Help: Annoying background noise from new Phil Jones Combo

[BottomEndian]

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='710210' date='Jan 12 2010, 04:42 PM']I've heard that with many amps, it's just an artifact of the supply caps discharging.[/quote]
Ah, right. Thanks, Bill. My not having heard it before is just an artifact of having previously owned heap-o'-s**t amps.

Edited January 12, 2010 by BottomEndian

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='Beedster' post='709985' date='Jan 12 2010, 08:46 AM']Update on this. PJB suspect the noise might be a function of the 240v UK power supply and the switching power supply on the Flightcase. The noise they have acknowledged in previous communications is apparently not audible in normal use, whereas the noise from my amp most certainly is. Anyway, they, or at least the UK distributor, will be getting mine back to try with a few different power supplies

Chris[/quote]

Hmm... Interesting.

It's just occurred to me that the mysterious whining noise emanating from this particular PJB Fliightcase may have a mechanical component.

My Samsung computer monitor occasionally emanates a faint whistling/buzzing sound.., a sound which I've also heard from a couple of Intel-based motherboards before.

In the case of the M/Bs the noise seemed to be coming from one of the capacitors near the CPU.

[fretmeister]

Chris

Just an idea, but I saw a mate's rig over the weekend.

He's using the Mark Bass 121 combo... but then bought a Mark bass cone and loaded it into a wedge monitor housing. There isn't as much low end from the monitor cab but that is just for pointing up at him.

Was a very nice solution.

[Beedster]

Hi folks

Right, just taken delivery of the Super Flightcase and guess what.........

Not a sound other than bass, pure, sweet, bass. Even with all controls rolled fully up the hiss is barely audible, and this is 250w, so that's pretty good going. I'll keep you posted as to what the cause of the previous problem was, but thanks again for all your help, really appreciated.

Chris

[Beedster]

[quote name='fretmeister' post='711055' date='Jan 13 2010, 11:05 AM']Chris

Just an idea, but I saw a mate's rig over the weekend.

He's using the Mark Bass 121 combo... but then bought a Mark bass cone and loaded it into a wedge monitor housing. There isn't as much low end from the monitor cab but that is just for pointing up at him.

Was a very nice solution.[/quote]

Cheers FM, indeed a good idea, although would still require two cabs, whilst my real need was for all in one. Looks like it's sorted now anyway

Chris

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='Beedster' post='711060' date='Jan 13 2010, 06:08 AM']Hi folks

Right, just taken delivery of the Super Flightcase and guess what.........

Not a sound other than bass, pure, sweet, bass. Even with all controls rolled fully up the hiss is barely audible, and this is 250w, so that's pretty good going. I'll keep you posted as to what the cause of the previous problem was, but thanks again for all your help, really appreciated.

Chris[/quote]

Bon!

I look forward to your BG-300 gig report Chris.

Gary

[fretmeister]

GAS doesn't count without pictures!!

[Beedster]

[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='711079' date='Jan 13 2010, 11:19 AM']Bon!

I look forward to your BG-300 gig report Chris.

Gary[/quote]

Well I got it Wednesday afternoon, rehearsed it that evening, and gigged it last night. It took some getting used to at the regearsal, it's a very small room and there seemed to be a lot of acoustic dead spots with this amp that I hadn't noticed with other amps in the past (namely Mesa Boogie venture and various Markbass combinations). In fact, for the first hour or so I was quite disappointed and worried that I'd spent a lot of cash on an amp that wasn't going to meet my needs. In flat, running it flat I was losing the D-string in the mix, not something I've come across before. The great thing about this amp though is the 5-band EQ, and playing around with that solved all the problems, and it's amazing how much more powerful the unit sounds with only very slight modifications in tone.

Last night was interesting. To cut a long story short, we were playing in quite a big and high room, probably 120x40x25, like an old dance hall. I thought I'd need to go home and get the Mesa Boogie when I first plugged in for the check, but we played a couple of numbers and although I wasn't really sure how it was cutting through, a couple of the guys were pretty impressed by the tone, even an early arriving guest (a guitarist) came up to me during the check and said how great the bass sounded. More to the point, the drummer could hear me really clearly, and said the bass sounded like it was all around us, not just in one place, strangely consistent with what PJB claim.

I've got a monstrous hangover so am gonna get some air (and possibly some hair of the dog) and probably come back and write some more, and a little more coherently, but first impressions are very good.

BTW my Super Flightcase is a lovely dark red, almost looks like leather!

