Plek setup

[Lee-Man]

After several years of (ab)use my Sadowsky needs some love in the frets department. Has any one tried the Plek system, if so was it beter than the traditional luthier approach?

Cheers
Lee

[ped]

Hi Lee,

I have heard mixed reports about this system. on paper, it sounds wonderful, but I think it was Kiwi who was talking to one particular guitar shop who were having terrible trouble with the machine and some others who have not considered it worth the money. On the other hand I have heard that it is 'amazing' etc. A tricky one. I would like to think the traditional Luthier approach would be the most loving way to give your bass a spruce up!

[Lee-Man]

[quote name='ped' post='5993' date='May 24 2007, 07:56 PM']Hi Lee,

I have heard mixed reports about this system. on paper, it sounds wonderful, but I think it was Kiwi who was talking to one particular guitar shop who were having terrible trouble with the machine and some others who have not considered it worth the money. On the other hand I have heard that it is 'amazing' etc. A tricky one. I would like to think the traditional Luthier approach would be the most loving way to give your bass a spruce up![/quote]

The guy that did all of my old bands guitars & basses used to do a fantastic job, but he dissapeared a few years ago and since then every one I've used (including a leading bass retailer/builder) just havent come up to par. It's a difficult one, not sure I like the idea of cnc machines taking over the world, however I don't want to pay some one that can only do a half arsed job.

[ped]

Yeah it is a big consideration with something as important as a fret job. At least with a person you can usually communicate what you are after and have it refined over time whereas if you answer back the Plek machine it looks like it would have your balls for breakfast!

[Kiwi]

Yeh, I had a good long chat with the head tech at Charlie Chandlers about it a few months back when I fancied getting my Smith 6 done.

He reckoned it was the biggest waste of money they ever spent because the machine can't deal with the curve of the neck under tension. It wil do an 'ok' job but he recommended I don't get any expensive instruments done on it. Reckoned I could get a better, cheaper job done by a good luthier.

[Lee-Man]

Cheers for that guy's. It's a shame to hear that it's rubish.

[Alemboid]

Having said that, I have one if those short scale, tuned an octave up things (well a St**t) for those squealy high-pitched moments that had been Plekd (?) before I got it, and the action and feel are quite excellent. Not a controlled experiment obviously and it might have been good pre-Plek but it seems the results [i]can[/i] be very good.

On the other hand, one of the flock of six string basses (a Status) looks as if it might have had the same treatment judging by the fret profiling, and that's not convincingly better than it would otherwise have been.

CK, I thought the machine did put the neck under tension? Can't see that it'd be any use at all otherwise.

B.

[acidbass]

A little off topic -

Can anyone recommend me a good luthier to do such a setup (ie, a non-Plek one)? I have a bass that could do with some fretwork and neck adjustment.

Cheers,

Danny

Edited May 24, 2007 by acidbass

[Kiwi]

[quote name='Alemboid' post='6049' date='May 24 2007, 09:15 PM']CK, I thought the machine did put the neck under tension? Can't see that it'd be any use at all otherwise.[/quote]

I've just gone back to my original Bassworld post which offers a little more clarity.

[url="http://basstalk.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=18752&b=1&st=0&p=&#entry"]http://basstalk.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...p;p=&#entry[/url]

[i]
Nov 4 2006, 01:30 PM

CK:
just came back from Chandler Guitars after taking my Smith 6 down there. They're only a few stops away from me on the District line and I planned to get the bass plekked and put a review on the site.

When I got there, I had a nice chat to their tech, (I think his name was Leon), who told me basically that the machine had a flaw in it and would probably not give me the results I was expecting.

I have to say it was a bit of a surprise. The plek machine takes a measurement of the neck with strings and then again without strings and works out what the neck relief should be given the bending characteristics. However apparently what it doesn't do is allow for the bending characteristics of the truss rod which only affect the neck relief from the 15th fret down. Above that, its up to shimming/microtilt to make sure the fingerboard is parallel to the strings.

If the guy I spoke to registers on BW, I'll let him explain it in a little more detail.
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Dood: I look forward to hearing more about it! Cheers Steve.
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CK:
Yeah, he said they've had numerous arguments with the inventor over this flaw. Apparently he invented the machine because he had an Ibanez guitar which noone could set up properly in Germany... :shock: ...this was before he thought that it might be cheaper to just fit a better neck.

Chandlers seem pretty confident they can do a hand crowning that is better than the Plek.
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Mikey:
Sounds a bit odd :?

I wonder if something 'political' happened when Charlie Chandler left them to set up his guitar experience shop in Hampton Wick - he's still offering plek setups and was apparently 'closely involved with the development of the Plek system, having helped introduce the system to the U.S.A'.

