Don't post your bass via Parcelforce/RoyalMail

[OldGit]

[quote name='BB2000' post='10232' date='May 31 2007, 10:21 PM']One plus point with parcelforce is that it is either parcelforce or the royal mail who handle your pacel from collection until delivery.[/quote]

And thats a plus point because...?

[BB2000]

[quote name='OldGit' post='10250' date='May 31 2007, 10:48 PM']And thats a plus point because...?[/quote]

Well, where I live it's a plus point because I've never yet had a problem with parcelforce/royal mail (wrt damage) but I have with the local dingle-berries who handle delivery for the likes of DHL. The only problem I have with PF is this bl**dy stupid £150 limit! A lot of the small courier companies (apart from the one man one job lot - who would charge about £500 to deliver a bass to London from where I live) work through one another, so a parcel sent with them might go through say a dozen separate operators. Even though your local one may treat your goods with kid gloves you're unlikely even to know which other companies will be handling your parcel.

Few years back I had a $15000 dollar electronic instrument delivered (UPS) to my home address (should have gone to my work, but that was my mistake). Shipping was about $300-400 because it weighed about 80lb. At Aberdeen it had been transferred to some local muppet with a van who left it outside my front door in the (usual) pissing rain sometime on a Friday where it lay until I got home the next day. When I complained I was told that I had signed for it. At least I know with the royal mail group (at least where I live) they wouldn't have been so cavalier.

[TheButler]

When i sent a bass via CityLink i wrapped it in a Plastic TO LET sign. Yes seriosuly, i bent the sign round it and taped the ends giving massive amounts of tension in the plastic, apprently when the guy recieved the bass it was it tip-top condition, his face after being whacked by the plastic was apprently not, oh well ...

[ashevans09]

Good lord

That's a helluva hit that's taken, it's always sad to see a good bass go down

I'm now slightly worried myself now, I've just sent a mixer to Copenhagen with parcelforce :S . Luckily it's below £150 in value and it's boxed with ridiculous amounts of bubble wrap but still...

This sucks, I hope everything works out for you,

Ash

[Paul Cooke]

mine arrived fine on Friday... Warwickhunt had removed the neck and seriously bubble-wrapped everything before encasing it in cardboard and with a cardboard tube added for stiffening...

no damage from parcelforce... just the hassle of finding which person in the block of flats had taken it in... (my daughter had not been awake when it was delivered)

[OldGit]

Well I sent the P Lyte off with Interparcel and it turned up safe and well and fast ...
That will be my choice for sub £1000 stuff from now on anyway ..

[Bigwan]

Parcelfarce are indeed well named.

I've just returned home from a trip to our 'local' depot (33 miles away to be exact) where I was told that the item I was looking for (a schecter model T 4 string) was out for delivery again - apparently I had phoned and asked them to attempt delivery again, which I hadn't... so while I was on my way to the depot, the parcelfarce man was at my house trying to deliver the bass. NOT IMPRESSED!!!

[Ba55me15ter]

My Phil Jones Briefcase eventually arrived - phew! It took 14 days using their 48 hour service. You can only claim 25% of your postage back no matter how late it was - though that goes up to 100% for the next day services.
The box had obviously taken a few knocks, and the external short jack lead connecting amp and speaker section had been bent/snapped off in one of the sockets - thankfully the socket seems ok. Apart from that it survived the journey fine, and it sounds absolutely fab!

[Shaggy]

Can only speak from my own experience, but when I bought my Listerud 7-string from a fellow BWorlder last Xmas shipped from Norway, TNT wanted £300 and wouldn't insure instruments, the Post Office wanted £40 and insured up to £1000. So went with the PO - bass arrived safe and sound woithout even a dent in the cardboard outer box, but bizarrely with a bust top string. Also could track the package the whole way via the Norwegian PO and then Parcelforce web-sites. Haven't stressed so much waiting for it to arrive since the last time the wife was in labour though!

[wateroftyne]

My P arrived safe and sound first thing the following morning, thanks to senditnow.

phew.

