Monitor reccomendations

[TDM]

I'm in the market for some new monitors with a budget of around £400

The current contenders are:

KRK Rokit RP5/RP6/RP8
Yamaha HS80M/HS50M
Yamaha MSP5
Adam A5
Tannoy Reveal 5As


I'm in a small room, so would it be better to go for smaller speakers + a subwoofer?

Edited February 25, 2010 by thedonutman

[Archetype]

Some good choices.

I Have heard the Adam A5's and used a lot of Tannoy's, currently owning Reveal 6D's. Both are very good options.
The KRK ones are also very good from what i hear.

Personally I would only buy monitors from a local place where i can hear how they sound. Each will be rather different and you might prefer one over another.
Sub's are optional, You could try one without it and see how it goes then add it later but if the monitors are in the corner then you will get some big bass boosts.

G

[BTGAndy]

Definitely try them out before you buy, take some music you know very well to test on them too.
I have the KRK RP5 G2s, as do a lot of my friends and we are all agreed that they're amazing monitors for the price.
You have to be careful when buying monitors because it's really easy to buy a lovely expensive pair and see little improvement over a much cheaper pair because of the room that you are mixing in. You might be best off going with something like the KRKs and spending the rest of your budget on improving the monitoring environment.

[Rimskidog]

The tannoys are probably the best of the bunch you mention. But for just a little more you could get Adam A7s or Dynaudio BM5a which are a BIG step up from the ones you mention. As mentioned above dont leave room treatment out of the equation. You can buy a big bag of rockwool from Wickes and make some DIY panels for about £50. (believe me, it'll be the best 50 you ever spend.)

Edited February 17, 2010 by Rimskidog

[lowdown]

[quote name='Rimskidog' post='748971' date='Feb 17 2010, 09:21 PM']The tannoys are probably the best of the bunch you mention. But for just a little more you could get Adam A7s or Dynaudio BM5a which are a BIG step up from the ones you mention. As mentioned above dont leave room treatment out of the equation. You can buy a big bag of rockwool from Wickes and make some DIY panels for about £50. (believe me, it'll be the best 50 you ever spend.)[/quote]


Big +1 for the Adam A7'S.A bit more above your budget,
and as mentioned above..a step up.
And the rockwool panels a must.Just google anything on home studios and there is plenty of
Info on putting panels together.Its not hard at all.


Garry

[bigevilman]

A pair of Genelec 6010A are in your price range, and Genelecs are amazing! They have a couple of pairs at Lincoln University and they're are so clear its unreal!

Another way you could go is some Samson Rubicons. They've been getting rave reviews everywhere, and I believe you should be able to get a pair of 8's under £400.

[ben604]

My two pence worth, I'd avoid the sub route and buy monitors that can handle the bottom end by themselves, it's much more satisfying and easier to handle when the sound's all coming from the same place, even from a setup point of view in my opinion. I've got Event 20/20 bas actives, which have an 8 inch driver each and the bass response is smooth, deep and tight, I wouldnt need a sub, especially in the small room I'm using.

[escholl]

[quote name='Rimskidog' post='748971' date='Feb 17 2010, 09:21 PM']The tannoys are probably the best of the bunch you mention. But for just a little more you could get Adam A7s or Dynaudio BM5a which are a BIG step up from the ones you mention. As mentioned above dont leave room treatment out of the equation. You can buy a big bag of rockwool from Wickes and make some DIY panels for about £50. (believe me, it'll be the best 50 you ever spend.)[/quote]

+1 to all that, those panels are really easy to build as well.

[Sonic_Groove]

[quote name='Rimskidog' post='748971' date='Feb 17 2010, 09:21 PM']... You can buy a big bag of rockwool from Wickes and make some DIY panels for about £50. (believe me, it'll be the best 50 you ever spend.)[/quote]

[quote name='escholl' post='750488' date='Feb 19 2010, 07:40 AM']+1 to all that, those panels are really easy to build as well.[/quote]

Sorry to hijack donutman's thread but is there an Idiots guide to making sound panels anywhere or can you expand here or in another thread?