C

Edited January 16, 2010 by Beedster

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='Beedster' post='714635' date='Jan 16 2010, 05:22 AM']Well I got it Wednesday afternoon, rehearsed it that evening, and gigged it last night. It took some getting used to at the regearsal, it's a very small room and [u]there seemed to be a lot of acoustic dead spots with this amp that I hadn't noticed with other amps in the past (namely Mesa Boogie venture and various Markbass combinations). In fact, for the first hour or so I was quite disappointed and worried that I'd spent a lot of cash on an amp that wasn't going to meet my needs. In flat, running it flat I was losing the D-string in the mix,[/u] not something I've come across before. The great thing about this amp though is the 5-band EQ, and playing around with that solved all the problems, and it's amazing how much more powerful the unit sounds with only very slight modifications in tone.

Last night was interesting. To cut a long story short, we were playing in quite a big and high room, probably 120x40x25, like an old dance hall. I thought I'd need to go home and get the Mesa Boogie when I first plugged in for the check, but we played a couple of numbers and although I wasn't really sure how it was cutting through, a couple of the guys were pretty impressed by the tone, even an early arriving guest (a guitarist) came up to me during the check and said how great the bass sounded. More to the point, the drummer could hear me really clearly, and said the bass sounded like it was all around us, not just in one place, strangely consistent with what PJB claim.

I've got a monstrous hangover so am gonna get some air (and possibly some hair of the dog) and probably come back and write some more, and a little more coherently, but first impressions are very good.

BTW my Super Flightcase is a lovely dark red, almost looks like leather!

C[/quote]

Hmm...

From the [url="http://www.philjonespuresound.com/products/download.htm?ft=download&id=11&fid=20"]BG-300 manual[/url]:

"Positioning the SUPER FLIGHTCASE for Best Sound

Often, playing in different venues will cause your bass to sound different. This is partially
due to the acoustics of the hall influencing the low frequency waves that are coming from
your speaker. Bass waves are large and room dimensions heavily influence them when the
walls reflect the sound waves, causing them to collide by adding together or canceling each
other out. This causes some fundamental notes (the ones you feel more than hear) to ring out
louder than others and some notes not to be heard at all.

Here is an indication of where fundamental bass frequencies are, showing open string's approximate frequencies and acoustic wavelength:
F# string 24Hz 46feet
B string 31Hz 36feet
E string 41Hz 27feet
A string 55Hz 20feet
D string 73Hz 15feet
G string 98Hz 11feet
C string 130Hz 9feet
This may give you some indication of the offending notes (frequencies) that may be booming or resonating louder or quieter than others. For example if your speakers are five feet from a wall, the open A string may sound weak. That could be because the path length of the reflected sound off the wall from your speaker is exactly corresponding to half a wavelength on the open A string causing at that particular note to cancel out.

Where you position the SUPER FLIGHTCASE will ultimately affect your low frequency
limit. For best results keep the SUPER FLIGHTCASE on the floor. Placing it on objects off
the floor will cause it to sound thin and lack bass punch. Placing the SUPER FLIGHTCASE
with the back close to a wall will help reinforce the lower notes. Placing it in a room corner
will further enhance the low notes.

Room size makes a large difference in how deep the bass will sound. The further the distance
to the listener the less the bass will be. This is due to the physics of acoustics not the unit
itself.

Unfortunately for bass players, low frequencies are always very difficult to control with
room acoustics. The reproduced wavelengths of the notes you are playing often correspond
to the room dimensions, in which case the reflected sound off the walls interferes with the
sound from the speaker as you get further away from it..."

I want one in red too.

[BottomEndian]

[quote name='Beedster' post='714635' date='Jan 16 2010, 10:22 AM']It took some getting used to at the [b]regearsal[/b][/quote]
I nominate this as a new word:
[b]regearsal[/b]: [i]n[/i] a rehearsal in which one is testing new gear

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='BottomEndian' post='714664' date='Jan 16 2010, 06:05 AM']I nominate this as a new word:
[b]regearsal[/b]: [i]n[/i] a rehearsal in which one is testing new gear[/quote]

I second this nomination.

It's a practical morphological derivative.

[MIJ-VI]

Update?

[merello]

[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='721866' date='Jan 23 2010, 04:41 AM']Update?[/quote]
There's an easy way to find out - try it with another one, side-by-side in the shop. Glad it got sorted.

[Beedster]

[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='721866' date='Jan 23 2010, 04:41 AM']Update?[/quote]

OK......