[OldGit]

[quote name='Shaggy' post='14078' date='Jun 8 2007, 11:13 AM']Can only speak from my own experience, but when I bought my Listerud 7-string from a fellow BWorlder last Xmas shipped from Norway, TNT wanted £300 and wouldn't insure instruments, the Post Office wanted £40 and insured up to £1000. So went with the PO - bass arrived safe and sound woithout even a dent in the cardboard outer box, but bizarrely with a bust top string. Also could track the package the whole way via the Norwegian PO and then Parcelforce web-sites. Haven't stressed so much waiting for it to arrive since the last time the wife was in labour though![/quote]

Ah yes .. had it got broken though you may have found that the apparent £1000 insurance cover was actually £150, just as I did ... unless that was the Norwegian Post Offices insurance policy ..

I expect my argument with Parcelforce will be further delayed by industrial action now ...

[PauBass]

I've had two bad experiences with them in a 4 month period:

1- When I sold my EBS Fafner and I sent it to Spain:

The amp was mounted on a hard rack unit, then wrapped with bouble wrap and then packed in a box. Well, delivery time took 5 more days than the service I had pay for and when it got there the box was a completly mess, it was clear that had been dropped, it was falling apart and they had solved the problem with gaffer tape everywhere.
When the guy open the parcel, everything look fine but when he was going to try it he noticed something on the inside of the amp was loose. He checeked the amp and the transformer was completly free, the screw that holds it was broken and also the simulate valve light had been destroyed completly. Of course when I talked to Parcelforce they made imposible for me to claim anything back... Then, the buyer, had it checked by an EBS dealer to make sure of the extent of the damge and, luckily enough, the repair wasn't very serious and it ended up on a 60 euros repair....

2- Bass Rockstand:

I bought this stand from Ebay two weeks ago and the seller send it by Parcelforce 24 hours.... guess what? Delivery took 72 hours!
I was at home at all times the delivery day and noone came, then I tracked the parcel and for my surprise, it said "delivery attempted".
Then, it was automatically redelivered on the next day but, again the parcel did not arrived.
unreliabl
On the third day it arrived but at 6.45pm.. funnily enough their delivery hours are till 6 pm.


Now, if you ask for my opinion about Parcelforce at least two words come to my mind (...no, no, not the ones you are thinking, I don't want to be rude) they are [b][size=4]Useless[/size][/b] and [b][size=4]Unreliable[/size][/b].

[OldGit]

Oh yeah I'm well versed in the "knock out ginger" method of delivering parcels .. parcelforce carded me today, even though I was in waiting for the delivery ... and don't get me started on to the stupid hours, never answered phones and methods you have to use to get your parcel from the depot ...
Hummmmmmmmm

[paul, the]

I hope this thread continues to vent anger about PF, as it is important to do so for anger management and also to repetitively deter potential PF customers that read the thread.

---

[b]But thinking constructively[/b]

[url="http://www.interparcel.com/"]Interparcel[/url] seem to be a reliable, fully insured (upto £1000) global courier service that aren't ridiculously priced. (I don't know if they use third party companies???)

What about for more expensive gear and instruments, any ideas? (Global, fully insured, fair price)

And what about us as buyers. How do we persuade sellers on eg. Ebay to not use Parcelforce?

[OldGit]

[quote name='paul, the' post='14306' date='Jun 8 2007, 05:41 PM']And what about us as buyers. How do we persuade sellers on eg. Ebay to not use Parcelforce?[/quote]

+1 for Interparcel (only one experience though)

That shouln't be hard. Make it a condition of payment that it's not sent parcel force because of the limit on the insurance.
Negative ebay feedback is pretty powerful stuff.

Edited June 8, 2007 by OldGit

[warwickhunt]

Let's keep things in perspective guys (and gals). Remind me why Interparcel is great and PF is cr*p?

I've sent or received a few basses and more than one or 2 amps and cabs via PF (senditnow) and not had a single complaint, as have various other through this thread.

All courier services are going to have the odd idiots who will get a kick (no pun intended) out of knocking a box or parcel about, but before the whole Royal Mail / Parcel Force / Sendit now company is tarred as being totally unreliable and generally sh*tty, do you know the alternatives are so great? You also have to consider what is the percentage of parcels handled to those damaged? Yes there may be one or two more examples of damaged packages with PF but what percentage of the total volume of parcels sent do they handle.