Brendan

[escholl]

[quote name='Sonic_Groove' post='750789' date='Feb 19 2010, 12:38 PM']Sorry to hijack donutman's thread but is there an Idiots guide to making sound panels anywhere or can you expand here or in another thread?

Brendan[/quote]

[url="http://www.amazon.co.uk/Home-Recording-Studio-Construction-Build/dp/1598630342/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1266593305&sr=1-3"]This book[/url] is very good, and explains all the basics of the panels, along with many other aspects of home studio design. The simplest kind, known as broadband absorbers, are basically as simple as a 2x4 foot panel of rockwool, in a timber frame and with some fabric stretched taught over and around it, then the whole panel spaced out an inch or two from the wall. It's tough to sort of generalize a homemade acoustic solution but that is a good place to start, a couple of them will at least cut down reflections in the room.

[discreet]

[quote name='thedonutman' post='747075' date='Feb 16 2010, 12:00 PM']I'm in a small room, so would it be better to go for smaller speakers + a subwoofer?[/quote]

If the room's small, forget the sub. You will have real problems with room modes:

[url="http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar02/articles/monitors.asp"]http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar02/articles/monitors.asp[/url]

PS: I've got Tapco S8s (built by Mackie) and a LOT of bass trapping. They do 39Hz-20Khz and sound great.

Edited February 19, 2010 by discreet

[Rosh]

Yamaha HS80M -- As far as I know, these are the monitors (all I remember is black and white yamaha monitors) that I was taught: If you can make the mix sound good on these, it'll sound good anywhere!

They are in a lot of studios too, so can't be that bad!

[escholl]

[quote name='Rosh' post='752109' date='Feb 20 2010, 07:40 PM']Yamaha HS80M -- As far as I know, these are the monitors (all I remember is black and white yamaha monitors) that I was taught: If you can make the mix sound good on these, it'll sound good anywhere!

They are in a lot of studios too, so can't be that bad! [/quote]

You are likely thinking of the NS10's -- the only thing the two share in common are white coloured driver cones...and that's about it.

[Rosh]

[quote name='escholl' post='752129' date='Feb 20 2010, 07:52 PM']You are likely thinking of the NS10's -- the only thing the two share in common are white coloured driver cones...and that's about it.[/quote]

Thank you, sir -- I'm not going to forget that now!!! I cursed the day I did!

[Rimskidog]

[quote name='Rosh' post='752109' date='Feb 20 2010, 07:40 PM']Yamaha HS80M -- As far as I know, these are the monitors (all I remember is black and white yamaha monitors) that I was taught: If you can make the mix sound good on these, it'll sound good anywhere!

They are in a lot of studios too, so can't be that bad! [/quote]

And that, my friends, is one of the most often quoted but misunderstood quotes around. The point with NS10s is that they sound bloody awful but were characteristic of most cheap hifi speakers of the 70's. They are actually pretty poor as a studio monitor (though to be fair do improve somewhat with a Bryston amp behind them).

Really guys, if you are serious about your music, save your pennies and, at the least, but something like a pair of Adam A7s/dynaudio BM5a's. Anything less than that and some DIY traps and you will continue to have translation issues.

[discreet]

[quote name='Rimskidog' post='752175' date='Feb 20 2010, 08:32 PM']a pair of Adam A7s/dynaudio BM5a's. Anything less than that and some DIY traps and you will continue to have translation issues.[/quote]

+100

[TDM]

The A7s are almost double my budget. How do the A5s compare?

[Rimskidog]

[quote name='thedonutman' post='752269' date='Feb 20 2010, 09:53 PM']The A7s are almost double my budget. How do the A5s compare?[/quote]

I havent heard the A5 I'm afraid (though a guy I used to work with and who has good ears told me they were 'useable'). Street price on the Adams is only about £550ish. Also, both Adam A7s and Dynaudio BM5a come up reasonably frequently second hand. You could also keep an eye on DV's B stock list. I've seen decent monitors appear on there pretty often. Here's a link: [url="http://www.dv247.com/b-stock/"]http://www.dv247.com/b-stock/[/url]

Edited February 20, 2010 by Rimskidog

[TDM]

I can't find them anywhere for less than £650, perhaps the prices have gone up recently just like everything else?

