d-basser Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 I love the tone of my new Orange but I find, particularly at gig volumes, it seems to distort at relatively low gain settings. This works for some stuff I play but I would like to be able to get a slightly cleaner or at least less aggressive tone easily. I think part of the issue is that I have been gigging it with my Lakland 5502 which seems to have a fair amount of oomf. Would changing the preamp valves help? Switch them for something more prone to warm chunky tones rather than really gritty rock, if so what would folk recommend? The other option I assume is cutting back the signal, turning down on the bass or adding something in my chain that allows me to tame teh volume just a tad. suggestions people? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 Hmm...there will be options, but I always choose Orange for dirt dirt dirt Im sure there is a way around it...passive bass? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-basser Posted January 20, 2010 Author Share Posted January 20, 2010 Dirt dirt dirt is good but I would like it more as an option than a necessity. Tried it with a passive (my Dingwall) but even then it is very prone to drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 Swap the 12ax7 for a 12au7 or at7, whatever an ECC81 equivalent is, or an ecc81. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-basser Posted January 20, 2010 Author Share Posted January 20, 2010 There is two 12AX7s in the Orange, I assume I would just replace both with ECC81s. Total noob in all things valve, is it just a case of taking the old ones out and putting the new style in or is there more to it than that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obbm Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 [quote name='d-basser' post='719241' date='Jan 20 2010, 04:49 PM']There is two 12AX7s in the Orange, I assume I would just replace both with ECC81s. Total noob in all things valve, is it just a case of taking the old ones out and putting the new style in or is there more to it than that?[/quote] I think you might be taking out too much gain by doing that. When I have some time I'm going to put a pair of 5751s into mine. I put a pair into an EH English Muffn and it sounded really good now. Swapping pre-amp valves is very easy. Remove valve, line-up pins, insert new valve. Job done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-basser Posted January 20, 2010 Author Share Posted January 20, 2010 Thanks for the info obbm, what brand did you opt for? Where did you pick them up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obbm Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 [quote name='d-basser' post='719347' date='Jan 20 2010, 05:55 PM']Thanks for the info obbm, what brand did you opt for? Where did you pick them up?[/quote] When I had gain problems with a BBE BMAX-T I bought a few Philips JAN 5751 from an outfit in Sussex. They always come up Ebay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannybuoy Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 Get the 1000W version which will be able to go louder at with the gain knob lower? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-basser Posted January 20, 2010 Author Share Posted January 20, 2010 I dont really have volume issues, I can keep the gain pretty low and get good volume but I will never be using a really really distorted sound so I would like a bit more play at the lower drive end. Philips 5751s look like they may be what I need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obbm Posted January 20, 2010 Share Posted January 20, 2010 [quote name='d-basser' post='719377' date='Jan 20 2010, 06:12 PM']I dont really have volume issues, I can keep the gain pretty low and get good volume but I will never be using a really really distorted sound so I would like a bit more play at the lower drive end. Philips 5751s look like they may be what I need.[/quote] Just remembered it was Colomor. They have an Ebay store now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obbm Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 Just tried a 5751, 12AY7 and a 12AU7. They all have lower gain than the unbranded stock 12AX7 so make a considerable difference. Only able to use headphones so next test will be with speakers. I think I shall probably use a 5751 in the V1 position and when tested with speakers may change V2 to a better quality valve. If gain is not a problem then it might be worth trying a 12AY7 or even a 12AU7. I have a very nice CBS 12AU7, bought from Ebay. They were made for use in CBS studio equipment. There are some useful vave gain comparison charts on the Net. [url="http://thetubestore.com/gainfactor.html"]http://thetubestore.com/gainfactor.html[/url] [url="http://www.300guitars.com/articles/preamp-tube-gain-factors-and-substitution-chart/"]http://www.300guitars.com/articles/preamp-...titution-chart/[/url] [url="http://www.diyguitarist.com/GuitarAmps/SD-Convertible/patgf1.htm"]http://www.diyguitarist.com/GuitarAmps/SD-...ible/patgf1.htm[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d-basser Posted January 24, 2010 Author Share Posted January 24, 2010 Next query: Do the valves have to match? Is it a case of two 12AX7 or two 12AT7 or could you use one of each? And if so what would happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obbm Posted January 24, 2010 Share Posted January 24, 2010 [quote name='d-basser' post='722785' date='Jan 24 2010, 01:35 AM']Next query: Do the valves have to match? Is it a case of two 12AX7 or two 12AT7 or could you use one of each? And if so what would happen?[/quote] No need for them to be matched so they can be different. It's best to try different types to see what works best however it is the first one, the one nearest the input socket, that makes the most difference as it provides the initial gain and drive. Now I have the covers off mine I'll have a look at the circuit design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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