Until someone posts (sic) an alternative, reliable courier who will stand up and be counted as carrying fragile/valuable instruments, then do not declare any one courier better or worse than the rest.

No I do not work for PF, nor does anyone I know but it's a bit knee jerk to slate one courier above all others.

[OldGit]

[quote name='warwickhunt' post='14323' date='Jun 8 2007, 06:37 PM']Let's keep things in perspective guys (and gals). Remind me why Interparcel is great and PF is cr*p?

I've sent or received a few basses and more than one or 2 amps and cabs via PF (senditnow) and not had a single complaint, as have various other through this thread.

All courier services are going to have the odd idiots who will get a kick (no pun intended) out of knocking a box or parcel about, but before the whole Royal Mail / Parcel Force / Sendit now company is tarred as being totally unreliable and generally sh*tty, do you know the alternatives are so great? You also have to consider what is the percentage of parcels handled to those damaged? Yes there may be one or two more examples of damaged packages with PF but what percentage of the total volume of parcels sent do they handle.

Until someone posts (sic) an alternative, reliable courier who will stand up and be counted as carrying fragile/valuable instruments, then do not declare any one courier better or worse than the rest.

No I do not work for PF, nor does anyone I know but it's a bit knee jerk to slate one courier above all others.[/quote]

Er well minus one for parcel force because:

The maximum amount of insurance is £150 for musical instruments (no matter what amount you buy at the counter)

Other than that I've sent loads of stuff with them before, and I'll continue to but I will not now send a bass.
They've had their chance and anwyay I don't tend to send basses worth less than £150 - the bloody CASE is usually worth that much - oh and "the case, when used as outer packing is not covered" either ...

Many things have got through OK so my opinion is based soley on what they did to this bass and the way they are handling my polite request for them to take responsibility for smashing it in the first place and then pay out under the terms of the insurance I thought I had bought.

A company is measured by the way it handles the problems, not the easy stuff.

And yes there is a clear opportunity for someone to start a company that undertakes to ship basses safely and for reasonable money.

[paul, the]

[quote name='warwickhunt' post='14323' date='Jun 8 2007, 06:37 PM']Let's keep things in perspective guys (and gals). Remind me why Interparcel is great and PF is cr*p?

I've sent or received a few basses and more than one or 2 amps and cabs via PF (senditnow) and not had a single complaint, as have various other through this thread.

All courier services are going to have the odd idiots who will get a kick (no pun intended) out of knocking a box or parcel about, but before the whole Royal Mail / Parcel Force / Sendit now company is tarred as being totally unreliable and generally sh*tty, do you know the alternatives are so great? You also have to consider what is the percentage of parcels handled to those damaged? Yes there may be one or two more examples of damaged packages with PF but what percentage of the total volume of parcels sent do they handle.

Until someone posts (sic) an alternative, reliable courier who will stand up and be counted as carrying fragile/valuable instruments, then do not declare any one courier better or worse than the rest.

No I do not work for PF, nor does anyone I know but it's a bit knee jerk to slate one courier above all others.[/quote]

It's all about insurance for me. I also feel like I've had information purposely kept from me and so I no longer respect PF.

I know every courier service slips up (figuratively speaking here) and you'll always hear more negative than good - hell, the last bass I sent was with PF and everything ran perfectly. But after what this thread has uncovered, I wont be going back.

Admittedly I like to hear plenty more positive impartial Interparcel customer feedback before openly falling in love with them. But for now, they're the best I know of. I also use www.postvan.com for cheap heavy/bulky items as they're the cheapest I've found, insure up to £100 but have size limits.

[quote name='OldGit' post='14317' date='Jun 8 2007, 06:18 PM']That shouln't be hard. Make it a condition of payment that it's not sent parcel force because of the limit on the insurance.
Negative ebay feedback is pretty powerful stuff.[/quote]

I think I'll direct them here as well.

[ZPQ]

It's out of order not telling people about the insurance limits - especially when they always make a big deal of it when I go to the counter.