With regards to acoustic treatment, fibreglass makes me itchy (presumably rockwool will do too) so I'd like to avoid having it in my room if at all possible. Is "acoustic" foam also used for taming bass frequencies?

[escholl]

I would second the notion that finding a second-hand pair of A7's is a good idea, they are certainly very usable. It's a shame they couldn't have paired that lovely tweeter with a sealed box, really.

Don't worry if you can't afford them though, the A5's and the Tannoy's are good too. Getting the mixes to translate is as much about understanding your monitors as it is about having decent monitors, so whatever you buy, take the time to learn their nuances.

[discreet]

[quote name='thedonutman' post='752286' date='Feb 20 2010, 10:15 PM']I can't find them anywhere for less than £650, perhaps the prices have gone up recently just like everything else?

With regards to acoustic treatment, fibreglass makes me itchy (presumably rockwool will do too) so I'd like to avoid having it in my room if at all possible. Is "acoustic" foam also used for taming bass frequencies?[/quote]

A mate of mine has these Genelecs in his small room and they're amazing:
[url="http://www.decks.co.uk/products/Genelec/8020A"]http://www.decks.co.uk/products/Genelec/8020A[/url]

Most of my acoustic treatment is foam-based:
[url="http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/Com4tex__W0QQ_armrsZ1"]http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/Com4tex__W0QQ_armrsZ1[/url]

[Rimskidog]

foam does nothing for low frequencies at all. Even the foam corner traps you see advertised only just about stretch to the lower mids. Best approach is to wrap rockwool in muslin. Once it's done you'll have no problem with it.

[escholl]

Rockwool will only trap bass frequencies if installed in certain ways, and simply wrapping it and sticking it on the wall is not going to work -- in fact, over use of it in this manner can actually make the problems worse by excessively damping higher frequencies. It is a great solution for a general treatment of acoustics however, in taming things such as early reflections and flutter echo. In certain applications, the correct installation of rockwool can control lower frequencies. However other, commercial, bass corner traps do work very well, provided they are installed correctly and of an appropriate size.

[Rimskidog]

[quote name='escholl' post='752913' date='Feb 21 2010, 04:08 PM']Rockwool will only trap bass frequencies if installed in certain ways, and simply wrapping it and sticking it on the wall is not going to work -- in fact, over use of it in this manner can actually make the problems worse by excessively damping higher frequencies. It is a great solution for a general treatment of acoustics however, in taming things such as early reflections and flutter echo. In certain applications, the correct installation of rockwool can control lower frequencies. However other, commercial, bass corner traps do work very well, provided they are installed correctly and of an appropriate size.[/quote]

Agree entirely. Bass accumulates in corners. 6inch panels straddling corners (floor to ceiling is a good place to start) will operate as broadband trapping. (I'm presuming he's unlikely to go as far as tuned traps/modex panels etc.) 2 inch panels are fine for reflection points (especially if an inch gap can be left behind them). Once the OP gets the stuff I'd be happy to provide placement suggestions for his particular room.

Edited February 21, 2010 by Rimskidog

[TDM]

Here's a quick sketchup model of what I imagine my room will look like after I've rearranged it. Currently the desk is in the right corner by the window. I guess I'll need some bass traps - where, how big and how many? The window is two panes of double glazed glass, floor is carpet over wood, ceiling is a little plaster plus a lot of roof insulation and wood struts. All of the walls are plaster over brick and there's a cupboard built into one of the walls.




And a quick animation.


Any advice would be much appreciated. Cheers!

I don't actually have the HS50Ms, just found the model in the Sketchup model bank.

Edited February 25, 2010 by thedonutman