Overall I'm extremely impressed. I'll do this by bullet points as I think it'll be easier to read than my usual rambling and lengthy narrative

Good

* It's very, very quiet, no hiss, no whistle, no nothing. Lovely quietness.
* The tone is outstanding, really outstanding. It makes my other gear sound mono by comparison - I'm sure you know what I mean.
* The tone controls are extremely versatile, I can dial in a serious range of tones, very small changes in orientation of controls makes a big change in tone.
* I can hear myself clearly, the band can hear me clearly. The bass feels like it's playing through a surround sound system at times
* It's very light and very small, surprisingly so on both counts
* I've had very good follow-up from Phil Jones via email regarding my previous issues

Bad

* It was very expensive (close to £900).
* It doesn't move a lot of air. It's rated at 250w but I'd say it puts out half what my old Trace/Marshall 250w rig put out (that rig was however very powerful and big)
* It seems more sensitive to room acoustics and dimensions than previous gear I've owened (I struggled to hear notes around D at rehearsals. Fine at the last gig)

All in all, if I didn't need a small amp with good monitoring capability, I wouldn't have paid £900. But I did need one, and on that basis, it was worth the money. All USA-built gear is very pricey at the moment, and had any UK manufacturer made anything like this (or even the continental guys e.g., Markbass), I'd have gone for it, but having owned a lot of Markbass gear, I'm confident the PJB tone is way better. Seriously way better.

Trust me, it will NOT keep up with a loud drummer or a Marshall/pointy dude on lead. I think the title 'Super Flightcase' (and it's '300' model number which perhaps suggests it's more pwerful than it is), is a little misleading. Furthermore, I'm not convinced the Flightcase was a whole lot quieter (although I never gigged it). Luckily we have a well trained guitarist and a drummer with a light touch, and for that band, this unit is perfect (although I'm running it close to max most of the time at gigs). I gigged at a party for a singer last week, and many of the guest were musicians themselves. It was the first gig in a long time at which I was complimented on my tone as well as my playing (TBH the latter doesn't happen all that often either). A couple of the more knowledgable guys commented on how the bass tone was also clear and articulate.

Will I be using this for the newly formed Texas Boogie band? NFW. Will I be keeping it? Yes.

Hope that's helpful guys, please let me know if you need any further info

C

Edited January 23, 2010 by Beedster

[MacDaddy]

[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='714677' date='Jan 16 2010, 11:16 AM']I second this nomination.

It's a practical morphological derivative.[/quote]

+1 and having now used the word regearsal myself we can claim it has entered the lexicon

And Beedster, come on, we're waiting for pics!

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='Beedster' post='722404' date='Jan 23 2010, 01:12 PM']OK......

Overall I'm extremely impressed. I'll do this by bullet points as I think it'll be easier to read than my usual rambling and lengthy narrative

Good

* It's very, very quiet, no hiss, no whistle, no nothing. Lovely quietness.
* The tone is outstanding, really outstanding. It makes my other gear sound mono by comparison - I'm sure you know what I mean.
* The tone controls are extremely versatile, I can dial in a serious range of tones, very small changes in orientation of controls makes a big change in tone.
* I can hear myself clearly, the band can hear me clearly. The bass feels like it's playing through a surround sound system at times
* It's very light and very small, surprisingly so on both counts
* I've had very good follow-up from Phil Jones via email regarding my previous issues

Bad

* It was very expensive (close to £900).
* It doesn't move a lot of air. It's rated at 250w but I'd say it puts out half what my old Trace/Marshall 250w rig put out (that rig was however very powerful and big)
* It seems more sensitive to room acoustics and dimensions than previous gear I've owened (I struggled to hear notes around D at rehearsals. Fine at the last gig)

All in all, if I didn't need a small amp with good monitoring capability, I wouldn't have paid £900. But I did need one, and on that basis, it was worth the money. All USA-built gear is very pricey at the moment, and had any UK manufacturer made anything like this (or even the continental guys e.g., Markbass), I'd have gone for it, but having owned a lot of Markbass gear, I'm confident the PJB tone is way better. Seriously way better.

Trust me, it will NOT keep up with a loud drummer or a Marshall/pointy dude on lead. I think the title 'Super Flightcase' (and it's '300' model number which perhaps suggests it's more pwerful than it is), is a little misleading. Furthermore, I'm not convinced the Flightcase was a whole lot quieter (although I never gigged it). Luckily we have a well trained guitarist and a drummer with a light touch, and for that band, this unit is perfect (although I'm running it close to max most of the time at gigs). I gigged at a party for a singer last week, and many of the guest were musicians themselves. It was the first gig in a long time at which I was complimented on my tone as well as my playing (TBH the latter doesn't happen all that often either). A couple of the more knowledgable guys commented on how the bass tone was also clear and articulate.

