Neck dive?

[dos dedos]

Hi folks! I wonder if you can help me with a little problem?
As I understand it, my fretting hand shouldn't be supporting any of the weight of the neck.
This is the playing position that feels comfortable to me:
[attachment=44365:bass1.jpg]
And here's what happens when I let go:
[attachment=44366:bass2.jpg]
It's not a [i]massive[/i] problem; I don't have to hold the neck up [i]much[/i], but supporting the weight still makes my left hand much less mobile and so affects my playing. Am I making a fuss about nothing?

If I shorten or lengthen the strap as much as possible, it doesn't really help - the bass still wants to "settle" in that near-horizontal position, and in addition it makes the playing angle more awkward for both hands. The strap I'm using is a fairly slippery nylon job; I thought maybe if I picked up a leather one with a rougher back it might keep the neck up a bit better by stopping the strap sliding over my left shoulder. Does this sound like a good idea?

And finally, is this generally what happens with a Precision shape, or is this one just poorly balanced because it's a cheapo Squier?

[Buzz]

You are a tiny person. That p-bass looks massive.

I'd go firmly with the camp of it due to being a Squier, normally they do use lighter woods like basswood (obviously, depends on model) and that will make a difference to the balance.

As to solving it, yes, wider leather strap instead of the thin nylon will make a massive difference and keep it where it should be. Go do that. There's also the DIY method of duct tape and metal/brick to add some weight if you really want to go that way. Buy a strap first though.

[discreet]

Your bass looks a little bit low to me. You could try shortening your strap just a tad and see if that helps.

Also, PFD (Pixellated Face Disease) can lead to FBP (Full Body Pixellation) if not treated promptly.

[dos dedos]

Thanks for the advice Buzz!
I quite fancied one of these [url="http://www.monocase.com/mono-straps.asp"]ridiculously-cushioned, armchair-like straps[/url] but they're backed with slippery neoprene which is the [i]last[/i] thing I need. I'll see if I can hunt down a nice strip of cow to sling the bass from instead.
[quote name='Buzz' post='767293' date='Mar 7 2010, 08:51 PM']You are a tiny person.[/quote]
There goes my self-esteem... I'll have you know I'm five foot eight AND A HALF!

[bartelby]

I had the same problem but switched to [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/UK-MADE-2-75-WIDE-BIG-SOFTEE-REAL-LEATHER-GUITAR-STRAP_W0QQitemZ350278734646QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Guitar_Accessories?hash=item518e3d5336"]one of these[/url] and it's not been an issue since.

They're wide and 2 layer soft leather, so they're nice an comfortable.

Edited March 7, 2010 by bartelby

[Buzz]

[quote name='dos dedos' post='767303' date='Mar 7 2010, 09:01 PM']There goes my self-esteem... I'll have you know I'm five foot eight AND A HALF! [/quote]

Then with my 5'11" height I shall tower over you and look down upon your shortness from my lofty position! Muwahaha!

(waits for the 7' Predator known as dood to come along and return the favour)


In regards to that neoprene strap, actually that looks awesome, and it's also wider and rather grippy due to neoprene being a rubber-like substance rather than slippy. It would be perfect.

Edited March 7, 2010 by Buzz

[dos dedos]

[quote name='discreet' post='767298' date='Mar 7 2010, 08:57 PM']Also, PFD (Pixellated Face Disease) can lead to FBP (Full Body Pixellation) if not treated promptly. [/quote]
Oh god it's spreading, help meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee...

(That's me, honest )

[quote name='bartelby' post='767306' date='Mar 7 2010, 09:06 PM']I had the same problem but switched to [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/UK-MADE-2-75-WIDE-BIG-SOFTEE-REAL-LEATHER-GUITAR-STRAP_W0QQitemZ350278734646QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Guitar_Accessories?hash=item518e3d5336"]one of these[/url] and it's not been an issue since.[/quote]
Looks comfy, thanks! Is that kinda suede-y underneath?

