phil_the_bassist Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Hey all! Erm, I maybe up for a possible gig maybe possibly at maybe the end of possibly november. Maybe. It will (if all the maybe's and possibly's come together) be my first Proper bass chair at a theatre, for real actual monies and eveything, and I REALLY don't wanna f*** it up by blanking out at the audition/rehearsals. So I'm listening to an OCR of the West End version to get the idea of whats going on, but I'd love some advice on theatre/pit etiquette, the do's and don'ts of working with a conductor/orchestra, and if by any chance anyone has an example of the sorta notation I'd be looking at getting, I'd be very very grateful! I[i] can[/i] read, but I'm not confident at cold reading charts, and I've only experienced good, clear notation from StandingO.T.S.O.M., and some of the online Sibelius resources. Should I practice reading handwritten charts? will I be expected to make alterations? Many drinks will be owed for any help and advice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 Are you standing in for someone? If yes, will you be expected to read that persons charts? Or are you being supplied with music for your own notes? I'd probably do what you're doing, brush up on cold-reading, but really delve into the show so you have an idea of the parts. Please tell me it's 'Wicked'! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_the_bassist Posted October 30, 2009 Author Share Posted October 30, 2009 well, it seems like they're looking for someone with orcestral experience, and if they can't they'll scrape the barrel and get me It's Fiddler On The Roof, for a production down Dorset way, nothing too flashy but it'll be my first proper chair, and not a dep I'll be given a pad with the bass score sometime before the rehearsal, and my teacher (who knows the fixer) is hoping to get me the charts in plenty of time. It's all a bit nerve wracking, and I'm currently chewing through all the complex charts to get my chops back up! Gotta love some of those Jamerson transcripts! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 (edited) I have done this show over in Europe...[ on Electric - but this really is a double Bass chair] Most of it is written in double time and cut common. If you are new to this type of playing, i would listen to a CD or recording of the show - A LOT.To get a good feel for it. Charts these days are usually printed, but You will need a [b]penci[/b]l [or many] for changes made at rehearsals. Good line of sight for the MD/conductor, Tempo changes and direction. Personally for me, i use a volume pedal, not for dynamics but just for on and off between tunes, you dont want to make unwanted noises. and an inline tuner, i also take my own DI box [sans amp] - but usually supplied. But most of all follow the conductor/MD. The norm would be to follow the Kit player out side of a pit situation. But if he aint following the conductor full on - it can get messy tempo wise. And the MD could jump out of his pram. So if you are new at the sight reading thing, really use the time at rehearsals to get to know the geography of the charts. Maybe take a music stand extension for those tunes that have pages and pages of notes, page turns tend to be when you are in the key of Gb But the main thing is just relax - all the other guys in the band are in the same position as you. Just enjoy! EDIT..... Just seen your post above... Looks like its Am Dram time... In that case forget everything i said....and just try and shag as many of the cast as you can in the run Garry Edited October 30, 2009 by lowdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velvetkevorkian Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 a: Take a pencil. Write any cuts/changes/reminders/time changes in, or circle them. You won't remember everything on the gig. b: Make sure you can see the MD, and know what he's counting in. As Garry says, a lot of this stuff is in cut time (so the conductor beats on beats 1+3 of a bar in 4/4) and sometimes they change quite suddenly. c: If the MD is useless (), work out which member of the band you can take cues from- if there's a cellist you'll often be on similar parts. d: Musical theatre has a tendency to use horrible key signatures- be prepared and know what sharps and flats are in each part. Have you ever worked with a conductor/MD before? Do you know how to read their conducting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmarley Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 I'd agree with the above post. I've done a few shows...some good like Godspell and some bad like high school musical...but it's all about drawing all over your parts and making as many notes as possible. The key signature thing was a big deal for me as well. I always had a blind spot with Gb minor... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonestar Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 [quote name='lowdown' post='641059' date='Oct 30 2009, 01:22 PM']I have done this show over in Europe...[ on Electric - but this really is a double Bass chair] Most of it is written in double time and cut common. If you are new to this type of playing, i would listen to a CD or recording of the show - A LOT.To get a good feel for it. Charts these days are usually printed, but You will need a [b]penci[/b]l [or many] for changes made at rehearsals. Good line of sight for the MD/conductor, Tempo changes and direction. Personally for me, i use a volume pedal, not for dynamics but just for on and off between tunes, you dont want to make unwanted noises. and an inline tuner, i also take my own DI box [sans amp] - but usually supplied. But most of all follow the conductor/MD. The norm would be to follow the Kit player out side of a pit situation. But if he aint following the conductor full on - it can get messy tempo wise. And the MD could jump out of his pram. So if you are new at the sight reading thing, really use the time at rehearsals to get to know the geography of the charts. Maybe take a music stand extension for those tunes that have pages and pages of notes, page turns tend to be when you are in the key of Gb But the main thing is just relax - all the other guys in the band are in the same position as you. Just enjoy! EDIT..... Just seen your post above... Looks like its Am Dram time... In that case forget everything i said....and just try and shag as many of the cast as you can in the run Garry[/quote] Great Post