Will I be using this for the newly formed Texas Boogie band? NFW. Will I be keeping it? Yes.

Hope that's helpful guys, please let me know if you need any further info

C[/quote]

Thank you for posting your further impressions re the Super Flightcase Chris.

Your assessment resonates with what I've read on TalkBass concerning the BG-300 delivering premium tone for use in bands where the guitarist and drummer are under adult supervision.

It seems then that, for lower volume occasions where tonal nuances can actually be discerned and appreciated, PJB rigs are A-list contenders.

Do you feel that the Super Flightcase would provide sufficient volume as a bass monitor in conjunction with PA support?

Thank you.

Gary

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='MacDaddy' post='722592' date='Jan 23 2010, 04:00 PM']+1 and having now used the word regearsal myself we can claim it has entered the lexicon

And Beedster, come on, [u]we're waiting for pics[/u]![/quote]

Yeah! Red amp pics!

[Beedster]

[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='722813' date='Jan 24 2010, 04:49 AM']Do you feel that the Super Flightcase would provide sufficient volume as a bass monitor in conjunction with PA support?[/quote]

Yes and no really! Yes, for monitoring it's infinitely better than any other small combo I've used (i.e., when it's also having to serve as the backline). Flip side is you can't beat a wedge firing directly up at you, as well as a backline, as well as a PA!

So small band, not too much stage noise, yes. Larger bacd, more srage noise, it might be asking a bit much.

Still gets my vote though!

C

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='Beedster' post='722819' date='Jan 24 2010, 01:43 AM']Yes and no really! Yes, for monitoring it's infinitely better than any other small combo I've used (i.e., when it's also having to serve as the backline). Flip side is you can't beat a wedge firing directly up at you, as well as a backline, as well as a PA!

So small band, not too much stage noise, yes. Larger bacd, more srage noise, it might be asking a bit much.

Still gets my vote though!

C[/quote]

Hmm... I'm thinking that a Super Flightcase positioned in front of a bassist, and laid on its side atop an [url="http://www.ampwedge.com/"]Ampwedge[/url] so that the 4x5's are aimed at the player and the two now side-firing fives are aimed at the opposite rear corner of the stage, may result in a further leveraging of a BG-300's bass monitoring capabilities to allow the bass to be heard well enough by band members in louder (within reason) situations with PA support.



I'm guessing/hoping that exploiting the Super Flightcase's superior (and adaptable) sound dispersion characteristics will offset its comparatively modest maximum volume (that is, compared to more directional compact combos which can't do 40Hz) with the result being a very PA-friendly bass monitor suitable for a wider range of gigs.

From what I gather, when it comes to 30 lb.-ish, 40Hz-capable, wide frequency range bass amps (or cabs), aside from the PJB BG-300, there's the AI Ten2, and the ACME B1--none of which exhibit a high sensitivity. (IIRC one can have any two of these three bass amp attributes: light, low, or loud.)

I'm glad to hear that your new Super Flightcase is working out well for you Chris. Your descriptions of its near-surround-sound character reminds me of the the ambiance which one can obtain from open-back guitar combos. I've always wanted to have that omnipresent sound for bass guitar.

Gary

Edited January 24, 2010 by MIJ-VI

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Beedster' post='722404' date='Jan 23 2010, 06:12 PM']All in all, if I didn't need a small amp with good monitoring capability, I wouldn't have paid £900. But I did need one, and on that basis, it was worth the money. All USA-built gear is very pricey at the moment, and had any UK manufacturer made anything like this (or even the continental guys e.g., Markbass), I'd have gone for it, but having owned a lot of Markbass gear, I'm confident the PJB tone is way better. Seriously way better.[/quote]
In't PJB stuff made in China? Nowt wrong with that, mind...

[Beedster]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='722918' date='Jan 24 2010, 10:34 AM']In't PJB stuff made in China? Nowt wrong with that, mind...[/quote]

It's a fair point! I'll rephrase.

It's expensive period!

Chris

[Beedster]

[quote name='MacDaddy' post='722592' date='Jan 23 2010, 09:00 PM']+1 and having now used the word regearsal myself we can claim it has entered the lexicon

And Beedster, come on, we're waiting for pics![/quote]


[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='722814' date='Jan 24 2010, 04:51 AM']Yeah! Red amp pics! [/quote]

I'll sort tomorrow guys

C

[Beedster]

[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='722835' date='Jan 24 2010, 08:33 AM']Hmm... I'm thinking that a Super Flightcase positioned in front of a bassist, and laid on its side atop an [url="http://www.ampwedge.com/"]Ampwedge[/url] so that the 4x5's are aimed at the player and the two now side-firing fives are aimed at the opposite rear corner of the stage, may result in a further leveraging of a BG-300's bass monitoring capabilities to allow the bass to be heard well enough by band members in louder (within reason) situations with PA support.