It'll be interesting to see if you get anywhere with your claim against them - good luck!

John

[OldGit]

[quote name='ZPQ' post='14354' date='Jun 8 2007, 07:54 PM']It's out of order not telling people about the insurance limits - especially when they always make a big deal of it when I go to the counter.

It'll be interesting to see if you get anywhere with your claim against them - good luck!

John[/quote]

Well I think the Post office Official Management View of this is "it's in the leaflet so RTFL or tough"

[OldGit]

Well an update is in order.

Postwatch were toothless and just got the same reply, rolled over and said "sorry but that's what royal mail said ... "

So I looked further into it and I now have an apology to make to Parcel Force:

[b]"Sorry Parcel Force. Your restrictions on wrapping and insuring basses may be hidden well and stupid but ... it wan't you that killed this bass ... it was Royal Mail."[/b]

The bass wasn't sent by Parcel Force after all .. It was sent Royal Mail Special Delivery Next Day "for valuable items"

The plot thickens ... especially as the guidance for packing guitars referred to in the rejection letter is on the Parcel Force website and not on the Royal Mail Special Delivery Next Day Wrapping Guidance web page (or, indeed, anywhere on paper in a Post Office or on the Royal Mail website itself...

Hummmmmmm

Edited July 5, 2007 by OldGit

[P-T-P]

[quote name='OldGit' post='27319' date='Jul 5 2007, 09:32 AM']The bass wasn't sent by Parcel Force after all .. It was sent Royal Mail Special Delivery Next Day "for valuable items"

The plot thickens ... especially as the guidance for packing guitars referred to in the rejection letter is on the Parcel Force website and not on the Royal Mail Special Delivery Next Day Wrapping Guidance web page (or, indeed, anywhere on paper in a Post Office or on the Royal Mail website itself...[/quote]

But by my reckoning, a bass would be too large to send using this service which has a size restriction of 610mm x 460mm x 460mm.

All the more confusing since a couple of weeks ago I sent a bass case using this service while yesterday I sent another bass case and was denied this service. According to the woman who served me there have been no recent changes in the size restrictions.

[OldGit]

[quote name='P-T-P' post='27359' date='Jul 5 2007, 11:22 AM']But by my reckoning, a bass would be too large to send using this service which has a size restriction of 610mm x 460mm x 460mm.

All the more confusing since a couple of weeks ago I sent a bass case using this service while yesterday I sent another bass case and was denied this service. According to the woman who served me there have been no recent changes in the size restrictions.[/quote]

Well it was a Hohner cricket bat but yes, apparently it is still too big to send using that service
Strange eh?

[Rich]

I've sent three basses so far via parcel2go... all arrived safe and sound, on time and totally unscathed. Their insurance goes up to £1000.

[OldGit]

Well I don't know if you are as tired of this farce as I am, however, if you are reading this you may be interested to know where things have got to.


I've reached the Director of Customer Services at the Post Office in my quest for common sence and fair treatment (in my opinion).

Their stance remains the same: I didn't wrap it correctly. Had I wrapped it correctly they would have paid out.

Their definition of "correctly" varies a bit between their letters but nowhere in any literature or on the website do they state the "official" guidance for packaging Electric or acoustic guitars or basses.

So what should a person do? Well ask the Post Office for guidance, of course.
I asked 6 PO counters people and the PO telephone help desk for guidance on wrapping a bass guitar for posting via Special Delivery Next Day. They all said the same thing: Wrap it well in bubblewrap and mark it fragile.
That's what I did..

PO Customer Services still maintain that I should have put it in a box. In fact had I put it in a cardboard box they would have paid out without any trouble. They say.

Can anyone tell me if I'm being unreasonable here?

If 7 employees of the company tell me that wrapping it in bubblewrap is OK, is that the guidance I should have followed or some unpublished guidance seemingly made up by the customer service department, and not specifically published anywhere?

So ... Do I contact Allan Leighton, top man at the Post Office, directly (they gave me his office number ) or do I just progress to the small claims track in the county courts?

Has anyone ever won in this situation?
Has anyone any experience of the small claims track?

OG