Garry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 See if you can get a look at the keyboard part. As a very general rule; if your sight reading is not brilliant and the keys are doubling the bass line make sure you hit the first beat of the bar and don't worry too much about the fancy stuff. As you do more shows and get more confident/more practice you can embellish it a bit. No one except the MD will know you're not playing the full part, and if he is also (usually in Am dram) the keys player you're sorted. If you hit bum notes trying to play the complex stuff everyone will know. Watch out for them having already rehearsed and then changed keys when you get there. The pencil is your friend - Just go for the root notes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutToPlayJazz Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 (edited) I was just reading your original post & it's fine - You won't get any "chord charts" in Fiddler. As mentioned earlier, it's a double bass part, so all classically written in proper notation, as most shows are. Only the very modern stuff occasionally has chord symbols over the line. I've played this show on both bass & cello - It's a very nice show to get started on. Very easy going & nothing too hard in there. As for pit etiquette, just join in and be part of the gang. They're all paid players like yourself. Just one thing, ignore arrogant stage managers & producers. You're on the payroll & they're not Last of all, keep your volume down. If you can't clearly hear the singers on the stage, you're playing too loud. Oh, and make sure all electrical gear (amps, stand lights, etc) are PAT tested. Nothing worse than the thought of being sent away for the sake of a silly little green sticker... Rich. Edited October 31, 2009 by OutToPlayJazz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 I would love to do Fiddler but, as it is a d/b part, I am unlikely to get that call.. I have done several others: Annie, Little Shop of Horrors, Grease, Noel Coward reviews, Songs from the Shows, Pantomimes etc. I find the charts are normally fairly accessible and those that are hard to read because of odd classical notation are seldom hard enough to throw anyone with a good ear. (although 'Who Will Buy', from Oliver, is a nightmare!). If you have the charts in advance, you should be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
endorka Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 There may well be parts where you have many, many, many bars of rests, then are expected to come in at the correct moment. This can be quite difficult, especially if someone mucks up the timing when you are trying to count through it, or an actor mixes up their lines, or whatever. This can be further compounded if the rest bars are in odd time signatures, or there is a lot of rubato (see Sweeney Todd). My answer is to notate the spoken line (or a significant musical event) at a known point before my cue, so I'm ready to play. The band call is the best time to sort this out. But still count... Jennifer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisnameistaken Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 [quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='642124' date='Oct 31 2009, 07:45 PM']Just one thing, ignore arrogant stage managers & producers.[/quote] Strange. Loads of my friends are stage managers and I don't think I know s single arrogant one. Directors, on the other hand... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakenewmanbass Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 Garry said it all, the only thing I would re-iterate is knowing how the conductor is beating AT ALL TIMES. not knowing where you are is horrible. Don't be scared to ask the MD to be clear and very explicit about how it's being beaten where, and mark your parts accordingly. As I said losing your place is a horrible feeling but not as horrible as the time I had engine failure in a summer downpour (it took 30mins to dry out) and as I pulled up (dumping the car at the stage door) at the Grand Theatre in Blackpool I could hear the overture of the show playing and had to run upstairs and get changed before I could go to the pit as we were onstage in the second act... Soooooooo painful. Mostly enjoy it. Am dram can be fun as it's mostly people doing it for the love and as Garry said there are likely to be some nice young things who may or may not be impressed by the size of your instrument Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 (edited) [quote name='jakesbass' post='642443' date='Nov 1 2009, 12:06 PM']the only thing I would re-iterate is knowing how the conductor is beating AT ALL TIMES. not knowing where you are is horrible.[/quote] That really is great advice. These days in shows, Just using headphones [and no amps] is quite common. So sitting in the dark for up to three hours, with no verbal contact, can be very lonely and intimidating for the first few shows or even worse if you are depping for the first time. So knowing the md/conductors actions and up/down beats is very important. Otherwise it can really be squeaky ring time. I have often thought about running off and joining a factory.. Garry Edited November 1, 2009 by lowdown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimR Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 [quote name='lowdown' post='642607' date='Nov 1 2009, 04:36 PM']... So sitting in the dark for up to three hours, with no verbal contact, can be very lonely and intimidating for the first few shows or even worse if you are depping for the first time. ... Garry[/quote] That's what the PSP was invented for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowdown Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 [quote name='TimR' post='642936' date='Nov 1 2009, 10:42 PM']That's what the PSP was invented for.[/quote] And that's what the P45 was invented for. Garry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witterth Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 (edited) Garrys advice is really on the money. all I would add is, read ,read, read ,til you know it backwards if you will and, maybe this is just me, if you think youre loud enough on your 50w combo(!) turn it down more electic bass that is. oh and dont use a 5 string if the md is an old guy! "Cats"btw..are you out of the 1950s? Edited November 2, 2009 by witterth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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