']He might have been well regarded as a teacher but to me, to insist there's only one way to play is a completely blinkered approach! What he should have asked you was `where do you want to go playing wise to leave the plateau and what needs building upon'! Its all common sense really! I've just started teaching someone who had one lesson from another `highly revered' local teacher - his approach to someone just starting out (first ever lesson!) was to tab out the blues scale!!!! Twot![/quote]


I realise I probably should have given it another go, and not all teachers are like that, but I think self teaching is a very rewarding experience, I would hate having my playing scheduled, as it is, if I don't feel like playing for a week, I don't, If I want to play for 16 hours straight, I do. After the first year or so of playing through books etc, I mostly learned by learning/figuring out and playing songs I actually liked and wanted to play, instead of the stodgy generic instructional stuff I'd been playing from the books, and that enjoyment of actually doing it is what still keeps me playing, I know quite a few people who are actually very talented at various instruments, but gave up because they were forced to have lessons which they found boring, still, as i said, to each their own

[doctor_of_the_bass]

[quote name='bobbass4k' post='596903' date='Sep 12 2009, 10:50 PM']I realise I probably should have given it another go, and not all teachers are like that, but I think self teaching is a very rewarding experience, I would hate having my playing scheduled, as it is, if I don't feel like playing for a week, I don't, If I want to play for 16 hours straight, I do. After the first year or so of playing through books etc, I mostly learned by learning/figuring out and playing songs I actually liked and wanted to play, instead of the stodgy generic instructional stuff I'd been playing from the books, and that enjoyment of actually doing it is what still keeps me playing, I know quite a few people who are actually very talented at various instruments, but gave up because they were forced to have lessons which they found boring, still, as i said, to each their own[/quote]

I fully agree with what you are saying! Give me the name of the teacher and I will make him eat his shoe! hehe!

[thepurpleblob]

The thing with teachers are that YOU (not them) need to be clear about what you want to learn and/or improve at (and be able to communicate this to the teacher). Either that or you need to be very open minded to new ideas. I've had lots of lessons and a lot of it was very valuable - don't get me wrong - but I'm just a guy who plays in covers bands and there's only so much

Edited September 12, 2009 by thepurpleblob

[skankdelvar]

If you can't afford a teacher at the moment, maybe see if there's anyone here on BC who's local to you and who'd be prepared sit down with you for a little jam or two. I've picked up some stuff from people this way, and it's a useful compromise. But it's not a long-term substitute for proper tuition.

Once you get the opportunity, just give the tuition approach a try and see how it works for you. If you benefit from it, great. If not - well, there's still the self-teaching approach. No biggie.

[Muriel]

great advice guys, thanks

[Geek99]

alternative is to buy lots of books and work through them - choosing the same topic in each. eg book 1 explains modes badly, read same chapter in book 2, book 3 etc until it gels with one particular explanation.. Then pick a fun chapter. works for me

[purpleblob]

[quote name='Muriel' post='596849' date='Sep 12 2009, 09:42 PM']There are several reasons for not wanting a bass teacher, one being I don't have any spare cash for lessons and the other is I love working things out for myself and doing thing my way. But now I feel I can't progress without proper guidance. Is there any alternatives or is having a proper teacher the only way?[/quote]

Straight answer to your question is [b]no[/b] you do not [i]need[/i] a teacher !

However learning either directly from somebody else, such as in a student/teacher relationship or from simply playing with others will ofcourse help you (as long as the teacher/others are good enough themselves). There are numerous musicians out there who are superb players who never used a teacher and there are equally superb players who probably swear by having a teacher. One could ofcourse argue the definition of a teacher, i.e. I was in a band where the guitarist was just an immense musician and he taught me loads by just playing music with him several nights a week.

If your technique is good then personally I would say get out and play with as many other musicians as possible, keep practising your technique, harmony and theory and train your ears. On the other hand if you find it difficult to motivate yourself to practise then maybe a teacher would be good for you and as long as you find a good tutor then ofcourse learning directly from others should help you.

[The Funk]

[quote name='Muriel' post='596849' date='Sep 12 2009, 09:42 PM']Is there any alternatives or is having a proper teacher the only way?[/quote]

The alternative is getting a few good books and a much more experienced bass mentor to discuss things with every now and then. I had six lessons ten years ago and my playing has never progressed as quickly as it did during that period. I think having a teacher can just speed up the whole process - so long as it's the right teacher for you!

[Doddy]

With a good teacher you will progress quicker as a player than going it alone. But,you have to want it.
There is nothing worse for a teacher, than a student who obviously doesn't want to be there,and doesn't listen
to a word you say,week after week. Everyone talks about bad teachers,but few mention bad students. It really
is a two way street.
Some people have a kind of reverse snobbery about lessons-they feel superior because they are self taught.These
people often have some deficiencies in their playing that could be helped with a few lessons.
The funny thing is that many of the best players have no ego and will still seek out a great teacher to continue to
improve their playing.

And contrary to popular belief,by taking lessons you will NOT sound like your teacher.

[thepurpleblob]

[quote name='Doddy' post='597359' date='Sep 13 2009, 02:20 PM']With a good teacher you will progress quicker as a player than going it alone. But,you have to want it.
There is nothing worse for a teacher, than a student who obviously doesn't want to be there,and doesn't listen
to a word you say,week after week. Everyone talks about bad teachers,but few mention bad students. It really
is a two way street.
Some people have a kind of reverse snobbery about lessons-they feel superior because they are self taught.These
people often have some deficiencies in their playing that could be helped with a few lessons.
The funny thing is that many of the best players have no ego and will still seek out a great teacher to continue to
improve their playing.

And contrary to popular belief,by taking lessons you will NOT sound like your teacher.[/quote]

Musicians are particularly good at talking garbage. The "I just picked it up and I could play" boast. The fact of the matter is there is heaps of stuff to know and to get good at. You need to find the way to get up to speed in a reasonably fast way that suits you. This might be a teacher, it might be books, it might be t'internet. Quite likely it's a combination. Just be enquiring and you'll be ok. If you are happy mindlessly learning songs from tab then you're probably not going to benefit from any resource.

[Jobiebass]

good site I used [url="http://www.studybass.com/"]http://www.studybass.com/[/url]
free too.

I hit a road block and couldnt progress further then I was at so I had 2 lessons and I realised it wasnt for me, basic scales and things I could have learnt for free on studybass. My technique was learnt from this site actually. Ive learnt a hell of a lot from this site over the years.

guitar pro 5 really progressed me too, I was working off tabs before that which are terrible and generally wrong. ok guitar pro files are sometimes wrong but much better then tab.

Edited September 13, 2009 by Jobiebass

[Eight]

Over the years I've taught myself a few instruments, and I've had lessons on a few instruments. On bass I have lessons.

There's a few things I've realised.

1)
The slight (I say slight for a reason) added pressure of having lessons helps make sure I practice things I'm poor at instead of gravitating to the things I do well.

2)
You're paying them. That ultimately means you are in control and the direction of your learning is up to you. They should adapt to what you want to learn, and anytime you want to interrupt the "plan" and study something else (or don't want to do something they suggest) then the final say is yours. The good teachers will know this and it'll be fine. Bad teachers railroad students - you might not know it, but there are students out there all studying exactly the same songs. theory and technique at the same time because the "teacher" can't be bothered to work on more than one plan - I could name names (not bass).

3)
As good as this forum is, nothing beats being able to sit down in front of someone who can look at what you're doing and make comments.

4)
If you don't look forward to your lesson, you have the wrong teacher/

5)
If you're not enthused and motivated when you come out of your lesson, you have the wrong teacher.