EBMM Stingray 4 string weak G string question

[Dingus]

The worst problenm I ever had with uneveness in the sound of a bass was with a four string with a graphite neck where the E string sounded plenty loud enough but hollow and lacking in fundamental compared to the other three strings - you could notice it even when the bass was unamplified - and it could never be sorted out . It also had hot spots where certain notes on the E string were louder than others . Very odd for a bass with a graphite neck .

Edited March 15, 2013 by Dingus

[drTStingray]

[quote name='swanbrook' timestamp='1363322223' post='2011561']
Wow nice one so after over 25 playing bass I clearly don't have a clue how to set my eq and my technique sucks, cheers lad

Both these issues are well documented on the ebmm and tb websites and even some of the die hard fans have said they have to adjust their technique to suit the SR 5.

It's not a big problem for me with either bass and I still have one of each but I don't try to pretend that there is no issue with them or try to blame the players ears or ability.
[/quote]

I bought my first Stingray just over 30 years ago, and no, I don't find it a problem to be honest, as don't a lot of other people. I was really just trying to provide another point of view - perhaps to avoid impressionable people who may not have even tried playing a Stingray to run away with only your point of view. You shouldn't be so sensitive, of course I'm not suggesting you don't know how to use an EQ etc - and as you've said, you clearly compensate for what you perceive as a problem, and live with the basses - presumably the positives outweigh what you perceive as negatives. So is it my ears or yours - I seem to have been playing them longer.....if that has anything to do with anything!!! I don't have a problem with you disagreeing with me in the slightest - it's just different points of view.

Most of what appears on user forums is personal opinion and should be treated as such - it is how 'internet myths' can start. I'm perfectly happy to accept that some people find this issue with Stingrays a problem, each to their own. Changing the pick up may or may not assist - what it will do for sure is knock a big dent in the re-sale value, or even the ability to sell the bass - so if you do this, then keep the stock bits to put back to leave yourself with a re-sale option later. Otherwise go for it if that's what you want to do.

Asserting an opinion that the basses are flawed some way in their design is certainly open to question. The Stingray was conceived by Leo Fender, who it is said, knew something about designing electric basses - indeed it's also been suggested that one of the reasons the Stingray is arguably the best mass produced slap machine available is because he couldn't hear treble too well (note treble, not bass or mid range) - why would he release a bass with a weak G string signal - unless someone said they wanted it that way? Perhaps people perceived, in the mid 70s, that a P bass has too prominent sounding G string? That appeared to be his remit/idea - producing a super hot rod P bass to meet the changing needs of the time.

FWIW I have an HH Ray - it has a very loud G string (far too loud above 12th fret with some EQ settings) - I can make the upper strings sound quieter on that by EQ setting (and appear to disappear in the setting of a rock band with two guitars) - however that would be my choice of EQ - it's not a design issue. My Bongo 5HHp appears to have the same neck width as the SR5. I think I've pushed the G string off the edge of that, but not as easily as the SR5 - not really sure why though.

Edited March 15, 2013 by drTStingray

[drTStingray]

Bear in mind that some amp/speaker combinations can accentuate scooped mids - I have noticed my Ashdown rig can accentuate this far more than my Markbass (both set flat).

As has been noted by McNach, string choice can make a difference also.

Edited March 15, 2013 by drTStingray

[Jack]

I don't buy that it's an eq thing. I keep the bass and treble on the bass low and the amp has flat bass and treble with both high and low mids boosted. GKs are middy anyway and my Barefaced stack is hardly mid-shy.

[swanbrook]

Dr t

Is not an issue of me being sensitive but as you quite rightly said its about both points be put forward.
There is many stingray fans out there and some take offence to the notion that there might be an issue with a weak g.
I too have often heard sterling talk about Leo and how he was so deaf he had to put a screw driver on the bridge of a strat in order to hear it. I did try a pre ebmm stingray once that had no issue at all with the G.

It is after all an open forum here and while you have not found a problem with your bass trying to say that it's just an eq issue is unfair.

As for the best slap machine I would rather a fender jazz any day for slap tone, I can't deal with the body in all it's off set madness but great tone none the less. But that's my ears yours are clearly different

[Fat Rich]

In my experience any EBMM pickup with all the pole pieces level will have good string balance and no problem with a weak G.