[bartelby]

[quote name='dos dedos' post='767319' date='Mar 7 2010, 09:15 PM']Looks comfy, thanks! Is that kinda suede-y underneath?[/quote]

It is indeed!

3 out of 5 of my basses have these straps (my 5 string has a 3.75" width one as it's heavy), the other 2 basses will get one each soon.

[thisnameistaken]

Is this Jon Venables?

[EskimoBassist]

I have an Epiphone Thunderbird, I feel your pain.

[Huw Foster]

The body on my Schecter is ridiculously light, so I know this problem all too well.

[MIJ-VI]

OP, try tethering one strap end to the headstock just behind the nut acoustic guitar style.

1960's Fender P and J Basses had a 2nd string tree screwed to the back of their head-stocks to facilitate said folky strap attachment.

BTW. P-Basses usually balance nicely when worn higher so that the weight of one's plucking hand's forearm rests on their body's upper rear bout.

However, in your case, wearing the P higher would make playing notes in the first position near impossible without crooking your left wrist at a severe angle for prolonged periods thus risking the development of RSI. (Been there. Done that. Please don't.)

[dos dedos]

[quote name='MIJ-VI' post='767510' date='Mar 8 2010, 04:42 AM']OP, try tethering one strap end to the headstock just behind the nut acoustic guitar style.[/quote]
What's the opposite of neck dive? Neck [i]jump[/i]? Cos that's what happened when I tried this .
The strap doesn't have any weight pulling it onto my left shoulder, so it slithers down my back and I end up with the bass almost vertical - the body by my knees and the headstock a couple of inches from my face!

My plan is to get one of the leather straps that bartelby recommended; I'll report back when I have results

[discreet]

[quote name='dos dedos' post='767748' date='Mar 8 2010, 11:38 AM']My plan is to get one of the leather straps that bartelby recommended; I'll report back when I have results [/quote]

Please do, I might go for one of these.

[bartelby]

Here you go guys. If you want to see here's me, my bass with the 2.75" strap.
[attachment=44412:DSC_1268.JPG]

The 3.75" ones are a touch more comfortable, but about £10 more.

Edited March 8, 2010 by bartelby

[discreet]

[quote name='bartelby' post='768091' date='Mar 8 2010, 03:28 PM']If you want to see here's me, my bass with the 2.75" strap.[/quote]

Thank you! I hope you don't practise in front of the telly, mate - it doesn't count, you know!

[bartelby]

[quote name='discreet' post='768097' date='Mar 8 2010, 03:34 PM']Thank you! I hope you don't practise in front of the telly, mate - it doesn't count, you know! [/quote]


It doesn't?

Don't worry, it was merely for show.

[Mottlefeeder]

There was a post recently where the neck dive was cured by taking a loop of string (or something similar) from the bridge-end button to the player's belt. Assuming it didn't make him sing higher, that might be worth investigating.

David

[NickH]

[quote name='Mottlefeeder' post='768480' date='Mar 8 2010, 08:37 PM']There was a post recently where the neck dive was cured by taking a loop of string (or something similar) from the bridge-end button to the player's belt. Assuming it didn't make him sing higher, that might be worth investigating.

David[/quote]

I forsee a horrific accident when returning the bass to it's stage stand at high speed to facilitate (for example) a fast dash to the toilet to recycle the pre-gig curry.
Potential for testicular crunching / mangling / general ouchiness is high

[Mog]

A wider strap should help with the issue. Or you could add another strap botton a little higher up the body. How does the P special sound BTW? was looking at one in vintage cherry with considerable GAS on Saturday.

[BluRay]

[quote name='EskimoBassist' post='767395' date='Mar 7 2010, 10:23 PM']I have an Epiphone Thunderbird, I feel your pain.[/quote]

Epiphone EB3: ditto. I never knew a bass could be so poorly balanced!
Wide leather strap solved it.