[url="http://www.guitarexperience.co.uk/html/ind...=showpage&pid=2"]http://www.guitarexperience.co.uk/html/ind...wpage&pid=2[/url]

Not that I'd ever take a bass anywhere but the gallery to get the frets done by hand.
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CK:
Yes the guy I spoke to mentioned that Charlie is a champion of the Plek system still. They had their plek machine sitting in the back of the shop which costs £60,000 to purchase now so I'd imagine if they'd probably still be pretty keen to make money off it if it didn't result in a negative backlash.

I told the guy straight up what I wanted to do by way of review and it might be that he was just being sensible considering that this site gets about 30,000 hits a day. He said that when they started using it, every celeb guitar that came in to be done ended up being refretted pretty shortly after because of the buzz in the upper registers of the neck. Imagine if I got the bass done and then started slagging it off, it would make Chandlers look bad as well as Plek.

All credit to Chandlers for being upfront with me about it.
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bassbloke:
Funnily enough, even after being plekked, I still had issues with the action of my Jazz. Finally this afternoon I twigged that removing the neck might reveal something interesting and sure enough, there was a piece of plastic being used as a shim.

I duly removed it and I've been able to drop the action right down with next to no buzz.

I'd gotten the impression that there was a period of severeal years between Chrlie Chandler leaving Chandler's music in KEw and setting up his own store in Hampton Wik, where I took mine. Wasn't he working in the states for a while?
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CK:
Yes, I think he was involved with promoting Plek heavily in the US.
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Merton:
Chandlers is the only place I'll go for a set up, their other luthier dude is Paul Herman who has done a lot of work for Fender here in the Uk, a bit for Wal (or so i'm told!) plus he builds his own instruments. Never ever had an isue with any of the numerous weird and wonderful set up and repair jobs he's done for me. The man is a genius. And no Plek in sight!

Interesting comments though, especially after other threads on this subject a few months back...
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JPJ:
As both a failed engineer and someone who sets up his own bass, I have often wondered about the Plek system.

I have tried using all the engineering know-how I have to add 'precision' (no not a fender precision, engineering precision!) to setting up my bass from a repeatability point of view with little or no success.

I have concluded that there are too many variables/factors to consider when setting up a bass, and ultimately, its a feel thing rather than precise science.

The issue I have always had with the Plek idea, is that neck bow under string tension releases in a non-linear way when the string tension is removed (rather the reverse of how a neck settles after new strings are put on your bass). The tension releases significantly at first, but the release continues, albeit at a much slower rate, over a protracted period which can be days or even weeks. The age of the neck wood has a lot to do with this as newer necks release the tension much quicker than older necks. Therefore, the idea of precisely meassuring neck relief before and immediately after tension removal appears to be flawed in my thinking.
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[/i]

[OldGit]

Lee, Danny, where are you?
People on here know good luthiers all over the country and will be able to recommend one

Of you could post a "Luthier recommendation needed for [i]yourtown[/i]" post

[Kiwi]

[url="http://basstalk.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=16275&b=1&st=0&p=&#entry"]http://basstalk.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=...p;p=&#entry[/url]

[i]Aug 13 2006, 09:38 PM

Breakerfall:

I have had a Plek set-up done on my Jazz and while it was there I had Sadowsky strings fitted which is what I use normally. I asked for a medium action set up as I play fingerstyle and slap in a few different styles and this is pretty versatile.

When it came back I couldn't believe the amount of fret buzz. Even when fretting in the 5th position I get loads of buzz.

Is there anything I should be aware of before I pick up the phone and complain?

This is a world renowned chap that did the job and it cost a pretty penny. Surely with a medium action set up I shouldn't be getting this happening?

Anyone else have any experience of a Plek set-up?[/i]

[acidbass]

[quote name='OldGit' post='7842' date='May 27 2007, 09:50 PM']Of you could post a "Luthier recommendation needed for [i]yourtown[/i]" post[/quote]

That'd be a good idea.

Sticky perhaps?

[Kiwi]

If you do the post, we'll make it sticky...

...oh dear, what an unfortunate term...

[BOD2]

[quote name='Crazykiwi' post='7863' date='May 27 2007, 10:37 PM']If you do the post, we'll make it sticky...[/quote]

tsk tsk CK ... don't you read the forums

There already is a luthier "sticky" above. Although they call it "pinned" now on IPB.

Anyone feel free to add any recommendations to the topic.

[Kiwi]

If I read all the forums you mods would have even less to do

[wesfinn]

all of the guitars i have played that have been plek'd have played absolutely amzingly, tho ive never played a bass that has had the treatment. i think its probably more of a guitarists thing as the tensions on the neck are so different to that of a bass. i would personally stick with setting up my own bass or getting a decent lutheir to do the work.