I've played several EBMM Stingrays with a single pickup that have the issue, they all had the raised polepieces under the A and D string.

My Stingray was useless to me, whatever I did with the EQ on the bass, the EQ on the amp, string heights, pickup angles, different strings, different amps, it always had a weak G. Plug in any other basses and there was no problem. Unplug the Stingray and listen to it acoustically, no problem.

So I followed some advice on here, removed the strings, plastic cover carefully so not to lose the springs or damage the windings, laid the pickups in the recess in the body and carefully pushed the A and D polepeices into the bobbin until they were level with the E and the G. Reassembled and the problem was solved.

Now I can have the string heights wherever I want, the pickup level and get great string to string balance, just like all my other basses.

Nothing will convince me that the weak G problem is imagined, the transformation after the pickup fix was absolutely astonishing. I've also read somewhere on the EB forum that the weak G is a deliberate feature to suit Country and Western "click" players (whatever that is!) which is why they still make them that way.

[swanbrook]

Fat rich, everyday is a school day !! I had never heard that fix before I might just go and try it out. My SR5 is all perfectly straight my 90 SR 4 has the poles raised on the A and D

Cheers for that !!

[Dingus]

Fat Rich's fix might explain why this problem seems to effect some basses more than others - maybe the basses leave the factory with the pole pieces more even in some cases than others , and the more uneven the weaker the G string . After that it's just pot luck whether you get a weak G or not , maybe .

[Fat Rich]

Obviously be careful.... I'd decided I'd either replace the pickup, or break it trying this fix, sort of "Here's goes nothing!"

It's a fairly straightforward operation, strings off, carefully undo the 3 screws on the pickup cover as there are 4 springs on the underside of the pickup that leap out and disappear under nearby furniture never to be seen again. Unless one ends up in your eye

The pickup is in two halves, remove the springs and lay the pickups face up in the flat rout in the body, so they're resting on the back of the pole pieces of the E and G. This will ensure when you press the A and D pole pieces in from the front they'll click back to the same level as the E and G. I pressed the first one in using my thumb, pretty painful.... for the other 3 I placed a plectrum over the pole piece first.

Good luck!

[Fat Rich]

[quote name='Dingus' timestamp='1363362965' post='2011882']
Fat Rich's fix might explain why this problem seems to effect some basses more than others - maybe the basses leave the factory with the pole pieces more even in some cases than others , and the more uneven the weaker the G string . After that it's just pot luck whether you get a weak G or not , maybe .
[/quote]

You'd expect having the pole pieces follow the profile of the strings and neck would result in better balance but it doesn't seem to. Fender bass pickups have always had the pole pieces level, although I've a feeling I've seen some of their guitar pickups with uneven ones.

[BassTractor]

Another point mentioned somewhere, and I have no idea about its validity, is that some people, when confronted with this StingRay peculiarity, would raise the treble end of the pickup in an attempt to strengthen the sound from the G string, but that they actually were making for too strong a magnetic field which would instead dampen the vibrations in that string.

As said I have no idea, but to me it sounds like a good point.

best,
bert

Edited March 16, 2013 by BassTractor

[swanbrook]

Hi Bert, I have done that on my sr4, I have a fretless neck on it now and it does help a bit. I am still going to take a look at pushing the pole pieces down !

D

[stingrayPete1977]

[quote name='BassTractor' timestamp='1363401551' post='2012406']
Another point mentioned somewhere, and I have no idea about its validity, is that some people, when confronted with this StingRay peculiarity, would raise the treble end of the pickup in an attempt to strengthen the sound from the G string, but that they actually were making for too strong a magnetic field which would instead dampen the vibrations in that string.

As said I have no idea, but to me it sounds like a good point.

best,
bert
[/quote]

I think there is some truth in this, My method is to set the treble side to where it feels comfortable to play and not too close to the strings first, even set quite far away the output coupled to the active preamp is much hotter than your average passive bass, then raise or lower the [b]bass[/b] side to get an even output rather than the more obvious but flawed method of adjusting the treble side until it just dampens or produces a weird tone etc.

[BassTractor]

[quote name='swanbrook' timestamp='1363424600' post='2012505']
I am still going to take a look at pushing the pole pieces down !
[/quote]

Oh yeah. Absolutely! Obviously the best thing to do.
I just wanted to mention it in addition.

best,
bert