[steantval]

[quote name='dos dedos' post='767289' date='Mar 7 2010, 08:47 PM']Hi folks! I wonder if you can help me with a little problem?
As I understand it, my fretting hand shouldn't be supporting any of the weight of the neck.
This is the playing position that feels comfortable to me:
[attachment=44365:bass1.jpg]
And here's what happens when I let go:
[attachment=44366:bass2.jpg]
It's not a [i]massive[/i] problem; I don't have to hold the neck up [i]much[/i], but supporting the weight still makes my left hand much less mobile and so affects my playing. Am I making a fuss about nothing?

If I shorten or lengthen the strap as much as possible, it doesn't really help - the bass still wants to "settle" in that near-horizontal position, and in addition it makes the playing angle more awkward for both hands. The strap I'm using is a fairly slippery nylon job; I thought maybe if I picked up a leather one with a rougher back it might keep the neck up a bit better by stopping the strap sliding over my left shoulder. Does this sound like a good idea?

And finally, is this generally what happens with a Precision shape, or is this one just poorly balanced because it's a cheapo Squier?[/quote]

Top of the serious neck dive category must be the Gibson SG bass, I have to play one and it's terrible, let go and the headstock will hit the floor.

[dos dedos]

Look, no hands! ^_^
[attachment=44960:newstrap.jpg]

So I bought [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/UK-MADE-2-75-WIDE-BIG-SOFTEE-REAL-LEATHER-GUITAR-STRAP_W0QQitemZ350278734646QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Guitar_Accessories?hash=item518e3d5336"]one of these straps[/url]...

[b]Pros:[/b]
[list]
[*] Holds the neck up at a better angle
[*] Comfy on the shoulder
[*] Smells of leather
[/list][b]Cons:[/b]
[list]
[*] Neck angle could be [i]slightly[/i] higher
[*] Pulls at clothing on shoulder - I expected this, and it's not too bad unless I wear something loose
[*] Difficult to use with [url="http://www.jimdunlop.com/index.php?page=products/pip&id=142&pmh=products/accessories"]cheapo strap locks[/url] due to thickness
[/list]Overall it's a success; it hasn't [i]solved[/i] the problem, but it's a definite improvement for a small price. Thanks to bartelby for the recommendation

(Btw, the maximum length is about 51", which is ok for me but might not be enough for taller folks!)

[quote name='Mog' post='768624' date='Mar 8 2010, 10:36 PM']How does the P special sound BTW? was looking at one in vintage cherry with considerable GAS on Saturday.[/quote]
Not sure how well I can answer this, since I've never played anything better to compare it against! The P pickup gives me a nice fat tone for the classics, and the J is hollow enough for indie-type stuff. Sounds good to me!

[4 Strings]

I know this will be an unpopular answer but I've always found Precisions to be neck heavy and find it a bit odd that there seems to be a 'lightness of body' obsession with them at the moment. The heavier ones can sit quite nicely, the lighter ones dip to the neck.

Grippy straps will, as you've found, merely tend to pull your shirt round your neck.

IA solution would be to put another strap button into the back of the bass 3-4 inches from the end of the body to shift the centre of balance to the right, if you don't mind making a little hole in the back of your bass.

Its an irritating problem if you really like the bass otherwise, its one of the first things I look for when trying one out.

[dos dedos]

[quote name='4 Strings' post='778517' date='Mar 18 2010, 01:13 PM']A solution would be to put another strap button into the back of the bass 3-4 inches from the end of the body to shift the centre of balance to the right, if you don't mind making a little hole in the back of your bass.[/quote]
Interesting! I'd never thought about moving the button to the [i]back[/i] of the bass before. I've considered shifting it further along the edge (ie. to the left, when the bass is upright), but to me it'd look unbalanced and kinda ugly - yes, I'm shallow! ^_^ The main reason I switched to my current bass was for the colour and the painted headstock