I'm guessing/hoping that exploiting the Super Flightcase's superior (and adaptable) sound dispersion characteristics will offset its comparatively modest maximum volume (that is, compared to more directional compact combos which can't do 40Hz) with the result being a very PA-friendly bass monitor suitable for a wider range of gigs.

From what I gather, when it comes to 30 lb.-ish, 40Hz-capable, wide frequency range bass amps (or cabs), aside from the PJB BG-300, there's the AI Ten2, and the ACME B1--none of which exhibit a high sensitivity. (IIRC one can have any two of these three bass amp attributes: light, low, or loud.)

I'm glad to hear that your new Super Flightcase is working out well for you Chris. Your descriptions of its near-surround-sound character reminds me of the the ambiance which one can obtain from open-back guitar combos. I've always wanted to have that omnipresent sound for bass guitar.

Gary[/quote]

That's a very interesting idea, and one that provides the best of both worlds (assuming the power lead doesn't prove problematic for the wedge, but I'd sure you can sort that). We do a lot of gigs on the same small stage, but in quite a big room. The PA is crap so I refuse to go through it, we leave it for vocals only. This unit has completely changed the way the sound is transmitted to the band anyway, the drummer has to sit behind me and I have too stand over the cab, so previoulsy he struggled to hear me, which is fine when he's taking the song, but there's a few where I lead and he was largely having to watch me as opposed to listen to me, which is never entirely satisfactory. First gig with the SFC he had no trouble, neither did other guys in the band, and neither did the 150 or so audience. It does seem to disperse the tone very well indeed. As a wedge monitor, you may find that it isn't as directional as you'd like, does that make sense? That is, it doesn't seem to point to sound in any one direction. However, I think it's a good idea and will no doubt make a big difference to your sound. Once again, the tone is great!

C

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='722918' date='Jan 24 2010, 05:34 AM']In't PJB stuff made in China? Nowt wrong with that, mind...[/quote]

"Just to put the record staright. PJB is ASSEMBLED IN CHINA. It does not mean that all parts are Chinese. Many parts come from Japan, USA, UK and Europe.
Many so called American made amps are nearly 100% Chinese parts. Often the labor cost of screwing them together offsets the total build cost to legally call it "Made in America".
I know because I used to manufacture in New Hampshire,USA Platinum Audio was 95% Chinese parts but had "Made in America" and was considered at the time to be some of the finest US audio speakers."

- Sir Funkalot (aka Phil Jones)

[url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3230015&postcount=99"]http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showpost.php...mp;postcount=99[/url]

[MIJ-VI]

[quote name='Beedster' post='723006' date='Jan 24 2010, 06:58 AM']That's a very interesting idea, and one that provides the best of both worlds (assuming the power lead doesn't prove problematic for the wedge, but I'd sure you can sort that). We do a lot of gigs on the same small stage, but in quite a big room. The PA is crap so I refuse to go through it, we leave it for vocals only. This unit has completely changed the way the sound is transmitted to the band anyway, the drummer has to sit behind me and I have too stand over the cab, so previoulsy he struggled to hear me, which is fine when he's taking the song, but there's a few where I lead and he was largely having to watch me as opposed to listen to me, which is never entirely satisfactory. First gig with the SFC he had no trouble, neither did other guys in the band, and neither did the 150 or so audience. It does seem to disperse the tone very well indeed. As a wedge monitor, you may find that it isn't as directional as you'd like, does that make sense? That is, it doesn't seem to point to sound in any one direction. However, I think it's a good idea and will no doubt make a big difference to your sound. Once again, the tone is great!

C[/quote]

The Bose 802s I used eons ago made me a disciple of small drivers = superior articulation & dispersion--[i]very[/i] intelligible.

If a BG-300 can cover a bandstand and 150 audience members with proper P-Bass tone [i]without[/i] PA support, then the '300 should do a [i]bang-up[/i] job with a 30" 'VI!

Your stated experience (along with that of other BG-300 users on TB) has served to further convince me that if tone/the ability of everyone to hear & enjoy one's playing is the number one consideration, then in the ~30 lb. weight class the PJB Super Flightcase is the rig to beat.

--------

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